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Averting Power Creep[edit]

I've suggested many suggestions to avert power creep:

  • Primal Rage Primal Rage: Replace the IMS with either 5...17...20% armor penetration or an additional 5...27...33% chance to critical. Decrease recharge to 4 to compensate.

==> So this skill will read. Elite stance.Frenzy and you get 5% AP. ==> Adding critchances is ok I guess,wouldn't recommend it anyway. (lets keep sundercrits at the rate they are right now ?)

The most important step is to remove the IMS. I vote for a rework as I don't think an elite Frenzy will ever be balanced. The hard part is what to change it to.
  • Dismember Dismember: Increase the adrenaline cost to 7

==> Perhaps overnerf but yh

Bye bye power creep zzzz.

==> If you think dismember is the pinacle of powercreep,then well you're wrong.Its just one of these skills balanced by the rate at wich you gain adrenaline.See what Primal rage does ?

Dude, it's powercreeped. Very obviously powercreeped. It needs a nerf to put it back in place. This skill will always be ran on bars without Eviscerate. Therefore, the more powerful it is, the less reason you have to take Eviscerate. It currently outclasses Eviscerate when there are elites worth taking around. Therefore, the skill needs a hit. This is basic relative balancing.
  • Enraging Charge Enraging Charge: Change functionality to: "Stance. For 5...10...11 seconds, you move 25% faster and gain 50% more adrenaline. Ends if you use a skill."

==> hit the real problem : Flail

This is a rework. Flail can be reworked as well, I just don't have any inspiration currently.

==> Just nuke it.Enraging charge would be fine as a versatile extra slot filler.As long as it doesn't have flail it doesn't need nuke.

I'll think up a rework, ok? This skill is now balanced and I do not think Flail will be very problematic with this skill changed to this.
  • Freezing Gust Freezing Gust: Increase recharge to 10, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. Target foe moves 66% slower for 1...6...7 seconds. Initial effect: Deals 20...68...80 damage to foes suffering from a Water Magic Hex/moving foes."

==> Ohaithar shardstorm I like you to.

Powercreeped skill gets nerfed to shardstorm level.

==> So they are either useless or still push shard storm or are a copy ? Good thinkin Lilondra User Lilondra Sig.jpg 09:46, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

That was one of my worries, as you can see on my feedback page. Yes, the skill probably can get a better rework.
  • Winter's Embrace Winter's Embrace: Increase energy cost to 10, recharge to 15, casting time to 1. Increase duration to 2...7...8 seconds}}.

==> Basically balancing all the things that need to be balanced.Ok skill.

Yeah, dunno why they ever made a 5 energy 3/4c skill.

10 Energy1 Activation time15 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 1...6...7 seconds, target foe moves 66% slower. Additionally, the next time that foe casts a hostile Spell it fails and the caster takes 25...85...100 damage." ==> Don't like the function you're giving it but atleast its better then the one now.

Care to explain why you do not like the function?

==> To begin with It doesn't feel good,its just another hex snare and I don't know if the second clause is a good idea.You seem to try to bring antispikesupport to other professions being under the impression its skillfull.But if it isn't in the niche the prof should fill then why add it.Should a ele be watching for a spike by using this ? Lilondra User Lilondra Sig.jpg 09:46, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

If that's the way they want to use it, sure.

==> OHAITHAR MELANDRUS ARROWS I LIEK YOU TO.I herd glass arrows got nuked wich iz good but nolongerviable eh.

It's a rework. The new version is basically an unblockable Barbed Arrows. Will it see use? Dunno, Barbed Arrows probably needs to take a hit.

==> Like I suggested a while ago but melandru's arrows will push it and is actually a ok skill at best atm.

  • Dual Shot Dual Shot: Decreased recharge to 5, changed functionality to: "Bow Attack Skill. Shoot an arrow to target foe and up to 1 nearby foe. These arrows deal 25% less damage."

