Talk:Guild Wars Beyond/Archive 1

"Keeping an old game new" reference

I know that there was a Massively Flameseeker's column, and in one of them, they mentioned that the staff of GW would be focusing on keeping an old game new. Maybe this pertains to it? --Sage Talk 22:42, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

Pre announcement additions

They haven't been officially noted to be part of Guild Wars Beyond. I'll leave them for now, but I'm just throwing it out there. --Sage Talk 22:58, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

So.

Just gona explain pritty much (around) 50 years into the future before our characters should die?... Great... --Neil2250 , Render Lord 23:03, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

Bloodstone Sacrifice

There's evidence that Orrions were already doing it... (however what popped out was usually Nightmares instead possibly meaning that some in Orr still worshiped Menzies), plus Menzies' Army closely resembles the White Mantle... Not to get too Spoiler-ry here; But isn't a little inconsistent for Linsey to say that sacrifices on the Bloodstones were directly to the Mursaat when the Bloodstones were actually made by the 5 Gods to help contain the Titans at the time? (aka: the Arch Mages of the Four Schools of Magic), along with Abbadon and his Foundry of Failed Creations? Sacrifices on them simply Re-powered them and reaffirmed the barriers originally set forth by the 5 Gods... Saying anything beyond that assigns them(the Mursaat?) a Partisan bias in that conflict.
....or was this a slip of the tongue and she's witholding info that the Mursaat still have access to bloodstones that they're repowering for other more sinister means now? I mean she did come out as say they're the bad guys right? ...But containing the Titans wasn't an antagonistic goal. --ilr 23:47, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

Interesting point.... Maybe the Mursaat aren't so bad after all. Good intentions, Bad execution anyone?--Sage Talk 00:14, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

There's a pretty extensive debate on the Mursaat discussion page about how good or evil they actually were. Personally, it seems to me that the mursaat were pretty much looking out for themselves, and their actions (keeping the titans sealed) just happened to benefit the rest of Tyria as well.

What does all this have to do with Guild Wars Beyond, though? 68.118.250.100 01:07, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

"White Mantle were really a sinister cult that sacrificed innocent people to the unseen ones" ... It's one or the other, it can't be both. --ilr 09:10, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Wait, evidence of the Orrians sacrificing people? Where is this comes from? The Nightmares are not all connected to the Shadow Army - think of it like this: "All shadow army are Nightmares, but not all Nightmares are Shadow Army." The Shadow Army holds no connection to the White Mantle, this was stated by a dev (I think Linsey). The Bloodstone was not made to hold back the Titans, it was made to reduce the use of magic. The Soul Batteries and the Door of Komalie are used to hold back the Titans, the Bloodstone is just acting like a battery charger. What is this "Arch Mages of the Four Schools of Magic"? I've never heard of such a thing.

Irl, your knowledge of lore is very flawed. Not a single word was correct. Except that the Foundry of Failed Creations and Abaddon are on the other side of the Door of Komalie. -- Konig/talk 09:36, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

LULZ!, You couldn't even spell my 3-letter name right, WTF do you know about Accuracy? Go read the Lore again and don't just skim over it this time. --ilr 17:46, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm slightly dislexic, so apologies if I do irl instead of ilr or jsut instead of just. It happens. But honestly, I know the lore, and I didn't skim over it. I read it over, multiple times. -- Konig/talk 17:50, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Not to mention that the Mantle were being used by the Mursaat to gather the Flameseeker chosen to be sacrificed to power the Door of Komalie. It's probabaly the deal of that's how the bloodstones will only work, so the Mursaat didn't see any other way. They didn't quite voluntarily choose to do so. It's the White Mantle that blew it out of proportion with their opression and such.--Sage Talk 13:57, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Interesting. I've always read it the other way around: The Flameseeker Prophecies tell of the Mursaat meeting their demise at the hands of the chosen, so I always saw the sacrifices as getting rid of the chosen to keep themselves safe. The charging of the Soul Batteries always seemed like a positive side-effect of sorts to me. -- 84.178.113.129 15:44, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Note that the Nightmares looking like White Mantle reskins is just a side-efefct of making models from them. It is have been already stated (and I think it's noted in the unanswered questions project) that they have no relation whatsoever to each other. If I had to make up any relation to explain that lore-wise, it would be that Nightmares look like White Mantles because Nightmares would shape after things that players hate or fear, an nothing else. By that theory, If players feared or hated bananas, then the Menzies army would consist of dark desaturated spiked bananas. MithTalk 16:06, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

