ArenaNet talk:Developer updates/Archive Feb-April 2007

This Page
How did this page already get linked on the main page? Shouldn't that be removed, or this page given some modicum of content (if it is not going to be deleted)? --Tharkun 13:02, 9 February 2007 (PST)
 * It was already there when we invaded. [[Image:User Blastedt sig.jpg]]Blastedt GuildWiki page 13:03, 9 February 2007 (PST)
 * I'm sure it'll soon be filled with Gaile's Inspirational words [[Image:Kaya-Icon-Small.png]] 13:08, 9 February 2007 (PST)
 * I'm not sure sure about "Inspirational" but there are words there, now. ;) --Gaile Gray 20:38, 13 February 2007 (PST)


 * All logs from Gaile should have an actual date, otherwise we will get lost ;) Eleonora--141.83.63.192 02:51, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * That's a very good point, and thank you. I will do my best to post the official statements in standard wiki format, but it may happen in a second go-'round. This is because when I have community messages to relay, I'm placing them on several forums in very close order, so that all forum communities get the message as close to concurrently as I can relay it, for the objective is to inform players and in most cases to invite feedback about some specific topic(s). As you know, different forums have different styles of indentation, bullet-point presentation, and so forth, and I'm already dealing with retro-formatting there, and I'll definitely try to retro-format here, too. (I welcome formatting tips any time!)


 * If there are concerns about this page's name, placement, or purpose, I'm more than happy to discuss. I feel we should have this log as a respository of official posts, which is how I used it yesterday. And then secondly, yes, I'd very much like a place where players can log Gaile/Frog in-game visit logs, too. What's good titling and placement for that? --Gaile Gray 09:13, 14 February 2007 (PST)
 * I made a proposal of new titling for those pages over here at the discussion about proposals for changes to the main page. [[Image:Kaya-Icon-Small.png]] 10:28, 14 February 2007 (PST)

Deleted?
I think this is a real page actually. Isnt it? Does it need to be deleted? 12:59, 9 February 2007 (PST)
 * Look at the history. Content was ghghghgghh [[Image:User Blastedt sig.jpg]]Blastedt GuildWiki page 13:00, 9 February 2007 (PST)

13/2/06
Very nice :D &mdash; Skuld 10:54, 13 February 2007 (PST)
 * =D Ale_Jrb (talk) 10:58, 13 February 2007 (PST)
 * Input! :D --Snograt whisper 11:17, 13 February 2007 (PST)
 * I can't wait for pvp pet ganks. --Thom Bangalter 11:53, 13 February 2007 (PST)

My run-away sarcasm generator would like to complain about postponement of an unexpected update with unexpected new features...because it thinks its funny like that. Other than that thanks for the news/update :D Lojiin 20:46, 13 February 2007 (PST)


 * I hear you, brother. :) We love giving the preview look, the sneakpeek, and as long as players are ok with us taking the time to make it as good as it can be, we're ok both with talking about it in advance and then making the wise decision to move the release by a few hours for quality assurance. I'm impressed that the community is cool about it. That sort of reaction is exactly what devs love, because it encourages us to tell more, knowing that we can do so without risk of an "OMG!" reaction. You're right, Lojiin, with an unexpected update bearing untold goodies, I think it's just right that everyone is maintaining a civil demeanor. However, personally, I'm not opposed to sarcy comments, as long as someone is clear on intent, or *bright idea* devises the super-needed Icon of Sarcasm! :D --Gaile Gray 21:01, 13 February 2007 (PST)


 * Would you personally thank the people responsible for the 'log out to character selection screen' please? That has always been something that I have thought was lacking for a while now.  :)  --Rainith 21:14, 13 February 2007 (PST)


 * Eheh, my first thought when I read that was "huh, isn't that how it already works?". Then I remembered that I'm of course using the "-password" command line switch. ;) --84-175 (talk) 06:15, 14 February 2007 (PST)

A challenge mission ladder? Crap, I'm gonna have to figure out how to spend the most amount of continuous time doing the Remains of Sahlahja mission (which probably means taking a page from the Nowak book, and wearing diapers). VegJed 13:59, 14 February 2007 (PST)

Formatting
I went ahead and put some headlines on the page. For the future, I think we should have something like a formatting convention. I don't mind working together on that or Gaile finding a style by herself. I'm just of the opinion that the page should look somewhat uniform. ~ D.L. 03:53, 14 February 2007 (PST)

