ArenaNet talk:Skill feedback/Mesmer/Visions of Regret

what do you mean??!!! this skill is freaking leet vs warriors and paragons....much better then empathy by far. Its like the backfire of adrenalin skills and almost all paragons and warriors have at least one.--Justice 20:11, 26 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Have you looked at a paragon bar lately? Count the number of skills that cost adrenaline.  You won't find more than 2.  Lightblade 10:45, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Empathy(as well as many non-elites and elites like Spiteful Spirit) effects all attacks(dealing 52 damage as opposed to  114 damage on visions of regret which only is versus adrenaline which represents 2 classes) not just skills and recharges 50% faster and isn't elite(effecting warrior, paragon, assassin, dervish, ranger and any caster who decides to attack). Backfire effects more classes(elementalist/monk/necro/mesmer/ritualist as well as some dervish/assassin/unorthodox characters) and is not elite. Bottom line is the lack of versatality coupled with elite status and poor recharge make this a undesirable elite. Mesmers have other elites for domination they could use which are far better, though this number isn't huge and many don't use mesmer elites they use skills like glyph of renewal.Oddeye 20:52, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

hmmm, i didnt realise this was being compared to ss and empathy...i suppose vs attack skills wouldnt be so bad but then it better have reduced dmg since too many attack skill users dont have a rex remover in their profesion line. maybe 1-100 at rank 15. although the new problem is that if say i drop empathy/visions on a warrior hes gonna get owned hard core. Then all mesmers would use that combo. Ive always viewed domination as anti spell caster and illusion as anti attacks with the main exception being elites. Elite skills tend to pull a skill stlye from another attribute line to round out a build. Much like ZB for protection and HH/condition/hex removers in healing.--Justice 22:34, 26 February 2008 (UTC) Visions of regret is one of those kinda skills but if you said empathy was better at it i would agree. Maybe its more for pvp anti warrior spiking?--Justice 22:34, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

An example of what I am saying I would like is lets say a warrior used Eviscerate(adrenaline+attack) he would take(level 14 values) 52(empathy)+114(visions of regret)=166 which is what he would take now. Now lets say he used Bulls Strike(energy attack) he would take 52 from empathy and 57 from visions of regret which would be 109. Now lets say he used fear me(adrenaline shout) he would only take 57 because its adrenaline "shout". Now I feel that the energy cost would likely need to be raised to 15 to go along with the shorter recharge and empathy duration but it would be more versatile and interesting skill. Mesmers have an anti-adrenaline non-elite in soothing images which costs 15 energy recharges in 5 seconds and stops adrenaline gain from adjacent enemies.Oddeye 23:33, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

Elite Hex Spell. For 5...17...20 seconds, target foe takes 30...102...120 damage whenever that foe uses an attack skill. even with this, it would be very underpowered imo 189.70.185.150 00:05, 27 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Sounds better with attack skills rather than adren skills. Adren skills only makes it useful against Warriors & Paragons, Attack skills would mean it could be used agains Sins & Rangers as well. Ajax Baby Eater 07:59, 27 February 2008 (UTC)


 * What would people think about dropping the cost to 5, cast time to 1/4 second, recharge to 8 or 10 and duration to 5 to allow this skill to function more like clumsiness used to, without the interrupt and can affect multiple skills, so you use it quickly on someone when they are about to use adrenal skills? For example, plant this on someone foolish enough to use Lion's Comfort during cast or dump it on a Shock Axe just before he spikes, reversing the spike. I don't think we really need another skill that functions just like empathy and insidious parasite, stacking those on a warrior or paragon is annoying enough. It doesn't really address the problem of it only affecting two classes, perhaps making it attack skills instead could help further. 141.14.133.231 08:30, 27 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Have it effect all attack skills instead of adrenaline skills. Maybe add shouts and chants on top of that, but that wouldn't be it's main effect.--Skye Marin 04:16, 29 February 2008 (UTC)


 * I like Oddeye's suggested change to split the damage. Right now Visions is simply weaker than Empathy. 216.218.214.2 14:42, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

please make this trigger on attack skills, so it will be viable.The only utility of this is against warriors, most paragons don't use more than 3 skills that requires adrenaline. 189.70.171.99 23:26, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Even better, make this trigger on skills now its an elite backfire.