I personally come to this wiki so that I can check something that I have forgotten, so I am thankful for guys like irl for that - their theories on lore however .... 84.92.169.252 00:41, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

The prophecy in Prophecies was the end of the Mursaat by the titans. The titans are actually constructs controlled by the Scepter of Orr and their destructive rampage was because of the Lich's command to them. The scepter vanishes at the end of Prophecies, so it is not possible to reverse the Lich's command, thus they continue to do what they were ordered to do. As for the bloodstones, I believe only two things are known - they keep magic separated and sacrifices on them are used to power the soul batteries used by the Mursaat. I would agree with the point of view that the Mursaat are out for themselves. --Falseprophet 19:08, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Ah ha! You are incorrect, the Titan's Rampage was not because of the Lich, they rampaged because they were angry with humans for trying to control them (as far as they were concerned the Lich was a human). If you read some of the quest dialogues and the Big Masses of text, you would see this. The scepter had nothing to with CONTINUEING the rampage. They can only be controlled whilst someone holds the scepter. Sorry for bad spelling--Dervashah talk 06:38, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

Ebonhawke and the retcon

The claim of the retcon is due to [ this], which could very well either be a typo, or a generalization of the date. It says "250 years" instead of "230 years" - since the fall is said to take place at about 20 years after EN. I don't think it is a retcon and, aside from that tiny note, there is nothing to say it is a retcon. I say remove that note.
I also say to remove the note about Keiran and Gwen since that too is unconfirmed and the only evidence is what was first from an article (with no credentials I saw that says "this info comes from Anet") that said that Gwen, an elementalist, and Keiran are "destined" to be married and establish Ebonhawke. Then nearly 24 hours later, other articles from different sites came out with a word for word copy, with the single change of changing elementalist to mesmer. I'm doubting that is official, so until we have more reason to believe it is official I think it would be best to leave speculation - which the page currently states that it is speculation - off of the page. -- Konig/talk 19:57, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, it looked legit at first, but upon inspection, has nothing to fall back on. In this, which is linked on guildwars.com, Linsey did not mention anything about Gwen and Keiran getting together. Rose Of Kali 20:09, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

I can't believe anyone thought that an article calling Gwen an ele was credible. Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ аІiсә ѕνәи Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ 20:24, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

The press release is legit. It can even be found at the NCSoft website - though unfortunately, the full contents that header links to are no longer available there. Cheiron 09:06, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm still skeptical about the press release, seeing how the part which is the point of concern is not ever pointed out. And I doubt that Anet and NCSoft communicate on every little thing. Edit: The 404 on the link just furthers my skepticism. -- Konig/talk 11:08, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I've already asked Regina about this. Let's see what she has to say, if anything. Rose Of Kali 13:38, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

NCSOFT DOESN'T KNOW GWEN IS A MESMER?? Oh wait... It's NCSoft. Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ аІiсә ѕνәи Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ 20:38, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

The official press release from Anet has been fixed. (Both the link and Gwen's profession.) Shouldn't this be used as ref.2 instead of the Rock, Paper, Shotgun article?

Something for Pre

It's just a suggestion/thought in a way, But it would be great if they could add another area and maybe Rin into pre-searing. As part of Guild wars Beyond so that we can meet a young Lt. Thackeray. Some other bonuses for people in who play in Pre-searing is that Rin could have A better weapon smith and maybe a few new people to get some more skills such as Hammer skills for warriors, and Resurrect for Monk instead of the signet. It's just a thought. Like Rin could be right by the wall and the door way is in Green Hills. Here is what i am trying to say.

