Talk:Energetic Was Lee Sa

Skill Tweaks 07/26/07

 * Energetic Was Lee Sa: 30r -> 20r please discuss new skill changes here. ~Izzy @-&#39; 23:19, 26 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Weak. With all the drawbacks of Items spells (loss of weaponry, long cast) you'd expect that an Item spell that is designed to be used as E-management can actually get you some serious energy. At 14 Spawning Power this skill nets you 8 energy. I don't know how you're expecting a Ritualist to invest into this medicore skill attribute to get weak E-management. Living Parasite 07:34, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
 * It could be good if either the initial energy cost was dropped to 5, or if the skill allows to gain +3 energy regeneration instead of +2. (Trouveur 09:19, 27 July 2007 (UTC))
 * I agree, 5 energy cost would make it much better. The duration should last the full 20 second recharge time at 15 Spawning Power at the minimum - which Channeling Ritualists will not have anyway. --Longasc 12:02, 27 July 2007 (UTC)


 * The problem with Ritualist skills is that weapon and item spells have opportunity cost to them. You can have one or the other but not both. The problem with this skill is that the benefit of carrying this item spell does not outweigh the cost of not carrying life saver items like Generous was Tsungrai, Mighty was Vorizun, and Protective was Kaolai. The downside of this skill is that it will not be useful unless spawning is very high. It would be better to scale this skill so that energy gain per additional attribute is high with low attributes in Spawning and low with high attributes. The problem with item spells that require you to drop the ash is that you need to drop the ash before the timer runs out or you do not get any gains like what is currently happening with Tsungrai and Kaolai. The only way I can think of using this is if I am running a Weapon of Remedy/Vengeful Weapon build with Renewing Memories and maybe the protective Ritual Lord build. At this time I would say I would not use this skill at all just because casting time is 2 seconds for every 20 seconds. It is too easy to interrupt. I would prefer to invest some points in Inspiration line and use those non elite energy management skills. You can easily gain 20-30 energy with Auspicious Incantation every 25 seconds (even less time if you use inspiration wand and offhand that reduce rechage together).--Shadetz X 02:25, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

I still do not see the point of this skill, unless its purpose is to provide Ritualists with an Item Spell that works out free overall ? Even for a non-Elite, it just strikes me as way too unambitious - anyone sufficiently desperate for E-management & with such a high investment in Spawning Power ( high SP = high other Rt attribute ) surely has a spare secondary they can use to put something more worthwhile like GoLE on their bar, thus keeping their hands free for a 'proper' Item Spell ?

It sucks. Ritualists have bigger problems than energy management. I can only have one ashes, and quite honestly, just about any ashes beat these. Except Xinrai of course, nothing beats that skill in suckyness constest :) Servant of Kali 23:30, 24 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Everyone compares this to Essence Strike which is silly because Spawning Power is the rit primary attribute and Essence Strike is simply a channeling spell, one of 4 schools rits come with. What about rit lords? I always wanted an energy management skill for my rit lord aside from Boon of Creation and this is perfect. I've also run this in my restoration build and I have no more energy problems. Sure the skill is a little weak on the energy regain side of things but it comes in the rit schools, it applies to any skills, not just spells like the common glyph of lesser and it's not elite allowing you to bring any elite you want, if only there was a restoration elite worth using. Dancing Gnome 02:15, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I've tried using this with my Ritualist with Ritual Lord in place of Boon of Creation and in conjunction with it. It can not substitute it, but it will function somewhat in conjunction with it, but Mighty Was Vorizun is still a bad item spell choice for that kind of thing. Additional armor and easy to keep up. 72.81.247.139 20:35, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I think i wouldn't use this one even on a SoI Me/Rt. Eth 13:47, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The biggest problem with every item skill is that they were designed to play one way, rits proved to be an ill-concepted class, and everything else got reworked. You can actually use this skill NOW pretty effectively, except that the skills that synergize with it all suck.
 * No single skill can be changed to make rits a balanced class, they just need a full rework. ~Shard  [[Image:User Shard Sig Icon.png]] 23:19, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

Oh! Now I get it!
It's suppose to say "energetic was Lyssa!"
 * "Oh Snap!" Fox007  [[Image:User Fox007 sig4.jpg|19px|User:Fox007]] 17:08, 12 April 2011 (UTC)

Energy per Second

 * At SP 0: -.257
 * At SP 12: .303
 * At SP 14: .378
 * At SP 16: .530

Backsword 13:18, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Tweaked Version Feedback 07/26/07
This skill looks alot better now. You Gain 21-24 energy now at rank 12-13 ish every 60 seconds, which for straight energy is on par with Essence Strike, at 21 energy at a similar rank. You could argue that the damage Essence Strike does makes it still better than this skill, but the argument isn't clear cut in its favor any more. Of course Essence still kills at high levels. Its similar to Spirit Channeling in the same line which gains 24 energy in 60 seconds. Seems decently balanced now to me. Aksharack 02:12, 27 July 2007 (UTC)


