User talk:Nkuvu/archive 01

Guild Page
Sorry, I didnt realised I had Tagged it twice, generally on the second tag I will leave a note on the talk page but I must have missed your's. It wasn't the content itself in any-way it is the Formatting. The page needs to use the template Here with the guild info-box etc. This is simply to keep all guild pages looking the same. The best way to achieve this is to simply copy and paste the page, then edit it to fit you're guild. I hope you do decide to create you're page, and as for the reason of immediate action, it is simply beceaus the sheer amount of new guild pages we are having since the update, the only way to stay on top of them is deal with them asap. -- ChronicinabilitY  19:35, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * If the info box is required, that should be listed on the guild pages policy page clearly. It's not listed. This wasn't listed in the blanked page. Maybe some day I'll have the patience to try to figure out all the rules associated with creating a guild page, but that won't be today.--Nkuvu 19:41, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Actually it says:


 * Guild pages should not deviate from the style and formatting guideline for guild pages in formatting or content without excellent reasons., thats explains it good enough i think ~ Kurd [[Image:Kurdsig.png]]19:44, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I disagree. "All guild pages must contain the template guild at the top; this template clearly marks the article as a guild article." So if there are other required templates, it should be clear. But whatever. I'm not going to try to edit the page any more.--Nkuvu 19:50, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Added: Also, the bit you quoted is in "Strongly Discouraged" -- which is not something I'd expect for an immediate blank.--Nkuvu 19:51, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry if the current actions drives you away from editing the article. We currently have big discussions going on about this matter, and how to handle it. We are receiving not just alot of edits, but a lot of spam too. And Arenanet did nothing to warn us about this happening (to my knowledge) so we weren't prepared. And you are also right about the policy not being clear enough, there is currently no mention that it has to be formatted after our formatting guide that I can find. I will bring this up on the policy talk page, as we do not want to drive people away, even if it may seem so. - anja  [[Image:User Anja Astor sig icon.png|talk]]  (contribs)  19:56, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Ehm, the link to Guild_Wars_Wiki:Formatting/Guilds is located in Naming and contents, last bullet. But please bear with us, since it is hard to try to keep up with the influx of new guild-pages in this tempo. Clearly the policy needs some tweaks here and there. I really hope you'll try once more! (And again an Edit Conflict, Anja put it nicely in wording.) -- [[Image:User Corrran sig.png|CoRrRan]] (CoRrRan / talk) 19:58, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I apologize for the short temper, but I find it frustrating to try to determine what the rules are here. I've contributed to that other wiki a few times, so I expected to have no issues following the rules here. I read through the policy pages twice, and ran afoul of the guidelines twice... I realize that things are insane, but that's even more reason to have clear guidelines. And again, the Guild_Wars_Wiki:Formatting/Guilds page doesn't say anything about the info-box being required. "Should" is not "must". But I think I may have been reading too many software requirements documents recently. --Nkuvu 20:10, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, what can I say, Arena-net caught us a little bit with our pants down. AFAIK, there was no notice that the ingame-integration was part of the latest patch. We will try to get the guidelines as clear as possible as soon as possible. In the meantime, I still think that it would be nicer for you (and your guild) to have a small page in place in stead of the current bad guild page-template. Just give a really short description, provide the guild- and guild infobox-templates and that should clear the tag. -- [[Image:User Corrran sig.png|CoRrRan]] (CoRrRan / talk) 20:17, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Guild leader had a go at editing the page. Whether it stays up or not... I have no idea, but it seems to have everything required. I have no idea where this next bit should go, so I'll toss it here and hope that the right people see it...

Policy suggestions, ideas, gripes, bleh
Guild_Wars_Wiki:Guild_pages and Guild_Wars_Wiki:Formatting/Guilds have much of the same information. In some places, it's contradictory. The policy page says the guild template must be included. The formatting page says it should be included. Someone explain to me why these pages can't be merged and have the same information on both? I'm sure that there's a reason, I just don't know it.

Also, on the formatting page, it says the guild infobox should be included. (That's really a must, but I think we've established that above) It also says "Contact information should be listed." So if the guild doesn't have a forum, the guild page will be deleted?

And wow, I can't believe how easily I was offended by having a page blanked (twice) with a bad guild page. I am normally a level-headed sort of person, but this really irritated me. In part, I was not sure what part of the guideline was missed/violated/whatever. Pointing me to the guideline and saying "no, you did it wrong" is not very conducive to learning. I'd suggest, rather, pointing to the guideline and saying "you missed this bit, please re-submit with that info there" would be more helpful.

Finally, I took it for granted that the person who was blanking the guild page had a right to do so. Err, maybe not a "right" so much as a "good idea that this is the way it should be done." But really, with how fast it was blanked and without any notification, it almost seemed like someone was deliberately trying to mess with my head. I suppose I could look at contributions for the user, but I'd like some way to see that this is accurate editing. I don't know how this would work, really. On forums, I can see that "oh hey, this person is a moderator" but here on a wiki all users are equal except for the ones who aren't. Hopefully I've explained my concern well enough, even if I don't have a good suggestion here.

