Talk:The Villainy of Galrath

Galrath is level 20--68.17.202.188 20:06, 11 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I added a walk through, a map, and the reward dialogue for the quest, is that enough to take down the warning? Kypp Duron 00:44, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
 * The article itself is missing an overview, so the stub warning should stay up. --Sktbrd341 00:49, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks! i am painfully new at this. Kypp Duron 00:57, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Well it looks like you did a good job adding information to this quest article. Let me point you over to this Guild wiki project Quest Project it lists all of the quests in the game and which quest articles have been completed. Feel free to help out on the project. If you have any questions about editing the wiki, drop me a comment on my talk page. --Sktbrd341 01:00, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Hey I found a bug. If you go to turn in quest and your inventory is full, He will as normal tell you to clear inventory. If you go to your xunlai and drop something off and then go back to the reward give, he will give you the quest again. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:75.30.201.68.
 * Reporting it to linsey ~ Kurd [[Image:Kurdsig.png]] 21:39, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

What was his 'villainy'?
Just what was Galrath doing that earned a death warrant? Is staring at Wizard's Tower now a crime? The quest doesn't really say what he was doing wrong, besides SUPPOSEDLY trying to unlock what was inside the tower. I mean, what if he was a political opponent? Whats going on here?! Counciler 07:28, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah, this has always seemed like the follow-up to another quest, but I don't know. --Valentein 05:03, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Fair point, you could feel a bit worried about carrying out arbitrary executions for a foreign power - why didn't a Krytan kill him? :P --Son of Batman 10:04, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

important note
the group right outside his little hill and the group containing himself and him bandits are agressive to eachother I ran there with a R/Mo basic running build and no offensive skills and dispatched of him easily by pulling him into the verata mob. this is faster and easier than fighting your way there with H/h or a party. just leave temple of ages solo and run there66.66.95.26 17:46, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
 * actually running there with an assassin and teleporting up to galrath works even better, you can completely avoid all verata's guys and just solofarm him =) but teleporting up only works at the right place, iirc the first group won't work for teleporting. --83.78.176.155 14:29, 3 January 2010 (UTC)
 * I found that teleporting does work on the first group: what doesn't work is shadow stepping. So bring Consume Corpse instead of Death's Charge and you should be fine. --Mme. Donelle 15:46, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

page obsolete now
This page now needs major rewrite since update has changed it to Difficulty: Master, and now gives 30,000 XP and 5 platinum. Haven't tried it yet but I assume its harder now. Ah... turns out there are two versions. If your character has not done it you get the old one, if you have already done it you get the harder version. Now we need two pages? Ramei Arashi 23:04, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
 * The new version is actually meant for hard mode. The text just wasn't updated apparently.--[[Image:User Pyron Sy sig.png|19px| ]] Pyron Sy 23:15, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I wasn't in HM when I got the new version when I was on toon that already did old version. When I got it with toon that's new to LA it was the old version offered even if I switched to HM. Ramei Arashi 23:40, 28 April 2011 (UTC)

Interesting, went to check out the new quest, with an active WiK bounty in the area, and Galrath just didn't seem to spawn..Was in NM though. 194.254.55.156 23:53, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
 * The quest isn't active unless you're in HM. Don't know if he's affected by WiK spawns though.--[[Image:User Pyron Sy sig.png|19px| ]] Pyron Sy 23:56, 28 April 2011 (UTC)

He is not affected by WiK. Took him down in HM with WiK quests active. ( You will have to fight through WiK spawns to get to him however ) ~ Almighty Ancalagon ~ 00:38, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Awe
I'm in awe of these mobs in the HM version - Jagged spammers, infuse HB, VoR - its like the perfect balance HM mob. -- Chieftain  Alex 00:05, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Also the local bandits fight the Galrath mob. --[[Image:User_Chieftain_Alex_Chieftain Signature.png]] Chieftain  Alex 00:06, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Whats the reward for HM? --Jimmer123 00:09, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * 30k exp/5plat--TahiriVeila 00:12, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * - Healer's Boon, Infuse, Dwayna's Kiss, Patient Spirit, Pdrain, Channeling - Tend do play "infuse-pingpong" with other monks in range
 * - WoTA, Jagged, FF,Death Blossom, Rez signet
 * / - VoR, Backfire, Empathy, Drain Enchantment, Flesh of my Flesh,Pdrain, Diversion
 * - Faintheartedness, Rend, Lingering Curse, Glyph of Lesser Energy,Foesward Rez signet
 * (Galrath) - 100b, Lion's comfort, ward against foes,Great Justice --[[Image:User_Chieftain_Alex_Chieftain Signature.png]] Chieftain  Alex 00:13, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * The Monks have Cure Hex as well.(marsc 00:33, 29 April 2011 (UTC))