 * You Gain 27 energy now at rank 12-13 ish? You did wrong math, +2 regen for 13 secs you gain 13*2/3 = 8.6, drop +8, and it cost you 10 to cast, net gain = 8.6+8-10 = 6.6 if you time it perfectly.--Hydralisk mk2 06:47, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
 * your right, I have corrected my numbers. Aksharack 13:03, 27 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Already much better, but i'm still a little annoyed with the fact that you have an Ashpot you can't keep in hands all the time (or nearly anyway). I'd rather see its duration extended to 5..17..21 sec and lowering the energy you get when it's dropped so that the total energy gained is the same but you have the option of keeping it a bit longer if you need it to power spells with an ashpot. Patccmoi 02:22, 27 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Much much much better Izzy. This skill is a very nice addition to Wielder's Boon Ritualists.LordSojar 06:44, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Original skill feedback
this seems like it'd be good to counter itself, sort of. I mean, when you use a pot you lose energy bonuses, so this helps you with that...I suppose also useful for those "when holding an item" spells.


 * As max energy will change as much when you hold an item, the gap to max energy will remain the same when activated. Backsword 23:53, 20 July 2007 (UTC)
 * The skill icon for this skill looks like the asian version of the older Gwen, anyway this plus empowerment would be a great combo

I KNOW there's someone on the dev team named Lisa who drinks like five red bulls before coming into work... >.> There just has to be. Coffee would count too. 71.141.110.230 08:39, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

This skill actually needs a buff. At spawning power 12, you only gain 7 Energy, all 30 seconds. That's bad and it is linkes to spaening power - an attribute that hardy anyone ever specced very high... Also: As long as you have it in your hands, you lose all benefits of your weapon+offhand item..


 * Heh, I may be mistaken, but from the Nightfall making off DVD, Lisa is not a developer - she's the person in charge of taking care of everyone in the building, solving all kinds of general problems, ordering food for the guys who are too absent minded to remember to eat, and things like that. I think someone mentioned she's like the "mother" of everyone at Arena Net (huge apologizes if I'm thinking about the wrong person : D). Erasculio 13:33, 21 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Officemothers are a fairly common concept in geekcompanies.


 * ...that's a rude generalization. Anyway. So the energy gain is something around 9.9 after 15 seconds at rank 15? The 30 second recharge is a turnoff. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Terra Xin.
 * Rude? I don't think there's anything wrong with them, as you seem to assume.Backsword 12:09, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Just goes to show you that people will be offended by anything you say, even if you say mother. Lou-Saydus 19:05, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Hey everyone - this is Lisa, the Office Manager at ArenaNet. I actually don't mind being called 'The Office Mom' at all. I love taking care of everyone and making sure they are fueled up to create the best games for you all! Lisa lafay 20:47, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

This looks like good e-denial defense. :O --Redfeather 13:23, 21 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't think it's worth a skill slot though for e-denial, unless you're using skills that require an item spell and can't weapon swap. I don't see this skill getting use, it's ~1 pip of energy regen, 2s cast, and in Spawning. I prefer Essence Strike in most cases. skaspaakssa 13:37, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

This is not an elite skill so I don't think anyone should be expecting that great of e-mgmt. That being said, this skill does seem to work well with Caretaker's Charge, Soothing Memories, Empowerment, Renewing Memories and Renewing Surge.
 * With the exception that it's up only 15/30 seconds, and even if it did last the whole duration, a 2 second cast is pretty easy to interrupt, so it wouldn't be practical. No matter how you slice it, you'll need a second urn.--Skye Marin 06:59, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

At 13 Spawning you gain 8 energy. Essence strike at the same rank gains 9 energy over 30 seconds. Over 60 seconds you get 18 energy from EwLS, while you get 21 energy from Essence and 378 damage on top of that. EwSL just doesn't look like a good alternative. I like the idea, though, and it does have the plus side of not having a spirit req like essence. The duration should be tweaked to bring it more in line with essence energy gain wise. That or a cost reduction Aksharack 04:19, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

I think that it at least needs to allow to be kept at all time. Because if you use an ashpot in your build, and you want to meet the req for other skills like Channeled Strike, Soothing Memories, etc., you just need a reliable way to keep that Ashpot in hands. This already has a 2s cast, which is bad enough for 'reliability'. It really needs to be maintainable. I think the overall energy added should be something around 1.5 pips/second, which is fairly standard for pure, non-elite emanagement skills. So something like 15/2/30, for 5..29..37 seconds you hold ashes and gain 2 pips/second. When it ends, you gain 5..10..11E. So at 12 Spawning, you could more or less have it on at all time, and you'd gain a net energy of 14.4, every 30s, which is about as good as GoLE on non-ele (which seems fair, since Rt skills aren't overpriced to compensate for attunements, estorage, etc.). It gives you an ashpot to cover for other skills, but it also has a risk of being interrupted and a high cost to activate so you don't wanna screw it up. Personally i'd actually lower the cast time to 1s too, it's still interruptable if they look for it but not that easy. And come on, Lisa deserves a worthy skill =p Patccmoi 21:49, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Energy per Second
If my math is correct, this seems somewhat weak, especially at lower levels. That would be due to both variable increasing with the attribute.