And aggain just a suggestion/thought. --♥♥Sweet ♥ Sweet♥♥ 04:20, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

The Live Team doesn't have the resources to create an entire city, nice idea but very unlikely. Reaper of Scythes** 16:41, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

How do they not? last year they managed to do that Zaishen Menagerie so why not make a extra city. 77.102.52.40

It is very unlikely they touching anything more in Pre-Searing. Even a simple NPC for costumes was declined. It seems Nicholas was the last thing they'll ever add there. At least they completed the Krytan armor with headgear piece. MithTalk 23:49, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Linsey had already said in a past interview with Kill Ten Rats that the Live Team will not add anything to pre. Also, I think the Zaishen Menagerie was pre-existing, as one was able to see part of the map from HA's outpost for a LONG time before the Menagerie's release. And the Live Team doesn't have enough people for creation of new things. -- Konig/talk 23:51, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Pre is not a "game," it's a tutorial. Besides, the devs (especially Linsey) have expressed a solid stance on keeping Pre "as it is" - no "fancy" new stuff in there, not even as much as costumes. Rose Of Kali 01:01, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

To be fair, Pre is not much of a tutorial. Unless you pay attention to the warning messages, you are on your own if you want to learn anything, unlike the other two halves of learning areas, in which an NPC takes you through a quick basic tutorial. And the other half of the learning areas is until you get the Signet of Capture, that is, Shing Jea, Istan and Ascalon/Northern Shiverpeaks, in the basic tutorial, you don't get to try things like map travel or making parties. Not that it matters much. I'm just saying that players that make their very first character in Shing Jea and Istan seem to be 'more prepared' and make less 'stupid questions' than those that start in Pre. Not that it matters much for this, though. MithTalk 11:33, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

(Reset indent) Well, the problem with adding significant content to Pre is that it's only accessible by characters made in Prophecies, who have not seared yet, and access is lost forever once you leave. So, this means that any Pre content has a very limited audience. Anyone who doesn't have a "perma-pre" or a spare character slot to roll a new Pre char, will completely miss out on the results of all the work required to put this together. This in my mind is the primary reason they don't want to put a bunch of work into Pre, and I completely understand that. Rose Of Kali 16:32, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Still would have been nice to have a new area in Pre but I guess thats just whishfull thing then. But I really would have loved to seen Rin before it got sent to hell by the Charr. --♥♥Sweet ♥ Sweet♥♥ 16:36, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

(Edit conflict) "...made in Prophecies, who have not seared yet. - Rose Of Kali" We dont burn O.O - Also, my opinion on the matter is that Pre is 2 years before the rest of the game.And GW:B was designed for events that happen AFTER EOTN:, Making anything extra happening in pre, Canon. --Neil2250 , Render Lord 16:38, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

FYI, "searing a character" is a common expression for taking a character out of Pre, regardless of how much or little sense it makes linguistically. >_< Rose Of Kali 18:08, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

You overdid the rurik, Looks like shrimp :D --Neil2250 , Render Lord 18:11, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Ignoring most of the conversation and jumping up to Sweet's first post: I'd rather see them make Piken Square a town for pre searing. A weapon smith would be nice plus the usual npcs (merchant, guards, etc). The town is already there. Couldn't they jsut reword some code and add a portal to the entry way? No more need for "gate monkeys" as well as a reduce in spam for Ascalon City. It'd be even nicer (imo) if it required a level restriction to enter the town via an npc guard outside, say 9+? That'd eliminate "noobs" just looking for power leveling. Back up to my point about spam it would probably move a lot of the weapon trade chats over to Piken as well. -- Magic Talk 02:47, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

Yeah that would work too. It is a pain of having to need a GM just to get Charr Kits and so forth.--♥♥Sweet ♥ Sweet♥♥ 05:13, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

With a Piken Square outpost I could go. The area is always empty, no charr go near it, and the base of the area is already made. You could even put there some younger versions of NPCs that would later be found as part of the Ebon Vanguard. But I would only let in characters at level 16 and higher. MithTalk 14:13, 19 May 2010 (UTC)

Oh cool. Yeah, I really like that idea. Have an elite outpost in pre! --Musha 13:54, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

I think it'd be awesome to see Rin and several of the other cities before the Searing. Honestly though I think it would probably be best handled by another Bonus Mission Pack that followed Vanguard members before, immediately after, and actually during the Searing. As much as I would love to see it in free content, I have to wonder how much manpower and budget they can devote to creating Pre cities that would actually satisfy the fan base.Kalessin 20:16, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Guild Wars...in SPACE

That's all that came to mind when I read Guild Wars Beyond. And then I read the article. And then I understood. Arcdash 19:34, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

What else then "Oh dear God, please save us!" should I say? Nope, can't think of anything.