As ANET has stated that this is the first of many "Hard Mode" quests. Should a new page for said quests be created? Also, does anyone know the rate at which we will be seeing this quests? ( aka a Zaishen style release format )

Monks also have channeling and Pdrain, looks totally like the old HB HA bar. Necros have grasping&ward against foes, meta HA bar too. Mesmers have 20 in domination magic (VoR hitting for 120 damage) Keep the sins down, they're pretty squishy, they'll rez a couple of times but who cares, FS can help a lot. Eventually every mob will go boom after a couple of kills. 194.254.55.156 00:45, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * There's also mantra of concentration and diversion on the mesmers, as well as suffering on the necromancers. Galrath, in addition to the skills already noted, has ward against foes, bonetti's defense, and galrath slash. 71.31.145.32 03:26, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Two pages or one?
Now that we know we'll be seeing new HM quest versions for several quests, should we split the pages?
 * The primary advantage is that we can distinguish the foes/skills/levels and walkthrough without worrying about anyone getting confused.
 * The primary disadvantage (of splitting) is that ppls looking for info on the HM version would have to follow another link.

I think, on the whole, the benefits outweigh the costs (and, I say this as someone who prefers not to split pages usually). If we do split, I recommend the following convention: And an appropriate disambiguation note to cover the switcheroo. — Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 00:44, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Normal: [Quest Name]
 * Hard mode: [Quest Name (hard mode)]
 * Firstly, I'd suggest moving this to a more general location since this will not be the only quest given a HM-only version. Secondly, I'd like to expand this discussion to include involved NPCs (for instance, Galrath).
 * Secondly, I'm on the fence for splitting, but distinctions need to be made for these pages:
 * There are now effectively two ways to do these quests in Hard Mode. For the case of the quests - you can do the original form in HM, then the new form in HM, and get completely different quests (challenge and mechanically speaking).
 * Likewise for Galrath, you get a NPC that appears in the normal version, which was [ already documented] but you get the new version. The issue with the former is that people have replaced the old documentation with the new documentation as if it is impossible to get a level 29 Galrath in Hard Mode - which is not the case.
 * As such, we need to figure out how we want to denote the differences. I personally would disagree with splitting, but splitting would make documentation so much cleaner and less cluttered hence why I am on the fence. For the time being, I have replaced the old Galrath-in-HM information and put the new levels and such separate (for instance, putting the HM-only quest level in brackets instead of parentheses), as that seems most logical until consensus (no reason to remove correct documentation). -- Konig / talk 00:52, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * I'd move this to a new location... but I can't think of a better one at the moment. Konig: what do you like better about not splitting? (And why didn't anyone at the TK suggest an alternative naming convention? now we have Regular Quest, Regular Quest in HM, and Hard Mode quest in HM. Couldn't they have renamed it, "Hard Hard Mode" or something less ambiguous? How about Stumme Mode?) — Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 00:59, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I vote we name the new quest Villainy of Galrath II: Electric Boogaloo.
 * In all seriousness, two pages makes more sense. They're different entries in the quest log, with different requirements, and different rewards on completion. Completely separate quests in terms of game logic, they just share a name and objective. Then again, the same argument could be made for the two Thackerays, but instead we have his current behemoth of a merged page. 96.33.173.168 01:19, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Fun fact: Stumme said (most likely jokingly) that he was going to change text a bit, obviously such didn't occur. What I like about not splitting is that it keeps things in one place. I'd rather not have a repeat of Gwen where we had multiple pages for one character (albeit 2 NPCs), and wanting more. Non-generic NPCs I see no reason to split, and generic NPCs should only be split for different professions. For the quest... All it really needs is a new section under reward, walkthrough, and NPCs to denote the differences, everything else is the same so ~80% of the quest page is unchanged. What we could do, if a split is desired, is make the HM-only quest version a subpage, e.g., The Villainy of Galrath/hard mode . -- Konig / talk 01:22, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, I think we'll end up splitting, but, until we do, let's do everything we can to distinguish Ordinary, Ordinary HM, and Electric Boogaloo ( AKA Hard+Hard Mode). Our ordinary convention for NPC levels won't work: we will need something like Galrath 20 (29) [40].