Move to Gaile's namespace?
These are messages from Gaile, written by herself, which should generally be edited by nobody except herself. I'd say they should be in her namespace. --Tetris L 04:17, 14 February 2007 (PST)
 * One thing we should as Gaile is whether it would be okay for her if users "wikify" the text in the same manner that we edit update notes, i.e. add links only. --Tetris L 04:24, 14 February 2007 (PST)
 * What about logs taken from other sources and transcribed here? Such as the in-game frog/gaile chats?--Drekmonger 04:33, 14 February 2007 (PST)

I oppose the move to Gaile Gray's user space, though I think the page should be better named than "Gaile logs" (I propose Updates from Gaile Gray). I would even support merging this with Gaile Gray in some fashion. This is more than just a "blog"; if this wiki exists to document the game, then official communications from ArenaNet to the community should be part of this documentation, not obscured under some user page. I think these communications should be edited lightly, if at all, for the reason that editing dilutes authorship. To be absolutely blunt, Gaile's messages are not always clear (often for excellent reasons), so we should not leave it to users to disambiguate her messages. Frankly, I think this page ought to be protected as part of a group of clearly labelled "official ArenaNet pages". I would encourage Gaile to do the wikilinking herself because it will have the side benefit of demonstrating that she is aware of how the wiki is growing. S 04:38, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * "Frankly, I think this page ought to be protected as part of a group of clearly labelled "official ArenaNet pages"." Hell yes. The temptation to vandalize this particular page will be extraordinary when/if the wiki is announced on the main guildwars site.  Though I think the original intention of "gaile logs" might have been a repository for transcriptions of the in-game logs from Gaile and the Frog...so perhaps an admin willing to take on that task could also be given leave to edit this page.--Drekmonger 04:43, 14 February 2007 (PST)

If Gaile uses this page to post "semi-official announcements" (like she does in the forums now) then this page should be kept here and linked from the main page. Non-official discourse should be kept to normal talk pages of course. I think the "move" template should be removed. Oblio 10:47, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * My desire is to have a place on the Guild Wars Wiki to post relatively "official" announcements, similar to what I post on fan forums but different than those that may come through more formal sources such as press releases or website news posts or updates. The Dev Update that I made yesterday is a case in point. I'm fine with the name of this page, or am open to suggestions, of course. If you feel that such pages will be subject to vandalism, then yes, let's protect them, assuming there is such functionality at present. As they are my logs, then I would prefer to post to them, and of course review suggested edits on the discussion pages. If the nature of the wiki is such that updates of this nature remain subject to edits by others, could you please let me know that that this is the foreseen practice and/or policy on this particular wiki, so that I can weigh how I move forward? To be honest, I feel it would be unsettling to have less comparative security about the messaging I do for ArenaNet on our hosted wiki than we have when I post in fan forums, where once posted, the thread cannot be edited, altered, or amended by others. However, this is a wiki, and not a forum, so naturally some differences prevail. Thanks for sharing your insight and your experienced point of view on this matter -- they are both greatly appreciated! --Gaile Gray 00:55, 15 February 2007 (PST)


 * Either fully protecting the pages right off the bat, or leaving some level of editability by only allowing registered users to edit it would be a good solution. Most vandalism is by anonymous users, and if it gets worse with people signing up accounts for the sole purpose of vandalism the page could be fully protected. &mdash; Skuld 01:08, 15 February 2007 (PST)


 * I fear that this page will have to be protected in the long run, but as with other pages, I would advise to wait and see. If vandalisation happens, we can always react. One of the advantages of not protecting it fully is that editors would be able to wikify the page. --Xeeron 03:04, 15 February 2007 (PST)


 * I agree with Xeeron. There are risks of vandalism on any page, and "officially sanctioned" articles are no different. If vandalism becomes a huge problem then protecting the article so that only registered users can edit the page is reasonable. And if even that is not good enough we could fully protect the page.


 * I do think that some guidelines should be laid down. This article should not be subject to rewrites, only wikifying the text. LordBiro 06:45, 15 February 2007 (PST)


 * I put in a notice box, asking users only to edit the page to wikify or archive. I dislike the hand icon, but could not find anything better in the current images uploaded, maybe someone can upload a nice exclamation to replace it. --Xeeron 06:56, 15 February 2007 (PST)

Order
Wouldn't it be more logical to post newest first? Qanar 04:20, 14 February 2007 (PST)
 * Agreed, but this is up to Gaile to decide, IMO. It's her blog. --Tetris L 04:24, 14 February 2007 (PST)
 * Aha, didn't saw it as a blog, but as a collection for logs and forum-posts etc at first. But you're probaly right :-) Qanar 04:37, 14 February 2007 (PST)
 * I'm thinking with a secondary follow-up, it should be main commentary first, follow-ups below. With a new post, I can place that above with a date/time divider. I'm a bit torn about that, but I can't see reading "What I said there" before I actually said it, so to speak. Oh, looking at the idea from LordBiro below, that may solve it, where placement on the inclusions page renders placement within it less a matter of concern. :) --Gaile Gray 09:13, 14 February 2007 (PST)

Organisation
Despite discussions as to whether this page should be moved/renamed, I think it's important that we lay the foundation for organisation and archiving.

