Feedback talk:User/Dark Morphon/Cultist's Fervor and Order Spells

Nice. All work. NuVII  00:13, 28 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the support Nuke ;o. Dark Morphon 14:41, 28 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Isn't the Cultist Fervor idea overpowering it? You have Cultist's Fervor + Awaken the Blood and then you sacrifice the same amount of health, get Bleeding and you have +4 Blood Magic. Low duration or not, that's a high amount of lifesteal from any Blood Magic spell.
 * The only reason I don't like the Orders is because the range has changed. ^^ I liked being the N/P that helped the Relic Runners and stayed back just casting Order of the Vampire. ^^ Than 08:41, 29 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah, you could spend two skills on your bar for an attribute bonus. What are you going to do with it? Use Order Spells? These skills don't need 17 Blood Magic to be effective. Remember that Cultist's Fervor ends when you use a non-sacrifice Spell and that it therefore won't have any effect on life stealing skills.
 * Uhm, that's exactly the reason why I'm changing these skills. They have no place in a balanced environment and therefore need to be changed. Dark Morphon 12:55, 29 November 2009 (UTC)
 * True, but depending on how it gets it's programming (which I don't really know about) couldn't Masochism (PvP) work with it? I've noticed that any form of damage or anything that reduces your health first is always cast first before any form of healing (i.e. Spirit Light) In addition, you could just go back to the good old Dark Aura + Dark Pact + Wallow's Bite build whether it's 17 Blood Magic or 20. Than 03:10, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Masochism works with it, yeah. That seems obvious to me. Cast Masochism then this skill and go for it. I would definitely make sure this skill would end before the attribute bonus would kick in to prevent abuse. Concerning spambuilds such as the one you suggest, I highly doubt that that would be an effective build, but yeah, these skills probably need a change as they have no use outside of gimmicks anyways. Dark Morphon 09:52, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

So
CF is useless except for spamming orders now, and still useless in every balanced team build. Good job. Oh oh, and it makes suicide bombers even better now. Promoting gimmicks is a sure way to improve the state of the game, I am sure.Pika Fan 03:38, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * For realz. Dark Morphon 09:45, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * More seriously, many skills that I've been introducing for Necromancers have a sacrifice cost. Cultist's Fervor would synergize with those. Dark Morphon 09:47, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Like barbed signet, shadow of fear and defile enchantments I presume? That's hardly close to noteworthy especially when they don't need the reduced sacrifice, or the increased attribute bonus. I get the feeling that you are suggesting nerfs to skills just for the sake of nerfing them, which is a waste of time for anet and everyone since sbooning it would take less brainpower and effort in general. P.S. It's not like those 3 skills are going to see any sort of decent play anyway.. Pika Fan 10:06, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I was thinking of a bar such as:
 * Since Barbed Signet and the Order Spells are rather costy healthwise Cultist's Fervor helps dealing with their cost. Since Cultist's Fervor has zero recharge, it wouldn't be too costy to cast Strip/FF when needed. Vampiric Gaze could also replace Dark Fury or Order of Pain to assist in spikes. Dark Morphon 15:35, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Is the skill bar above with your version of Order of Pain & Dark Fury? Than 23:02, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Like I said, meh except for spamming orders. Boring, niche, and passive play. Pika Fan 23:59, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah, it's not ideal. I think I'll scrap the half sac thing. Dark Morphon 17:17, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * It just reminded me of the nH meta with the LoD monk/mesmer where you maintain SoH and JI and spammed signets on recharge. It was so awfully boring and skill-less to play, but stupidly effective. Not to mention, it made warriors' autoattacks hit into spirit bond. Pika Fan 20:42, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I get your point. This is just not gonna work. Do you think a skill like: "Enchantment Spell. Lose all Enchantments. Gain + energy regeneration. Whenever you cast a Spell/Touch Skill, you lose (preventing abuse with Dark Aura) 5% of your health for every Spell/Touch Skill you have casted while under the effect of this Enchantment." would work? I was thinking of as stats.
 * I'm also thinking of reworking Dark Fury to:, "Enchantment Spell. For 5 seconds, target ally moves 25% faster and gains one adrenaline whenever he succesfully hits in combat. 50% failure with Blood Magic < 5.", basically that would turn it into a skill that would also be useful to save your backline and would also be beneficial for your own positioning. Much like a Windborne Speed that's specialized in supporting your frontliners but still effective to support other party members. Good idea? Bad idea? Dark Morphon 15:28, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Both skills are tricky to tweak to make them balanced and viable at the same time. Just keep in mind to put in a clause that it ends on the use of non-necro skills for the first one just in case. The second one is rather...weak, yet at the same time we don't want primal rage warriors with battle rage all for the price of two so we can't exactly buff it more than that either. Hmm, after this silly exam of mine, I shall put more thought into it, now I really have to rush off. Pika Fan 23:19, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Concerning my first idea, yeah, that sounds like a good plan. Concerning my second idea, I was thinking of possibly giving it a small AoE but that might make it like a non-elite Charge!. I don't know whether that is desirable. Dark Morphon 14:36, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I was thinking of making it a maintained enchantment(yeah, doesn't fit the class theme, I know), make the maintainer lose 5% health and 2 energy each attack(even if it doesn't land) so that a powerful effect would be balanced by the fact that it's going to make monks cry. This would probably need to go hand in hand with the other orders changes. Even so, it would be open to quite a lot of abuse. Another way would be to make it end if the warrior uses a skill, so it would be limited to autoattacking, which by then you can safely make the skill stronger. Pika Fan 17:35, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
 * In that case: "Enchantment Spell. For 8 seconds, target ally and nearby allies move 25% faster and gain 1 adrenaline on hitting attacks. For each ally, this skill ends the next time that ally uses a skill." would this be about right? Dark Morphon 16:22, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Or better yet, duration scaling ? Dark Morphon 16:28, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeap, duration scaling would be needed, or you could actually have it unspecced for full benefits. Pika Fan 17:18, 6 December 2009 (UTC)