 * We can do the walkthrough similar to how we do bonuses for missions: one walkthrough for Ordinary (with a subsection for HM notes) and another for H+HM. The rewards can mebbe be done similarly to how we do dungeons (there's only Ordinary and H+HM). As Konig suggests, the other details are the same. — Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 02:41, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * I think its already split. When I was doing this quest and checked it thought the link in help panel I was redirected to different page than this one. It was .../wiki/Game_link:Quest_1328 178.36.189.30 03:03, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * I say we split. to make the difference between normal mode quests in hardmode and hardmode quests more visable I suggest a warning note (like spoiler, future content .etc) at the top with both a link to the hard mode page and a page explaining what the difference is. Further I would suggest to make a note on the hard mode quest page. Warning template could say something like "Warning, this page is about the normal mode quest. for the quest only available in hardmode click here (with here linking to it). What are hardmode quests? (hardmode quests clickable). Rumian 09:19, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * On saving my last post I thought bout the fact that we don't know if the other hm quests are going to be reworked nm quests or going to be unique quests. so maybe making a new template is a bit premature.Rumian 09:21, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * I agree with the split, and that as soon as is humanly possible: it is a different quest with different difficulty, reward, foes' professions, skills and levels, requirements and in-game ID. The current way of documenting it is exceptionally confusing even to those who understand the mechanics of hard mode quests, let alone to those who don't. Loquay 17:16, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

disagree with split. The quest is not fundamentally different in hard mode, and we dont split missions either for NM/HM, and missions also give separate rewards for HM and NM. Just make a HM section like for missions. Roland of Gilead talk 16:19, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Actually I change my vote. The HM variant has the NM variant as the pre-requisite. User RolandOfGilead sig.png Roland of Gilead talk 17:14, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Agree with the split. If it's split how about just naming it Villainy of Galrath [Master] since thats the difference the questlog makes, so won't confuse anyone

Worth it?
IMO not. The mobs seem ridiculously overpowered for such a lame reward.

Plus I've always hated this quest, even in normal mode. Dasanko 19:14, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Forgot to sign! Dasanko 19:14, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * For a lot of people it'll be worth doing for the challenge. I agree though, the experience and gold rewards do not match up well with the difficulty of the quest.--TahiriVeila 19:39, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I was expecting him to have epic lootz but he didn't. :( ♥ Tyloric ♣ 20:22, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Must agree that reward is a bit low, xp worths nothing, and 5k gold is less than you'd earn by farming the same time that doing this quest takes. But meh, this happens with every quest in GW, plus, this is far more challenging than most of them. Not really a pain in the ass, since with Frozen Soil and some clever calling is quite easy, but still it's a fresh change to fight mobs of enemies with decent builds and tons of attribute points and energy :P Lhoj 07:38, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I think the challenge was worth my time. It's not worth doing it for the reward, this is something for people that like prophecies and have fun overcoming more difficult quests. Anet probably learned from battle of lions arch that you shouldn't make really difficult content too rewarding. This way you don't miss out on something if you can't beat it (Let's face it, not everyone likes to carefully prepare his attack before entering an area or team up with others. I heard plenty of people complaining about BLA, which can be hard for casual players and is required to continue with Hearts of the North)--87.221.67.42 10:48, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

Trivia
Doesn't seem very significant when there's a list and a quest 0. 24.197.253.243 07:04, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Agreed, the fact that it's quest ID is 1 doesn't seem like that big a deal. A better not might be something along the lines of, "This quest was chosen to be the first to be turned in HM quest because it has an internal quest ID of 1". --TahiriVeila 16:24, 30 April 2011 (UTC)


 * 1 has special significance for humans, despite its assignment being arbitrary. And we don't know if VoG was chosen because it's #1 (in which case, it's not arbitrary) or if that's coincidental (e.g. it happened to first on the list that no one has bothered to randomize). (As an example of how we attach special importance to randomness: imagine if the local lottery announced the winning numbers were 1-2-3-4-5 bonus=6. That's just as likely as any other 5+1 numbers, but we would all expect a thorough investigation to prove the game hadn't been fixed.) — Tennessee Ernie Ford ( TEF ) 16:43, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * This article at massively seems to indicate that the quest was specifically chosen because it has a quest ID of 1. I'm saying that the trivia note we have currently is more than a bit pointless and should be changed to indicate that this quest was chosen first specifically because its quest ID is 1.--TahiriVeila 06:35, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
 * It might be more meaningful just to say that "this quest was one of the very first implemented in Guild Wars", without making a reference to quest IDs (which are invisible in-game anyway). -- Hong 07:07, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
 * The fact that this quest was "One of the first made for the game" could be vaguely interesting to some of the most hardcore players (I'm pretty hardcore myself but couldn't care less in which order the made them). But the internal numbering of quests in the database ... I can't think of anyone who has any benefit at all from that information. --Manassas  [[File: User Manassas Mannysig.png]] 08:10, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