I recommend we include subpages in the following way:

Using YYYYMMDD (I'm sure that standard has a name...) means that we would be able to easily locate posts from 2007, from February 2007, or from a particular day. LordBiro 05:20, 14 February 2007 (PST)
 * /signed (I hope that wiki newb called Gaile will learn how to handle inclusions, quickly. ;)) --Tetris L 06:18, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * Agreed. The page would get very unreadable very quickly otherwise. --Xeeron 09:05, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * Agreed, I was actually thinking of doing this last night and setting the page up similar to the game updates page on GuildWiki, but I was too tired. --Rainith 09:14, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * I am yours to command. Well, ok, not really but it sounded nice, didn't it? ;) Let me know how you see this best working and in the meantime I may just go looking for a copy of Wikis for Dummies. After all, our "Editing Help" window isn't exactly informative. *hint* :) --Gaile Gray 09:20, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * I bit, clicked on the Editing Help, and noticed it was empty. lol. Sneaky Gaile, but thank you for the reminder about the guide. :D Some things get overlooked at times like these. &mdash; Gares 09:26, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * Too late now, but wouldn't it have been nice to have Gaile Mail & Frog Logs? :D -- Snograt   whisper  13:15, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * I have to admire the poeticism. I mean, I'm up for it if you guys are. ;) --Gaile Gray 13:19, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * If you guys are willing to wait a bit, I was planning to ask the loggers, individually, if they mind me using their screen captures to upload the logs somewhere on the wiki. I agree Dev Updates (and I think the actual page we have should be named thus) and Gaile & Frog In-Game logs should remain separate.  I'll have to buckle down soon and start PM'ing the loggers to get permissions. ;)Zahra 13:44, 14 February 2007 (PST)

Gaile, if you need basic wiki syntax help, please go to Help:Editing on Wikipedia for now. It will eventually be transferred here. Also, may I request you not to use purple text on the page itself? The page makes it clear that it is written by you, and you can even add a signature stamp at the end if you want to make it clear that you wrote it, but I think the purple robs your text of the gravitas it deserves. S 13:34, 14 February 2007 (PST)


 * I believe this page, and the root, were already rendered quite purple free by me. Edit: Or not. I thought I had, but apparently someone else helped me out on a page that wasn't intended for edits by others. Interesting. But no matter, I'm open to suggestions. Is there something else you want me to divest of colour? :) --Gaile Gray 00:19, 15 February 2007 (PST)


 * I was speaking about this. Btw, it's only a request. Far be it from me to demand anything of anyone. S 00:25, 15 February 2007 (PST)


 * Thanks for the tip on the editing info. I tossed in some HTML coding on a whim, remembering I'd been able to use it on another wiki in the past. And your suggestion on colouration is just fine! Thanks. --Gaile Gray 01:07, 15 February 2007 (PST)

Move to Gaile News
Following the main page update, should this be moved to Gaile News? --Indecision 04:13, 23 February 2007 (EST)


 * I rather thought so, but I'll leave it to those more involved with placement questions. The way I was seeing it, I have a discussion page linked from my personal page for less official content, where we were going to use the Gaile News page for the more official statements. If that's the case, then since what's here now is official, it would be moved to the Gaile News page. Or so I believe. I'm following the lead, here, rather than trying to steer the wagon train. So I'll leave a move decision to someone else. Thanks for noting this, though! --Gaile Gray 16:56, 23 February 2007 (EST)


 * I've moved the main article to Gaile News in line with the discussion about this section in Talk:Main Page/editcopy --Indecision 02:07, 27 February 2007 (EST)

