Talk:Horns of the Ox

Horrid nerfing
While we are expiriencing a "nerf assassin damage to hell" fest, how about we make daggers deal 0-1 damage max. no wait!! that is too much make it 0-0 and 1 damage on a critical hit. Kraken 15:59, 14 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Are you a PvE-only player, or just somebody who only ran HotO spam and/or SP? Faer 11:53, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * I used it with many of my combos to activate the falling attacks, I do PvP, but i don't even have SP unlocked yet. So i am complaining because now this recent nerf killed half of the 20-30 builds I have made. Hats-off to anet for promoting creativity. Kraken 19:26, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

The skill was overpowered to begin with. Genji

Funny how people started noticing it was overpowered AFTER it got nerfed.

Please sign your comments with forur of these ~. Yes it is true it was overpowered. but guess what, it is supposed to be. Dual attacks are ment to hit harder than other attacks because to use them you have to hit with at least 2 other attacks that are very underpowered. so now that Horns is underpowered it is useless because no one is going to use such a worthless finisher attack. Kraken 18:01, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

This skill may hit less, but it still has the knockdown, so why are you whining?

Picture this if avatar of melandrew was nerfed to give 1-11 bonus health and immunity from conditions for its duration, don't you think some dervs might complain even though it still gives immunity from conditions? I mean they can still use their wearying strike combo so they should just STFU. Kraken 19:55, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

it really sucks, it might look nice, but especially in AB you hardly find a fo not adjacent to an ally, so ur chain is screwed

So whining sins should STFU too then?

No I am saying what would happen if avatar of melandrew was nerfed, and there would be good reason for it. Assassins should not have all of their current builds killed just to nerf SP assassins. If arcane echo was nerfed to have a 3 secound duration it would kill the mesmer class, because most mesmer builds hinge on this build, same thing for if prot monks were nerfed via protective spirit by makeing its effect to allow no more than 50% health loss from one attack. these are skills, along with horns, that are probably the most basic skills from the class, they are skills that nerfing them is a nerf to the entire class. (by the way sign your comments with four ~ plz) Kraken 15:04, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

taken from what you said, nerfing of those skills would force people to use skills that are not used as often as the other. Genji 12:24, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

No, these skills are the basis of the classes. for example prot spirit, this is such a basic skill that removing it from gameplay by nerfing it to allow 50% would destroy any prot monk at all, even if the nerf was only targeted at 55 monks. the point is that although anet could destroy the 55 monk build like this, it would also destroy all other prot monks so they would better focus on the other skills that are used. horns and trampleing are the basic and only daggermastery KDs for assassins, takeing the damage from them might as well make them into lead attacks because, KD does not stack. if anet decides to reduce the damage fine, but they better make them KD opponents for 4 seconds then, because these are dual attacks and now the hitting twice makes them qualify as very weak skills, where as they had been average and balanced before. Kraken 16:22, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

That makes much more sence then what you were saying last time. Genji 19:09, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

This skill was overpowered. But sins need to stop complaining. It still rpovides the KD. Someone was saying if someone nerfed AoM people would complain they would cause there would be no point. If used with the right build u can keep them nearly always on the ground. This was a good nerf in my opinion. Also yes I do have a sin and would use builds taking advatage of the nearly permanite knock down. This is a lot better.

I know I'm late, but I must say that any assasin build that NEEDS this skill should also NOT be relying on a lead attack to get to offhand. Golden Phoencix and Black Spider would allow a sin to skip the lead, and then follow up with a horns of the Ox. I'd also like to say that even though this has been nerfed, you must realize it still does Knock Down. Knockdown shouldn't be underestimated. There are few non-elite knockdowns that are have such an easy condition to satisfy, since many clothies will kite from a assasin, therby leaving them open to this. It seems to me that assassins are meant to kill caster classes, but have a harder time (in general) with warriors (possibly dervishes, but I don't play them). StatMan 05:31, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

doesn't it atk 3 time in stead of twice?|Killer demon  21:08, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Suggested Changes
Now i do not intend to to complain about this skill's nonexistent damage but it still is an underpowered skill because of al its limiting factors so instead of asking for damage back, i will make a few suggestions on how to make it less underpowered without really doing anything to it. First anet could make the KD unconditional, so that even if the target has an allie right next to them it would still cause a KD. Or anet could increase the length of time that the KD is active, perhaps to 4 seconds. As it is now dealing a maximum of 9 dmg from each hits, and not doing anything else if the foe is standing next to an ally, not to mention haveing to use 2 other attacks that are also rather weak, makes this skill almost useless except as a KD, which does not even would on anyone who is in a group. Kraken 16:04, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
 * EELLLL OOOOHHH EELLLLL Four second KD duration... unconditional KD... dude, if anything, a proper buff would maybe just bring the damage up to 15 at 12 dagger mastery or something, or perhaps make the KD LESS conditional (dunno how exactly to do that but, whatever). Those other ideas are obscenely overpowered.  KaHasuken 22:12, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Please, check out the Knock Down Page, and list all the unconditional non-elite KD's that don't hurt you (Hammer Bash is the closest, but it causes you to lose all adrenalin]]. The skills that have conditional KD's that are non-elite, that are the easiest to fulfill are assassin skills.  Iron Palm, Entangling Asp, Mark of Instability, to name a few.  I think that you are spoiled from playing a assassin too long.  You aren't supposed to be able to KD people at will, yet assassins have quite a selection of non-elites that can be used to predictably KD almost anyone.  StatMan 19:40, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
 * And if it was unconditional it would be waaay to easy for sin to Knocklock...Moebius strike + this (if unconditional) would be way to overpowered,and this is a nice skill as it is...in PvP pretty much anyone with a brain dont stand next to each other to avoid AoE so its not all that hard to achieve the knockdown. Fire and deaths 07:10, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

related
dont you think we should add "youre all alone"?
 * No, we usually group by similar effects, not by similar conditions that should be met. StatMan 06:04, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

"foe is not adjacent to any allies"
"If struck foe is not adjacent to any allies," <-- Your allies or target's allies? --Aldarik 00:57, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Their allies. [[image:User_Yena_Newsig1.png‎|Talk‎]] ena. 00:58, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

KD
Do minipets count as allies, thus preventing the KD? Yeah, I'm aware that you get additional energy from Leadership in this way.--AP-DarkPortal 23:32, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
 * not replicable. In PvE the AI dosnt have minis, and in PvP you cannot take out a mini for just that reason. &mdash;  Scythe  23:35, 10 Sep 2010 (UTC)
 * Couldn't you do it in a scrimmage match?-- User Oneshot O.JPG ne shot.   23:36, 10 Sep 2010 (UTC) 
 * What I meant is for me to use the minipet, preventing AI from KDing me.--AP-DarkPortal 23:39, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
 * oh ^^ dunno, leaning towards wont be KD'd tho, cuz they are considered allies for skills like "You're All Alone!". Not ganna test cuz there are very few creatures in the game that will use HoTO, ever (at least in PvE iirc) &mdash;  Scythe  23:48, 10 Sep 2010 (UTC)