Super Aggro Party
It has been a long time since I did this quest, so I have to ask: Did it always used to aggro the entire hilltop at once, or does the game just dislike me today? Every time I tried to pull a small group with an arrow, they would pull. Then maybe 5 seconds later the rest of the hill would follow. None of my party, minions, or spirits were within aggro range of anything except the ones I shot and lured. Guildwarsrunner 09:37, 2 May 2011 (UTC)
 * no that is how the hm quest is.-[[Image:User_Zesbeer_sig.png|link=User talk:Zesbeer‎]] Zesbeer 10:54, 2 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Try to pull from a longer distance. Every group has monks, and they heal/protect enemies from other groups too, so the only way to not aggro more than a group is pulling them to a distance long enough so the monks from the rest of the groups don't come down to heal them Lhoj 15:41, 2 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I had no problems pulling. If too many come after you, just run away a bit and flag your heroes further away and see if one of the groups stop chasing you earlier than the other. User RolandOfGilead sig.png Roland of Gilead talk 18:44, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Doing it at the moment, the huge agro and abundance of enemy res sigs is hilarious. Lyra' Valo' [[Image:User Lyra Valo Sig.jpg]] 22:47, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Frozen Soil User RolandOfGilead sig.png Roland of Gilead talk 15:45, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I love the smell of dying White Mantle in the morning... Seriously, somehow this 'quest' makes me think of Apocalypse Now. 76.164.71.104 22:22, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Hard mode notice
I like having the separation notice about a hard mode version. The helmet icon seems a little prominent, though. Would it possible to tone it down a hint, maybe adding something like 50px to the image tag in Template:HMQuest?

I suppose even better would be making it an argument with a default value. I'd try it if I understood the programming of it. I leave it to you masterminds that be as a suggestion. Thanks. 76.164.71.104 22:34, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Missing Person
Hi. I was passing through Lion's arch and decided to pick this up for lack of anything better to do. Noticed a considerable rise in XP reward from when I first did this years ago, plus cash. Seemed easier than ever until I had dispatched all the Verata's servants, only to find Galrath nowhere at all. Is this a bug or did I do something wrong, like forget Melonni? One thing was weird though, when I got to the top of the hill after the troll and aloe section, Verata's hoards were all over the wizard's tower. But even if they had killed Galrath, wouldn't it still register as a completed quest?Ham in a can 20:08, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * The Villainy of Galrath (Hard mode). • • • Mora  20:10, 12 May 2011 (UTC)

OK, that's really dumb. That should be written on the normal mode page, which obviously is pointless having now. Right?Ham in a can 20:13, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * It is on the normal page. See it at the very top? And neither page is pointless because both are available in-game. You said yourself that you finished it before (NM), so now the new (HM) one is available to that character. • • • Mora  20:18, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I just checked in Lion's Arch. The point being made, I think, is that when you take the quest, all you see is Difficulty: Master, not that it has to be completed in Hard Mode. As it stands now, it's confusing to the player who chances by and sees the quest icon. 76.164.71.104 21:03, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks unsigned person. I have been playing this game for six years and have several characters. It's possible I did the quest before with this one but I'm not sure. Regardless, nowhere does it say you need to do the quest in HM on the NM page. Should at least mention it in the notes.Ham in a can 03:11, 13 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I agree. Just did this, quest could do with some clarification. Tong2 22:30, 13 May 2011 (UTC)
 * But you don't need to do it in HM, only if you have already finished the quest in NM. Or is that not what you meant? - Mini Me  22:44, 13 May, 2011 (UTC)
 * The previous quest is considerably easier due to the pathetic makeup of the groups around Galrath - this is the "normal" version of the quest - it can be done in either mode (frankly you'd do it in NM because theres no point in doing it in HM). The other Hard Mode version of this quest (with difficulty:Master) can only be carried out in Hard Mode - the foes don't even spawn in NM - so the second version has to be carried out in HM. --[[Image:User_Chieftain_Alex_Chieftain Signature.png]] Chieftain  Alex 22:54, 13 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Nonetheless, it's still not clear when the quest is taken, nor when viewed in the quest log, that it must be completed in Hard Mode. Difficulty: Master does not suggest HM at all (a number of NM Nightfall quests say that). A clarification should made somewhere, preferably by ANet in the Quest text, but at least on the Normal Mode page. Maybe it could be briefly mentioned in the note at the top that Difficulty: Master refers to the Hard Mode version. 76.164.71.104 03:55, 14 May 2011 (UTC)
 * So you didn't read the update notes with the 6th? :p --[[Image:User_Chieftain_Alex_Chieftain Signature.png]] Chieftain  Alex 17:51, 15 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Hehe :) I was lucky to have done so. I just feel sad for the poor folk frustrated to have fought their way out there only to find the quest impossible to complete. While now mentioned on the Hard Mode page, I still think this page should also refer to the Hard Mode version for the appearance of Difficulty: Master. ANet has now overloaded the term in an unfortunate manner. 76.164.71.104 19:06, 15 May 2011 (UTC)
 * No, not really. But it might confuse someone who doesn't read the update notes for some strange reason. Mango 21:00, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Hard Mode Galrath
With a mixed party where some have the normal mode quest and some the hard mode quest, the level 40 Galrath will spawn and killing him will mark both the normal mode and hard mode quests complete. Assuming that you start in HM. 82.143.219.87 22:04, 18 May 2011 (UTC)