Confusion about Nomenclature (since resolved)
Should the content on this page be moved here? Is this the intended spot for official announcements that I make, such as those currently on that Gaile_logs page? Just want to make sure that's the intention. Thanks. --Gaile Gray 14:48, 24 February 2007 (EST)
 * My understanding is that this article is to be intended spot for official announcements that you make, similar to the content that has been transferred from the Gaile logs article.  I believe that the recent changes to the main page (Talk:Main Page/editcopy) were made to allow the Gaile logs article to be renamed to Gaile News for clarity purposes.  As a result I moved the Gaile logs article to Gaile News.  My apologies for altering the associated talk page prior to answering your question. I will leave it up to someone else to organize what to do with the now unattached Talk:Gaile logs page. --Indecision 02:28, 27 February 2007 (EST)
 * This works very nicely for me, and thanks for doing the heavy lifting. :) --Gaile Gray 02:33, 27 February 2007 (EST)
 * I moved Talk:Gaile logs into /Archive 1 of this talk. --Rezyk 02:43, 27 February 2007 (EST)
 * Glad I could be of some help Gaile. Thanks Rezyk, wasn't sure what I should do with it. Still getting used to editing on the wiki :). --Indecision 08:31, 2 March 2007 (EST)

Do we want this page wikifying?
answers on a postcard please. --Jamie 08:37, 2 March 2007 (EST)
 * Answer. --Dirigible 13:37, 2 March 2007 (EST)
 * lol that's adorable Diri. :) - B e X o R  13:40, 2 March 2007 (EST)
 * Sweeet. thanks Diri :) --Jamie [[Image:User Jamie.gif|(Talk Page)]] 14:24, 2 March 2007 (EST)
 * LMAO! Neat answer! ₪₪ JOS ə PH ₪₪ 14:26, 2 March 2007 (EST)
 * That's adorably clever! :) --Emily Diehl 14:46, 2 March 2007 (EST)
 * Definitely too much time on your hands. lol &mdash; Gares 15:25, 2 March 2007 (EST)
 * And he has all the right points on the postcard as well! --Xeeron 16:28, 2 March 2007 (EST)
 * Very cool. :o) --JP 05:44, 4 March 2007 (EST)
 * I loved the postcard, but I just now noticed that you wrote it before the Post Office received it! (Check the postmark.) -- Dashface [[Image:User_Dashface.png]] 02:17, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Gaile says we can go ahead and wikify these announcements. Linky. --Dirigible 17:18, 2 March 2007 (EST)

Nice, someone went through and wikified as I was writing up other stuff. Nice to see those links "magically" appear. Thanks! --Gaile Gray 21:24, 6 March 2007 (EST)

Thank you Gaile!
Understanding why a skill changed is critical to appreciate, versus bash, what aNet is trying to do. We players put so much investment into knowing the skills, their costs/casts/charging time, and how they fit into the build that it can be quite frustrating when skills change. Stating the reasoning helps us adapt to and adopt the change. Truemyths 15:59, 8 March 2007 (EST)


 * Yeeehaaa, nice changes and good to see the explanations again. (There was an explanation for the skill balance for this too, Truemyths)
 * "The addition of the new pet controls caused us to scale back the interrupting pet skills, and allowed us to rework Otyugh's Cry into a much more useful skill." I didn't know we got new pet controls? Are they introduced in the same update then? Yeehaaaa!
 * This once more made me realise how different PvE and PvP are. When you they that they wanted to make rarely used skills better, I wasn't waiting for so nice boosts to skills used regularily in PvE. I'm not complainging though, atleast as long as they don't break PvE for the sake of PvP. :) -- [[Image:User Gem sig.png|Gem]] (gem / talk) 17:32, 4 April 2007 (EDT)

Kudos to ANet, very good changes ~Skuld 03:55, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * And also thnx for explaining why you're changing things.Jelmewnema 09:12, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I concur, the explanations are truly magnificent. Something that the 'community' has been looking for in a while. But one thing does get me:
 * and Signet of Clumsiness received a small damage boost to improve viability of the anti-melee and PvE varieties of Mesmer
 * Are you really going to expect groups in DoA calling out: LF Sig of Clumsiness Mesmer 7/8 ;-) -- [[Image:Corrran.png|CoRrRan]] (CoRrRan / talk) 13:46, 5 April 2007 (EDT)