-0,177 sec @ SP 0; 0,208 sec @ SP 12; 0,365 sec @ SP 16. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Backsword.

Spirit channeling would work with this!

Icon
Lisa also has a very bright smile! --Longasc 11:47, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * She must use trident toothpaste. - Auron 11:49, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * LOL. She sure looks energetic.... but also very very ebil. :o ~ [[Image:User Buttermilk Buttermilksig.png]] Buttermilk  18:41, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Reminds me of the Orbit Gum commercials. xD Xitoahc 18:58, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
 * She must be really good in bed. -- User Halogod35 Sig.png Halogod35  22:33, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Name
The Mesmer henchman in Factions (?) is Li Sah, I think. Pronounced the same way as Lee Sa. Nhnowell 15:54, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I think you mean Lo Sha? Lou-Saydus 19:06, 24 July 2007 (UTC)


 * I did find this tho Captain Li Sah --Lou-Saydus[[image:User Lou-Saydus Hail Storm.jpg|19px]] 19:51, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

E managment
omg lol i dont care what anyone here says, this skill is so broken lmao. you can easily spam spirits with this and rit lord, add in boon of creation and you're unstoppable. Because spirits have such a huge range you just sit in the back and spam away w/o any worry on your energy. but yeah you have to invest a LOT into spawning power to use it effectivly. but if you do 12 in spawn and 12 in communing you're fine. --Lou-Saydus 20:59, 6 September 2007 (UTC)


 * 12 spawning power = about 8 energy gained every 22 secs. Not worth it in my books, i'd just bring a low-spec powerdrain.. &mdash; Skuld 21:31, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
 * spawning power > secondary + stats into another line + interrupt. For the same effect, not to mention you're holding an item which helps one or two rit skills. --Lou-Saydus[[image:User Lou-Saydus Hail Storm.jpg|19px]] 08:46, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
 * .....no. The net energy gain from this skill is practically useless. 6 points in inspiration for power drain nets AS MUCH energy as this skill with 12 points and it gives you the energy instantly. This skill also has a 2 second cast time which is definite interrupt fodder. Spirit spam is broken, not this crappy skill. 168.28.136.14 22:35, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Like most skills for the Ritualist in EOTN, yes.--ShadowFog 04:24, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

Heroes
Heroes are completely incapable of using this skill effectively. Out of combat they hold it until the full duration runs out, which helps prepare the battlefield with spirits before pulling. However, in combat they drop it immediately after spawning, perhaps because of the energy gap of having lost use of their weapons, which takes them below 0 energy, and so they must immediately drop Lee Sa to regain some. In the end all that happens is they waste 2 seconds losing 1 energy. I would also strongly appreciate a slight buff. Perhaps a decreased initial energy cost, or a duration buff would make this item a great alternative to the more commonly used ones, but I can understand the fear of renewing surge spam, and similar tactics. Discomb 23:04, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

Small tweak
Make it 1 cast and 5 energy and it would be fine. Needs it because it can only be used by primary Ritualits. J ustin  6   07:32, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

Clamoring for the January update
With the change to Clamor anyone else think that these 2 skills might work together well? Haven't tried it out yet wonderin' if anyone else has. Weaponmaster 02:21, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * use it with any other item spell and it works well. Fox007  [[Image:User Fox007 sig2.png|19px|User:Fox007]] 11:37, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Clamor of Souls does too low of damage for an AoE spell and too high of a recharge for a low damage AoE spell. Clamor doesn't goe nice with this. --ShadowFog 16:15, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Trivia
Call me crazy, but I don't think the skill name is alluding to Lyssa--especially not when it expects you to pronounce "Lyssa" in a foreign language. Plenty of GW skills have a god's name; if anything, this sounds more like an in-joke about an Arenanet employee named Lisa. I'm going to go ahead and remove the trivia if there are no objections. 404notfound 22:22, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
 * 100% of the posted "trivia" is rubbish at the moment. "Lee Sa" was named after Lisa, the office mom.  Feel free to search the wiki, the answer is there (and Lisa posted, as well, talking about her office mom-dom, and how she didn't mind the term).  The Trivia for this section is completely pointless and made-up (as quite a bit of the "trivia" is at this wiki).  --Mystisteel 22:55, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Agreed that the "trivia" on this wiki is complete rubbish. I generally just delete it. Green Arrow 21:14, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