( --Nkuvu 01:21, 26 May 2007 (UTC) for this whole section, except for possible future alterations by others who will, of course, sign things and make it clear, I'm just in a nitpicky mood, so don't mind this disclaimer)
 * Thank you for bringing this up. It would appear that the policy and the formatting guidelines have quite a lot of overlap and inconsistencies. I'll go over there and try to propose something. -- ab.er. rant [[Image:User Ab.er.rant Sig.png|sig]] 09:16, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I am not sure I made it clear, so I'll just add this bit. I feel that I handled the whole situation... less than gracefully. For that I wanted to apologize.


 * I do really appreciate the work that's been going on in this area -- I'm aware of the new guild cleanup template, and thoroughly prefer that approach to just blank-and-tag with 'bad guild.' As I mentioned, I have some experience with that other wiki, so I knew that the guild page was available in the history. But of course because I didn't know why it had been blanked (even after re-reading the guidelines), that would have just been pointless. The reason field in the cleanup template is perfect, I think. So hopefully my ranting and raving like a lunatic have some positive effect, even if I could have been more calm on the subject. --Nkuvu 20:51, 29 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Well, being less calm you gave this a kick start (or a big help forward), so imho you shouldn't feel too bad about it :) - anja  [[Image:User Anja Astor sig icon.png|talk]]  (contribs)  20:54, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Userbox Category: Users_who_play_in_International_Districts
I have no idea if this is where to write this (OMG so lost). N! I need you to please peek at my userpage and tell me how to fix the International User business to properly include a category. I don't think one exists yet. It's just a little irksome how hard it is to find info for the average dummy about making such things. Though, I wouldn't be surprised if the info IS out there, but not knowing what/how to look for it isn't helping my case much. Thanks in advance! And sorry if I just slapped this somewhere it doesn't belong. eep -- --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Bear.
 * No, there isn't an international category. You can take a peek at the "Users_by_territory" category which shows that there's North American and European defined. As far as creating a new one... I'm not sure. Not even sure where you'd ask how to make a new category. --Nkuvu [[Image:User_Nkuvu_sig_button.jpg]] 02:27, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * If you want to link to a category, instead of categorising a page you need to use an extra colon at the start of the link like this Category:Fun n stuff -- Lemming64 02:30, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks -- I knew there had to be some way to do it. Can you answer the question about the creation of a category? Territory isn't quite right, now that I think about it. And Bear, if you want the text in the userbox to be visible, add "info=" before the "This user hides" text. I know that much, at least. --Nkuvu [[Image:User_Nkuvu_sig_button.jpg]] 02:33, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Thank you for that! All I need now is to figure out how to include a link to this category in that userbox. N, you made jinx a nifty little stub/userbox, with the shortcut business. How did you do that? If I put the code I created for the international districts into the Category page, will that then spawn shortcut wiki-code (I'm so not hip to technical jargon here) for anyone to use? -- --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Bear.
 * psst, sign yer comments using the four tildes (there's also a button above the edit box, second from the right).


 * Note that Lemming64 was referring to links in text. So if I put Category:Users_by_territory it turns into Category:Users_by_territory. This isn't what you'll want for the userbox, though. The difference is that if I leave off that initial colon, then this page gets added to the "Users_by_territory" category, which is certainly wrong.


 * For the guild template thing, I created a new subpage. Basically typed in User:Nkuvu/jinx and previewed the page. That showed up as a red link. I clicked on that to make the new page, and added the userbox code. You already have that bit on your page, so you'd just copy it to a template. Then you just include it using the curly brackets. Note that mine was a little tricky since I wanted to have replaceable text, but the one you're making should be straightforward enough. If you'd like, let me know what you want to call it and I can make the template for you. --Nkuvu [[Image:User_Nkuvu_sig_button.jpg]] 03:03, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I tried a few slight variations to have my text 'User who hides from Home Districts' appear as a link to the User_who_plays_in_International_Districts category, intending to then create that category, but no luck. I did have the category page appear with the options to edit it, but it didn't stick when I tried to do so. As for your instructions, I was following okay until 'copy it to a template'.  I've no idea what you mean by that. Please feel free to do whatever you think necessary to make it work, and I'll try to follow histories or peek at code to see how you do it. jinx 03:18, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Made a new template for the userbox: Toss that into a page and you'll get the userbox. It still doesn't answer the category bit, but at least the template part is answered. --Nkuvu [[Image:User_Nkuvu_sig_button.jpg]] 03:30, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * To "create" a category, just categorize one or more pages into it - the category is created automatically. The "article" of that category is actually just an additional description that can be added to the category - once an article is categorized into it, just click on the red category name at the bottom of the categorized article to edit the category's page. Since you don't want the userbox template itself to get put into the category, you put the category inside tags, thus the category only shows up on pages the template is included into. I've modified your User_Int template as an example, Nkuvu. [[Image:User Aiiane-a.gif|Go to Aiiane's Talk page]] (Aiiane - talk - contribs) 03:33, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Bear mentioned that she did edit the category, but it didn't stick. Not enough glue, perhaps. ~_^ I also know that there was some discussion on new categories, but for the life of me can't remember where it was. And oh -- here I thought the includeonly meant "only include this code" as opposed to "only use this code when this is included." Neat. Thanks for the help (again) --Nkuvu [[Image:User_Nkuvu_sig_button.jpg]] 03:41, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