Paragon Hate?
Paragons and Shouts seem to get weaker and weaker. I would really like to see balance by power increase instead of decrease since Builds are becoming harder and harder to create for Paragons. GrammarNazi 12:23, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * There is no "Hate" against paragons but ballancing of Shouts, where bouth Warriors and Paragons are effected, to keep things leveled in the PvP. Biz 13:30, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Again though, PvP nuffs are ruining PvE gameplay. The unique thing about paragons was the shouts, echoes, and chants.  Now they have been nurfed so bad that the only strong use they have is damage dealers.  Might as well go as a warrior.  Notice how few P you see in PvE right now too btw.... their usefulness to a party has declined heavily. Hopefully Anet will see that eventually and add some power back into the P besides simply spear mastery. — RabiesTurtle 13:38, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * =P And yet, paragons are incredibly powerful damage dealers. They have the same armor as a Warrior, and do a similar amount of damage, except it's ranged. How is this a bad thing? Yes, the paragon who stands in the back and just keeps spamming "Incoming!" and "Watch Yourself!" has gotten nerfed, but that's not really a bad thing - it was as overpowered in PvE as it was in PvP. Perhaps the greatest thing these skill changes have done is making Paragons branch out from their one role - the shout spammer - and turn into a class where there are a lot of different possibilities - not "simply spear mastery" or a guy who stands in the backline and buffs everyone absurdly. It's kind of like the recent Ritualist changes - now, there are more options than the classic "spirit spammer" build, since a lot of the other skills have gotten pretty major buffs (the Weapon spells, for example). Rather than having been "nurfed so bad," like you said, these classes are finally somewhat balanced to the point where more than one playstyle is possible. And, for future reference, ArenaNet will never read this page. =P If you have actual suggestions, go to a fansite's forums, where they'll actually look at it. If you just want to complain, then this is probably as good a place as any. MisterPepe talk 13:49, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I should have more specifically addressed the issue of Shout related enhancements in Motivation and in some Elites of the Paragon. I agree with what has been said above - damage-dealing Paragons are certainly powerful in their own right, and no class should be able to sit back and make a party exceptionally stronger; however, Paragons predominantly use skillsets that mimick a Warrior's identically, and since Paragons' Shouts are losing effectiveness the Profession is increasingly losing the ability to stay in the back at all (since they are better at dealing damage). 	+
 * In short, effective Paragon builds whose purpose cannot already be filled by Monk, Warrior, and Ranger builds continue to disappear with each balance change. As far as discussing on the forums, that logic could be applied to remove all Talk pages from a Wiki. I got your opinion, did I not? That is really all I'm looking for :) Conversation starter. GrammarNazi 14:05, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Yea, I think you missed what we meant MisterPepe. I know the paragon is still a decent class, but it is no longer unique.  It was brought as a "leader" who could buff your team.  With the changes it is more of a ranged Warrior.  Many of the other shouts are much weaker and lose their usefulness.  It was just nice having some variety, and that is what sucks about the nuff of the non-spear paragon skills. — RabiesTurtle 21:47, 5 April 2007 (EDT)

Necromancer Hate
IMO the the minion energy decrease is nice, but the soul reaping nerf if just idiotic. Please, for once don't just think about PvP (Spirit-Way) and think also about legitimate PvE and PvP uses for necros...(i.e. minion bombing, general MM, SS, w/e). Otherwise why not just go N/E so you have more energy. Windtalker 14:03, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * There are many efficient energy management possibilities for necros, they decreased some animation energy costs and Soul Reaping will still give 16 energy every 5 seconds. I don't think it's too bad for MMs, I think it's more balancing actually. -- [[Image:User Gem sig.png|Gem]] (gem / talk) 14:14, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I am pretty sure they will have considered all the "legitimate pve and pvp uses for necros" before making changes like this, just because spirit-way was directly mentioned as a reason, does not mean the entire situation was not considered. -- Lemming64 15:17, 5 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Yea... but fiends are still 25 energy. That animation skill is definitely going to get hurt by this I believe. — RabiesTurtle 21:50, 5 April 2007 (EDT)

ATS Tests
They should have started a half hour ago, but they didn't. B LASTED T  14:34, 7 April 2007 (EDT)

ATS Testing Applications Closed
Thanks to all who applied to test the Automated Tournament System with us. It has been a lot of fun, and most of all it has helped tremendously in finding a lot of little bugs and glitches. We have two more days of testing, so we hope to see everyone at Noon Pacific (19:00 GMT) tomorrow and Friday.

Test Applications are still rolling in, but we reached capacity days ago. No additional testers will be brought in at this time, although we do thank you for offering to help. We may offer opportunities like this again sometime, so keep your eyes peeled. If you decide to apply in the future, be aware that for us--and hopefully for those who offer to help--these sessions are focused on testing. We need people who are willing to follow instructions, who will concentrate on and prioritize the test objectives, and who will set aside non-test playing and socializing to keep the focus on the test itself, which is for the overall good of the game. Thanks again to everyone for helping out! :) --Gaile 19:15, 11 April 2007 (EDT)

Mursaat!
What caused that outbreak of mursaat today :O --Gummy Joe 17:55, 14 April 2007 (EDT)


 * Precursor to hard mode? It is so hard that enemies attack in towns and outposts where players can't fight back.  ;)  --Rainith 03:20, 15 April 2007 (EDT)