Net Energy Gain chart
if anyone wants to put this in there, here's a chart showing the net gain from use, assuming it is not dropped early. --pyroxide 20:35, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Not bad at all
Okay guys, firstly, spawning power doesnt suck, there are three reasonable uses to it

1:i use it in a VERY good working aoe prot build

2:the weaponspammer of course

3:Spirit's Gift, Explosive Growth and Boon of Creation spirit spammers

secondly, we have Ghostly Haste in the same attribute. As i use 15 Spawning and always have spirits around me, this is maintainable (its normal recharge is now 20), which is good for some conditionable spells AND gives me an extra 2 pips of energy(cast cost=energy gained when dropped)which means that i have 50% more energy to use (we have 4 pips) VALAR
 * I agree with Valar. When used at the right time this skill really keeps your energy up.  I use this in PVP as my energy management and it quite easily keeps my energy on the full side.  Consider using this skill before you need energy desperately.  I usually cast this before Recuperation or big spells and allow the regen to work when the cast time is in effect.  If the worst happens and you need energy now you can always drop and get your energy gain from spell as well as benefit from weapons.  Usually at the end of this skills durration while i've been using skills i end with a little less than full energy.  Yukiro 08:16 (UTC) 7 October 2009

Is this worth a skill slot?
For not enough time to be maintainable without wasting a second skill slot, you net you a total of less than what Soul Reaping gives without wasting a skill slot Energy. Soul reaping also triggers three times as much in the same time period. And actually has useful elites. Moo Kitty 19:27, 1 September 2009 (UTC)
 * You forgot it Soul Reapin doesn't use a skill slot but does need kills. And depending on what you play it is easy / hard to get those kills. Fox007  [[Image:User Fox007 sig4.png|19px|User:Fox007]] 13:51, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Incorrect Note?
According to the page on it, +2 energy regeneration nets you 2 energy every 3 seconds. This says you net 2 energy after five seconds with just the regeneration at 0 Spawning, however the skill costs 10 energy. Doing the actual math:

5(second duration * (2/3)(energy gained per second) - 10 (initial cost) = -6 2/3 energy. I'm not sure how the person came up with a two energy gain, but even with the 1 energy drop, you're still losing a massive amount of energy at 0 Spawning.  Unless I'm doing something wrong, I believe the note should be removed/reworded.  PowerGamer 22:03, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
 * The person who edited it probably did not take into account the duration being tied to Spawning Power. However, even with 0 spawning, you still get 1 energy when you drop the ashes, so you get -5 2/3 at 0 spawning, 6 2/3 at 12 spawning, and 10 at 15 spawning.  Koda  [[Image:User_Koda_Kumi_UT.jpeg‎|19px]]  Kumi  22:23, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
 * So, since the note is incorrect in both its numbers and in the fact that it says net. It should be removed then.  Doing so now.  PowerGamer 23:56, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I took a look at the history of the page, and the original poster stated that 15 seconds of +2 regen is 10 energy. Someone else added the "net" in there after, which is what made the statement incorrect.  That second person also added in the 2 (which should be 3 1/3) for the initial energy amount.  I might reimplement the note later or a scale of actual net energy could be added to the page.  PowerGamer 00:57, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
 * The note was (partially) correct @ 0 spawning power you get 1e from the regen and 1 by dropping it. the 10e came from the total regen + dropping gain - the skill cost. so one of these would be the correct note.
 * Depending on your rank in Spawning Power, this skill will give you a total of Energy.
 * Depending on your rank in Spawning Power, this skill will net you a total of Energy.
 * Fox007  [[Image:User Fox007 sig4.jpg|19px|User:Fox007]] 11:13, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

Xandra
uses this just fine. Must have been an AI update because she holds it full duration. Infact it seems like anytime she isnt at full energy (aka very first spell) she will use this spell in or out of combat. Justice 21:17, 6 August 2010 (UTC)


 * she does imediatly drop it... If at low energy and she manages to cast this 10e skill she will drop it instantly. Above, at my best guess, 50% she will hold it. Im thinking the AI is meant to hold this for its regen value but drop it in a pinch for its energy gain. AI made too smart ruins staple skills like this. +2ER > +9e even when you hit the bottom of your energy pool. Justice 00:46, 7 August 2010 (UTC)


 * My Razah is standing there casting EwLS over and over at full energy, effectively losing himself 15 energy each time >< Tong2 21:08, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

New note
Seems redundant, imho. Auto drop when full duration is obvious. -- Large 15:47, 22 March 2011 (UTC)