With the current numbers at 16 Domination, backfire and Visions of Regret would do 273 damage per spell cast. If you get caught by a double damage boss with that in HM well... Instakill springs to mind. On Assassins using a 3 attack skill combo with the double strike effect loses 504 health in 3-4 seconds (Using 126 damage at 16 Domination). If it triggered like empathy on barrage... 756 damage in one maximum shot, with pain inverter on a boss like Shiro then the damage rating would be in the thousands vs a MM army, to change this skill in that direction without it being seriously rebalanced could ruin the PvE experience. --Don Knowall 18:25, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

Buff
I like the new version, but AoE was overkill. Btw, let the QQing begin over how it's a good damage skill, since monks can't just throw around Word of Healing to keep themselves alive in low end pvp. (No offense to monks, I like you guys. I just think Word of Healing has been too strong in low level areas such as AB.)  --Kalas Silvern 00:03, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The buff, like most of the buffs in the August 7th update, was probably meant to make it not complete trash in PvE. If it only affected a single target, it wouldn't be competitive with other professions' damage elites. If it's overpowered in PvP, they could make it a single target hex with AoE damage, or make the PvP version single-target without changing the PvE version. -- Gordon Ecker 02:13, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The new buff was a step forward for this skill but again, it's way too overpowered as an AOE hex that deals 90 armor ignoring damage everytime you activate a skill or a spell. Coming to think of it, isn't Spiteful Spirit inferior by a shit load when it comes to damage? Just a thought...--72.138.13.180 03:01, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It's still a very powerful skill in pvp. 90 aoe damage whenever you use any skill?  That's backfire on steroids.  ~Shard  [[Image:User Shard Sig Icon.png]] 03:03, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
 * In response to the anonymous comment, Spiteful Spirit has half the recharge time, can last over twice as long, triggers on regular attacks, its' AoE damage stacks if multiple targets are hexed with it and monsters in PvE generally attack between skill activations. -- Gordon Ecker 03:51, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Spiteful Spirit is arguably better in PvE. But this is a great Mesmer skill for PvE, and I think it's about time they had some direct damage to compete with elementalists/dervishes/whatever.  In PvP, however, this is stupidly, disgustingly overpowered.  I prefer Shard's suggestion, but I think Pluto's might be adequate as well.  --Jette 00:41, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
 * VoR is overpowered in PvP. Alternate it with Backfire and GoLE and target monk is finished. Don't even worry about hex removal as Wastrel's/Parasitic covers them. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:96.233.11.164 (talk).
 * It's not hard to balance this without 25/90. 10e 2s 15r "For 8 seconds, target foe and all adjacent foes take (current) damage whenever they use a skill while not under the effects of another Mesmer hex. After 8 seconds, all of your skills of the same attribute are disabled for 5 seconds". Now it can't be alternated with backfire, and can't be abused with Wastrel's Worry spam. Also reduced duration and recharge to make it a bit less passive.

82.83.40.124's Issue
I sympathize with you. Its true. You can head here and read our(ShadowFog,Auron,NuclearVII) discussions on the subject. Its nasty to catch and cast VoR on a caster while casting a spell and then doing Overload which you proceed to do Backfire just before he/she cast the spell to remove it and vice versa. As a Mesmer, I was playing with that build, but since it got popular when I posted, I started to take Hex Breaker which I remember they had this as a skill instead of a stance, but I dont think this answer the problem. I still believe every class should kill one way or the other but if its a overkill it needs to be look out for by skill balancers.--ShadowFog 20:02, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Imho VoR does not fit in the Inspiration attribute line, it would be the first damage-dealing skill in this line ever. For instance you won't find energy-managing skills in Domination Magic either. --Igis 18:31, 18 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Guilt and Shame say O HAI.
 * If those said "gain" Energy, I would agree with you, nonsign. However, they steal Energy and are mostly used for the amount of Energy pressure they put on their target. Plus, being Energy stealing they still have the chance of returning no Energy at all. (Cast Shame, they have 5 Energy and cast a spell so when you "steal" yours they have 0 to steal.) Still, Guilt and Shame are hardly reasons to merit putting this in Inspiration, as that line is completely devoid of damage, iirc. [[Image:User Bathory Spirit to Flesh.jpg|18px]] Bathory   talk  01:45, 26 May 2009 (UTC)

74.229.66.241's Issue
That seems like a good idea.--ShadowFog 17:40, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Visions of Regret doesn't interrupt or remove anything. IMO this suggestion should be removed or rewritten to make sense. -- Gordon Ecker 01:46, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
 * He/she's saying that this elite should be like a Empathy and Backfire all in one, by"...counter..." he/she means, so this way you can at least you can use signets and stances without being penalized.--ShadowFog 11:33, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Don't need to make a counter. Just make this 3 seconds cast and everything will be fine. Oh, and WW that does 100 damage is imbl too. Lightblade 18:30, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, plus it's a 1/4 cover hex with no recharge. ~Shard  [[Image:User Shard Sig Icon.png]] 02:29, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Nerf this kthnxbye

 * ROFL. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:72.71.229.129 (talk).

anytime Izzy. -- Readem 02:06, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

Falconeye's proposal
Great idea, assuming the duration isn't too long for PvP. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 04:58, 6 April 2009 (UTC)
 * And if the duration is too long for PvP, it could be changed from an area hex to a single target hex with area damage. -- [[Image:User Gordon Ecker sig.png]] Gordon Ecker (talk) 09:38, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Leave as is.
I love monking against this as with spirit bond on the target this provides only minor pressure and is essentially a waste of the enemy's elite. Kumlekar 03:50, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
 * hurr durr --Jette [[Image:User_Jette_awesome.png|19px]] 09:44, 26 May 2009 (UTC)