 * There some mention at Talk:Gaile/Frog Talk. - B e X  03:25, 15 April 2007 (EDT)

Q3 huh?
Q3 how is that the holiday season... q 3 is may to August right? whats in there other then E3... do you mean canada day and July the fourth.
 * Why would they use a fiscal year for this? The American 2007 fiscal year Q3 is April-June, which is far too early, I think. They probably meant a Gregorian calendar Q3, in other words a July-September release... --Dirigible 20:53, 14 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I don't know of an "American" Fiscal year. I think the US government may run a FY of July 1 through June 30, or perhaps they use the standard FY of January through December. But in any case, Q3 in the gaming industry is the third set of three months in a calendar year: July, August, and September. --Gaile [[Image:User gaile_2.png| ]] 21:45, 14 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Sorry for the overly broad term, I did indeed mean the US government fiscal year, which happens to start on October 1st and ends on September 30th. Thanks for the clarification, makes sense that it's a July-September release. :) --Dirigible 21:55, 14 April 2007 (EDT)

ATS Testing: Extended April 18-20
The design team has let us know that it may be a good idea to have another day or two of testing on the ATS system. This will help us with a few more tweaks, most of which were incorporated due to the reports we received from our testers last week. I'm told the earliest testing day would likely be Tuesday, and we may have just one day, perhaps two. I will post here on the GWW if we do indeed decide to have another day or two for ATS testing. Thank you to everyone who has been involved -- your reports and feedback have been very valuable! --Gaile 02:14, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * All those involved in ATS Testing last week are invited back for testing Wednesday through Friday this week. That's April 18 - 20, and the test will run from Noon to 3:00 PM Pacific or 7:00 to 10:00 (19:00 to 22:00) GMT. For time conversions for your area, I suggest you might use TimeandDate.Com's Converter. We hope to have a goodly number of testers on board this week, and look forward to seeing you there! --Gaile [[Image:User gaile_2.png| ]] 02:31, 17 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Gaile, I suggest it's better to post this on your news rather than writing on a talk page. I saw this here only by accident... --BigBlue [[Image:Monk 20.png]] talk 04:20, 18 April 2007 (EDT)

Move to Gaile Gray's log?
I think a move to this new article would better describe the content of this page as the current title does. Also possible: Gaile Gray's message log. What do you mean? BigBlue 06:20, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Heh, I like Gaile News more mostly because it sounds better : D I would rather keep it here, but I think the decision belongs to the one who writes on this page, Gaile herself. Erasculio 07:42, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * The word "log" in the title would lead to confusion with Gaile/Frog Talk as transcripts from Gaile's visits are traditionally called "Gaile logs". I think "Gaile News" is fine, as that is what this article is for: Gaile directly posting news. :) --84-175 (talk) 07:43, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Good point. But then I would insert "Gray" in article's name as Gaile News sounds too colloquial. BigBlue 07:47, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I like it as is. It is colloquial; it's Gaile speaking directly to readers. - Sundown Solstice 08:26, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Look at the postings she made there. It doesn't sound very colloquial to me (as it is in Gaile Talks). Just look at the statement about the release of GWEN. This is formal. BigBlue 08:32, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Gaile News sounds much cooler to me (imagine David Letterman shouting "It's the G A I L E News", you get the idea ;)) and again, it's written in a very formal way. On a side note, how about we let Gaile decide this? ~ Buttermilk [[Image:User Buttermilk Buttermilksig.png]] 09:45, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Just to let you know, this section was moved from Gaile logs -> Gaile News previously, partly to help disambiguate from the Gaile/Frog Talk logs. --Indecision 09:58, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I think Gaile News is the best description for this article, because it is news from Gaile. Logs makes it sound more like a record of conversation, like in chat log. Gaile's News would be acceptable also but I don't think moving this article is really that important. - B e X  10:16, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I don't mind Gaile News, and in fact it has a little hidden humour. Like Storm Warnings? Gaile (Gale) News...? Ok, never mind. ;) If you're prefer Updates, that's ok, too, although I post a lot of Updates within this article and it might become sort of redundant. I do prefer not to have this article called a Log because Froggie and I have a long history of players kindly recording things in our "logs." I'd like to avoid confusion with a separate name. (While I have to say again that those logs are a tremendous help in remembering what I'm going to ask the designers and what suggestions I'm passing to other teams!) Anyway, just my two cents -- you guys choose whichever nomenclature works best for the community. --Gaile [[Image:User gaile_2.png| ]] 20:21, 16 April 2007 (EDT)
 * (Moving back the indent.) Hehe. I enjoy your humour Gaile. :) And your attention to grammar makes me happy. :) - [[Image:Shield-Logo-Mini.gif]] Drago 16:21, 17 April 2007 (EDT)