I wanna kill an alien 8D --Neil2250 , Render Lord 19:07, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Go kill a human in GW then, Neil. They are the most alien race in GW that we know of (they're the only confirmed race that isn't native to Tyria - Forgotten is semi-confirmed because it was originally stated they weren't from Tyria, but now that's being questioned). -- Konig/talk 19:17, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Organization

It needs to be changed. Not only is Zinn's Task not core, neither is Trial of Zinn - both are, in fact, multiple as core means any campaign, while those two require all campaigns. Big difference. Also, since Trial of Zinn requires all 4 games, and as does the Gwen/Thackeray stuff, the WiK is also requiring all 4 games as the trial and EN stuff is part of the WiK, thus the WiK is not "Prophecies."
I suggest we remove the campaign bit, put the Zinn's Task back under unconfirmed unless someone has a source for an IP's change, and organize things by the name of events (that is, replace the campaign line with the WiK line and then move the three things (Zinn, G/T, and WiK changes) under that). BTW, technically, the trial and Gwen/Thackeray stuff is part of WiK as it is explaining why they aid the SB and Salma in that. -- Konig/talk 19:27, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Yep! Agreed. Does anybody disapprove of Konig's proposal? --Musha 17:46, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Not me, "Core" goes for either "Battle Isles" or "Any Campaign". But "All campaigns" is definitely different to "Any campaign". MithTalk 19:06, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Yup, and thus far, the only "core" has been the ZQuest, Nicholas the Traveler, and Dhuum additions. Everything else has been "Multiple Campaigns" - whether Proph+EN or Proph+Fac+NF or Proph+Fac+NF+EN, there has been no single campaign (even if the majority of something took place in a single campaign - e.g., WiK) and minimal core. -- Konig/talk 00:24, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Charr?

After seeing the dialogue scene between the ebon vanguard and evianna(sp?), did anyone else instantly think about the next step in GWB being the final fight against the charr?Siris Of Elona 20:53, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Final? Why would it be the final? Next, sure. But final? Nah, there's so much to go on. Though, annoyingly, most of the good stuff mentioned in the Movement of the World is 30-70 years beyond EotN. Including the Fall of Ascalon, Joko's invasion, Usoku, and the first dragon's awakening. -- Konig/talk 00:47, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

Ehhh poor choice in the word final. But out of curiosity, if it was king Adelhbern(sp?) that uses foefire(sp?), shouldn't that come sooner rather than later? he was an old guy in pre..Siris/talk 01:22, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

There are multiple cases in GW of people living to an age older than Adelbern's age at death. He is in his 60's during Proph/Factions and thus he'd be in his 90's come his unnatural death. And it is Evennia, Adelbern, and Foefire. -- Konig/talk 01:26, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

Touche. And i got one out of the three spelled correctly. if i remember spelling class, i believe i failed. :) Siris/talk 02:58, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

Start

So if the Halloween additions are decidedly a part of GWB, then the opening sentence, saying the updates and additions began with the 5th birthday, are kinda false, aren't they? (P.S. I'm still just lurking) calor (talk) 21:19, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

If it is found to be the start, or should it even be as early as M.O.X. and Zinn's Task, then the first sentence could be changed. But as of yet, the first known part of GWB is the WiK, everything else is just speculation. -- Konig/talk 03:20, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

What makes you think the Halloween additions were part of GWB? And, actually, the first known parts of GWB were the dialoges between Gwen and Lt. Thackeray in the HoM. --Musha 14:02, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

And said dialogues are, in fact, a part of the WiK (kind of - you need them to go through the whole WiK). -- Konig/talk 15:54, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

Some parts were linked and some 'absorbed' by WiK. You need to finish Prophecies or Eye of the North to start it, but they are not part of it. Same with Zinn's missions, the trial is part of WiK, but not the missions. MithTalk 15:01, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

As the name suggests, Guild Wars Beyond is about furthering the GW story line to link it up with the changes which take place leading into Guild Wars 2. From what I've seen the only thing which fits into that idea is the War in Kryta and the Gwen/Thackeray story. All other content the Live Team has made has nothing to do with furthering the Guild Wars story, even the Dhuum stuff is self contained lore fluff to revamp the Underworld. 122.105.106.192 11:25, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

....so what you are saying is the Guild Wars Beyond ACTUALLY began...when prophecies was released??? Man Arenanet had everything planned out well :)--Flaming Renegade 06:21, 17 July 2010 (UTC)