==> Based on my forked,I don't think dual shot needs change.Hit Orders,hit envy and hit other buffs.

Why leave the option open for abuse? Rangers shouldn't have damage and ranged damage in general should be kept at a minimum.

==> There is no option open for abuse if you kill the supporting skills.This won't be used since savage/needling are just as good at poison spread.

I don't want Rangers to be any good at supporting in spikes. It's outside their niche. Rangers have enough niches already. Concerning the poison spread, I highly doubt it. Normal attack -> Savage Shot (something all Rangers have) is roughly equal to the poison spread this skill provides and so is normal attack -> Needling Shot (upside: recharges immediately if used on low health targets, downside: deals low damage). Taking this skill or Needling Shot increases the amount of Condition spreading you do quite a bit.

==> My forked has more sexyness.Also same niche as dualshot imo.

Mine is more fun. It's been proven.

==> What ? You got a testserver ?

  • Melandru's Shot Melandru's Shot: Give it normal attack speed, reduce recharge to 7 seconds.

==> OK

  • Mind Blast Mind Blast: Make the skill inflict Burning (1...3...3 seconds) instead of the damage. <---- Credit goes to Nuke.

==> Good catch from nuke.

  • Fast activation skills for Rangers: Just revert. Rangers shouldn't be able to properly deal direct damage.


  • Natural Stride Natural Stride: Increase recharge to 30, duration to 5...10...11 seconds.

==> Well who we have there,Dodge! I've sure missed you.

This skill probably should get its recharge reduced to 25.

==> OK

==> Why ? Not being able to help your team out is a bigger hit then you'd think.At most hit the recharge.

Simple: Self Condition removal is something I do not like. It makes solo play too strong.

==> TBH you need soloskills for splits.

Duh. Again, relative balancing. If solosplits get too strong things gets borked. We have seen in the past that it was balanced without self-Condition removal around.
  • Punishing Shot Punishing Shot: Change functionality to: "Bow Attack Skill. Interrupts target foe's action. If that action was a Spell, that foe loses 0...6...8 energy." <--- this skill isn't exactly powercreeped but as it supports R-spike it needs a rework. This new version will be extremely useful on normal ranger bars while it doesn't promote spikes any more than Savage Shot does (ie, not at all).

==> Thx for reworking my idea.Its ok but like I said just hit the midline skills in rangerspike already.

Meh, mine is better. Your idea is basically Debshot with an interrupt slapped to it. Not very useful. This version has the normal Savage Shot sexiness with a useful penalty instead of random damage. Dark Morphon 09:15, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

==> Read again I said it was better.Although i'm starting to doubt if ti needs a huge rework/is healthy.

The current version will always lead to R-spike. This version is a lot better.

Stopping Hexway[edit]

To stop Hexway, I suggest functionality changes to most Necromancer skills and some Mesmer skills (I'll put some up later). The most important thing is to make sure Hexes do not deliver direct pressure (degeneration and the likes). This is a niche already filled by Conditions. Hexes should be about fucking over your opponent, not spamming on recharge and look at your opponents die to degen. I also suggest reworks for currently underpowered skills.

Some reworks:

5 Energy1 Activation time12 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 3 seconds, the next time target foe blocks, that foe takes 10...50...60 damage and loses an Enchantment. ==> OK

10 Energy1 Activation time15 Recharge time "Hex Spell. Also hexes foes adjacent to your target. For 4...9...10 seconds, those foes suffer from -1...3...3 health degeneration and attack 50% slower. For each foe, the next time that foe is blocked, that foe is also knocked down and this hex ends on that foe." ==> What makes me like this change is the fact that it isn't maintainable.So you get this moment of relief where the pressure of this skill fades.Yet it doesn't support euroness like DA does.

==> Ask yourself : Is a necro supposed to deliver antispike ? IMO no,ints on rangers and mesmers and prot/infuse on backline should do.This either won't see use or would have OP stats as long as it fills a antispike niche.Aswell as its actually a cool skill if you nuke out the OP Hexes like faint.