Volunteer Needed: Archiving Expertise a Plus
I would like to suggest that we start archiving the Gaile News page. Here's a proposal for formatting: Create a monthly archive with subdivisions for each Dev Update or new article. Call out the articles by title or subject, so that users don't need to poke through by month to find the article they seek. Archor right, so it offsets the ToC. It might look like this (excuse poor formatting):
 * March 2007 Archives
 * last article title for month
 * second most-recent article title
 * blah
 * first article of the month


 * February 2007 Archives
 * (see above)

I'd recommend that we keep the current month present in the ToC and, until mid-month, the previous month as well. So now would be the time to break off February and March, leaving April in the ToC until sometime in mid-May.

You can probably tell I've done a bit of thinking about this, but this is much like content archiving for websites, something with which I have some degree of familiarity, and I think this is one possible way to go. The inclusion of archive/file cabinet graphics would be a plus, in my mind. Feedback, counter-proposals, or offers to help would be gratefully accepted. :) --Gaile 15:18, 18 April 2007 (EDT)


 * That's exactly how I would do it. If no one beats me to it, I'll do this in a day or two. -- [[Image:User Gem sig.png|Gem]] (gem / talk) 15:47, 18 April 2007 (EDT)


 * That would be truly marvelous -- thanks so much! --Gaile [[Image:User gaile_2.png| ]] 16:07, 18 April 2007 (EDT)


 * Just as an aside, I've considered before that it would make sense to store the entries as Gaile News/2007/04/18 instead of the current Gaile News/20070418, that way you could archive all February entries under Gaile News/2007/02, and all 2007 updates under Gaile News/2007. There's nothing to stop use from using the same system but without the additional slashes, but the advantage to using slashes is that, if subpages were enabled on the main namespace (I presume they're not) then you could easily navigate from the day, to the month, to the year using the subpage links.


 * Anyway, just a thought, it would be a fair amount of work renaming entries :P LordBiro 05:14, 20 April 2007 (EDT)


 * It would indeed be a really nice thing. - Anja [[Image:User Anja Astor sig icon.png|Anja Astor]] (talk)  06:57, 20 April 2007 (EDT)


 * I just remembered about this excellent idea, as I was tucking things into a (not very good, not even adequate) archive. Did any kind and willing volunteer step up to help with this? --Gaile [[Image:User gaile_2.png| ]] 17:42, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

New Update with Necs and Mes
-Thanks for all the information you've been putting up. Mucho appreciated! I just wanted to randomly come by and say that I like the idea of them actually improving mesmers in pve. Though, I believe mesmers are absolutely fine the way they are. They're very fun, and I love playing a mesmer, but it is hard to find a random party with my mesmer.. like what they've already noticed... I sometime have to go with my secondary to even get invited. *strokes chin* I do wonder though, what exactly are they going to change about them....? I don't expect an answer, but I can't seem to think of anything that will make them any better at finding a party... Oh well, I guess they'll surprise us later. -As for the Necro change. Yeah, a bit disappointing in my case, since I've got the -1 energy regen wand and focus item for the extra energy boost, so pretty much I was depending on the soul reaping for my mm build. It was working great.. things just needed to die. I guess after that update, I really have to find another way for energy management. Though, if there was a class that should get some energy attention, it would be the ritualists..without having to depend on the secondary, that is. *hint*hint*--Zemmy 21:16, 19 April 2007 (EDT)
 * They're adding new profession-specific Sunspear skills when they roll out hard mode, that should help. -- Gordon Ecker 15:56, 19 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I'd imagine that it would be a very difficult task in making Mesmers useful in PvE without overpowering a couple of skills. Goodluck with that Anet. Giangn626 17:34, 19 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Just a note that the PvE-only skills will be added in another upcoming update; they will not be coming with the Hard Mode update, as they require a tad more balance testing. They truly are coming soon, but just not today. --Gaile [[Image:User gaile_2.png| ]] 20:40, 19 April 2007 (EDT)
 * So, are you saying that ANet has postponed an expected skill addition? Couldn't we have been given some sort of official note or something concerning this? - [[Image:Drago-Shield-Mini.gif]] Drago 21:00, 19 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I'm curious about this upcoming update with the new skills and all... About the design a weapon contest and such, do u know if the designs will be out for that new update with the new skills, or will that be for eye of the north?--Zemmy 21:16, 19 April 2007 (EDT)
 * The increased attack, casting and recharge speed of hard mode monsters provides an indirect power boost to a lot of Mesmer skills in hard mode (although it does hurt interrupts). I don't think this is the entire Mesmer update, but I think it's part of it. -- Gordon Ecker 20:03, 20 April 2007 (EDT)
 * And according to this post the Mesmer PvE analysis is still ongoing, and is independant of upcoming PvE-only skills. -- Gordon Ecker 00:48, 26 April 2007 (EDT)