(reset indent) I went and updated Bear's userpage to use your template, rather than the hard-coded userbox it has been. Bear's userpage is now categorized into the currently non-article category, as you can note by the red link at the bottom of the page in the categories section. Feel free to have Bear try editing the category page from there - it should stick if saved. (Aiiane - talk - contribs) 03:55, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Thank you again! I'm very new to this wiki stuff, so I'm turning in circles a lot, I think.  I'm not 100% certain I'm even replying to messages correctly in here. jinx 04:07, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * So far as I can tell, you're doing just fine. :) [[Image:User Aiiane-a.gif|Go to Aiiane's Talk page]] (Aiiane - talk - contribs) 04:08, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I do believe I just made a category! Is it appropriate to put thanks to people who helped me figure it out, or is that a bit off-topic?
 * Probably a bit offtopic, since the category isn't really "yours", even though you were the initial creator of it. :) [[Image:User Aiiane-a.gif|Go to Aiiane's Talk page]] (Aiiane - talk - contribs) 04:23, 11 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Hey! I noticed the orphan "international district" category, but without noticing that there was a whole discussion going on here I went ahead and put it in the general Category:Users hierarchy. It is now listed under the Category:Users by territory category. Hope that is ok, otherwise just move it to where you think would be appropriate. Also, I am not sure if you want your userbox to be the default userbox? If so, it can be saved as a User Int or something.--Lensor 15:14, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Me again! Went ahead and saved the userbox into the User International template, hope it was ok. Also added a link to the template to the Category:Users who play in international districts category. If you want to change the parent category (in stead of the Category:Users by territory, just edit the corresponding link in the category description. (also changed the category name to comply with the Wiki lower-case policy). --Lensor 15:43, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * -blink- I'll just pretend like I understood what you just said, then nod and smile. -nods and smiles- It looks like the User International userbox has a few extra ]] in the includeonly section, though. Yes? --Nkuvu [[Image:User_Nkuvu_sig_button.jpg]] 17:55, 12 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Sorry, yes it had. Happened when I pasted in the "pagename" part (makes sure users are sorted according to name, not just under "u" for "user"). Fixed it now :) --Lensor 07:16, 13 June 2007 (UTC). Oh, yes, I figured out what was looking funny with the userbox, it was the category that was written in there. As I can read above you were trying to get the actual text in the box to link to the international category, yes? The way to do that is to write the text just as it were normal wiki code, like this: "This user hides from Home Districts", which will turn out like this: "This user hides from Home Districts". I changed the userbox so you can see how it works. :) --Lensor 07:58, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Lensor! I've been tweaking about with some of your templates, which I'm seriously adoring. I've come across a snag due to lack of wiki-smarts, though.  I can't for the life of me find how to include a background image in the style, so I have something in the background of what used to be class=skill-box.  My page is a jumbled mess at the moment, but I'll save it 'as is', if you wouldn't mind looking under the hood and seeing what I've done wrong? I am so at a loss! -sad face-  (oops.. -adds sign thing-) Bear 09:55, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks :) To be honest, neither can I. :/ Therefore I got great help from Thulsey to get that bit sorted. I think in my template (and Thulsey's) the background image is already defined in the class=skill box bit, not sure how to edit that.--Lensor 10:21, 13 June 2007 (UTC) Add: It has to do with CSS's (cascading style sheets), of which I dont know that much. --Lensor 10:32, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks a bunch for taking a look at it, I appreciate that. :) I'll get to work trawling google and such and see if I can find a way.  It wouldn't mean the end of the world if I couldn't, but I've got my heart set on it now!Bear 11:20, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure that the link from user to category was intended. There was discussion on how to make a link to a category, but that was in regards to this talk page (poke in the history and you can see where I had a link that categorized my talk page). But I'll let Bear decide that -- go to User International and tweak it to what you want. --Nkuvu [[Image:User_Nkuvu_sig_button.jpg]] 14:03, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the offer to help
Hi Nkuvu, I just wanted to say thanks. My image resizing problem will be probably solved soon. Shortly after I wrote my question about that, I caught a guildie ingame, who is one of the creators of those character tables. He promptly offered me the help too, which I accepted. That was before I saw your message at Lensor's talk page. So, just thanks again for the offer. -- --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Arcane Guardian.
 * No problem. Image cropping really isn't hard. For example, I'm using Photoshop Elements (it's the "lite" version of Photoshop that came with my scanner). Just use the rectangular select tool, then in the Image menu, choose Crop. Poof, done. (And of course you can Undo if you decide it doesn't look quite right) If you're using something like MS Paint, then select the part of the image you want, then copy. Paste into a new image, save.
 * In any case, glad to hear it's being sorted out for you. --Nkuvu [[Image:User_Nkuvu_sig_button.jpg]] 15:00, 12 June 2007 (UTC)