Excellent Explanation
Gaile, thank you (and your colleagues) for putting up such a detailed description of what and why you changed loot. Great stuff. -- (CoRrRan / talk) 22:42, 20 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Hey, I agree. Mike O'Brien wrote that up, and I think it's very informative, not just about the update itself but about the thinking behind it, and the care that the designers use to consider every aspect involved in a game change. Now I'm thinking that maybe I will toddle off to Hard Mode later on and get me some of those Charr Burgers at the Great Northern Wall Barbeque! :) --Gaile [[Image:User gaile_2.png| ]] 22:51, 20 April 2007 (EDT)
 * The Charr are too full to move - they've spent all day munching on Snograt burgers :( -- Snog  rat [[Image:User Snograt signature.png]] 22:58, 20 April 2007 (EDT)
 * Lol. We did the first mission easily - second one not so much. Thanks for this explanation. I know its hard for you guys to try balance loot between normal players and botters, so this big explanation makes it easier for us to know where we stand. I am glad that you decided to give farmers another chance though - I really want Vabbian armor for a couple of my characters one day! - B e X  23:34, 20 April 2007 (EDT)

Thanks, Gaile et al, for the explanation on loot scaling and the like. I have read elsewhere that you are all in favor of [u]manual[/u] solo farming. I did some runs yesterday with my trusty 55 monk at the usual places, hydras, minos and mountain trolls, with appallingly bad results - so indeed things have changed and I guess I need to change my solo farming style. I am concerned however, that the automated hordes of bots will either simply start running their excursions in greater numbers and round the clock, or will develop 8-person bot teams that will then descend upon hard mode for farming. In short, I fear that your fix places a lot more inconvenience upon the casual, manual player than upon the bot runners, who will fairly quickly adapt and resume their bad habits. --Jawn Sno 10:07, 21 April 2007 (EDT)
 * It would be really stupid to run an 8 bot team as the 8 bot team gets the normal drops, which means that they get as much as they used to get with a solo bot previously, not more. Running a smaller group or solo reduces the drops from the previous to one third (previously soloing got 8 times the amount that you got in a team and the Gaile news said that now it is 2-3 times instead of 8). I think this is a nice hindrance for gold selling companies. Thumbs up. -- [[Image:User Gem sig.png|Gem]] (gem / talk) 14:56, 21 April 2007 (EDT)


 * I'm sorry, Gem, but I'm not following your logic (and, necessary internet disvowal - I'm not being sarcastic). If a bot runner gets the same amount using an 8-bot team as previously running solo, then why not run the 8-bot team? Is it that much more resource intensive? I truly don't know, not being aware of how bot factories are set up. It's unfortunate there doesn't seem to be a way of detecting bots as they come tromping in. --Jawn Sno 12:40, 22 April 2007 (EDT)


 * Instead of having the 8 bots all farming solo, they now need to form a group to get full drops. The drops for the full 8 man party are now the same as they would have been for a soloer previously. This means that they need 8 times the accounts and the bot watchers to get the same amount of gold. (Ofcourse with the newer update they will still keep soloing as it gives more income than a full party, but they get a lot less money than before) -- [[Image:User Gem sig.png|Gem]] (gem / talk) 12:45, 22 April 2007 (EDT)

At least we wiki'ers (or whatever they call it) can be civilized on this. Gaile publicly stated that she wan't going to be looking or dealing with the loot farming thread anymore because of the outright disrespectful rudeness shown to her in the post, and I agree with her. That thread had to be closed and cleaned a number of times. I think it's a great update, but I would like it a little better if they increased the drop rates of everything exempt by loot scaling by a lot in hard mode, namely the tomes and passage scrolls, to accomodate solo farmers a little better. A little increase in the drops of gold would be nice in normal mode too. Alreajk 17:03, 23 April 2007 (EDT)
 * I'm sure more of any drop would be nice, but there has to be a line somewhere. And any line will always annoy someone. -- ab.er. rant [[Image:User Ab.er.rant Sig.png|sig]] 00:48, 24 April 2007 (EDT)