Wait till I have a function, ok?

==> you're missing the point.Anything antispiky will be a bad function.

  • Defile Flesh Defile Flesh: Increase recharge to 20, decrease duration to 0...9...11 seconds, increase health reducal to 50%

==> Don't know tbh,could be ok I guess but I'm guessing its going to be like atrophy.

It's liek boom strong healing denial.

10 Energy¾ Activation time12 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 4 seconds, the next time target foe hits an ally with an attack, that ally gains 30...94...110 health." <-- Credit goes to Nuke. ==> I don't fully agree with nuke on this one.Just a crazy idea that proly wouldn't work is to make it a selfheal of some kind.

10% Sacrifice10 Energy1 Activation time12 Recharge time, "Hex Spell. Removes an Enchantment. If an Enchantment was removed in this way, that foe is Hexed with Lingering Curse for 2...8...10 seconds. While hexed, that foe suffers from -1...3...3 health degeneration and benefits 50% less from healing.

10 Energy1 Activation time15 Recharge time, "Hex Spell. Removes an Enchantment. If an Enchantment was removed, that foe and adjacent foes suffers from -1...3...3 health degeneration for 0...8...10 seconds." You aleady got lingering.Like I already told you you're basically just giving a enchantment removal for free right onto the build.LC and Suffering will still be usable and you can just strip attunes ,guardian and shit with this and save your other enchant removal for spikes.I don't know if you want a enchantmenthostile area and if enchantment removal isn't just something that is supposed to balance enchantments (read:add a counter) and shouldn't do much more.

Suffering needs a rework zzzzz.

10 Energy1 Activation time25 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 5...10...11 seconds, Spells targetting target foe only have half spell-casting range and that foe has -1...3...3 health degeneration." ==> Inspired on my WoD,Don't know if its better.

It's much more sexy.

==> Technically I got the chick spitting fire and you got the guy looking depressed so no.


10% Sacrifice10 Energy¼ Activation time20 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Spell. Interrupt target foe's action. If that action was a skill, that skill's attribute is reduced to 0 for 3...10...12 seconds." ==> Already had this discussion but w/e.I don't like adding ints on necro's.Although I must say its tempting at times.

The interrupt part is barely relevant. Like many mesmer interrupts, the important part of this skill is the effect.

17% Sacrifice1 Energy1 Activation time5 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 1...6...7 seconds, Enchantments take three times as long to cast on that foe but your and your allies' Spells take twice as long to cast. If that foe was already suffering from a Necromancer Hex, that foe takes 20...68...80 shadow damage instead." ==> Just put Defile on small spike assist(60ish) + enchant removal with 1 sec cast and desecrate on hard spike assist (80ish) with 2 sec cast.

Nah. I like this function.

==> Its a bad function imo but w/e.Your comparison to shatter enchant in game doesn't even make sense.

Huh? Are you talking about Desecrate here? Well, I could increase the damage to Shatter Enchantment levels, decrease the cost to 10 and removing the additional Enchantment removal. In fact, why the hell not. That'd fix it.

15 Energy1 Activation time25 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 6 seconds, the next time target foe is the target of an Enchantment Spell, that Spell fails and that foe takes 15...59...70 damage and loses an Enchantment."

10 Energy2 Activation time15 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. Deals 20...52...60 shadow damage. That foe is Hexed with Shadow of Fear for 2...10...12 seconds. While Hexed, allied Spells take twice as long to cast on that foe. ==> Besides the fact that I don't get why you want to add direct damage to necros like this I don't like the function in general.

Care to explain why?

==> You seem to have a trend pointing necro's towards spike assist.Something they didn't really have (barring shadowstrike) or should have.The extra effect will either be useless on spike (infuse and spirit bond won't really be affected unless they already cast slower but I think it caps) and might lead to problems in lower arenas.IF it doesn't add anything to gvg,is fine now and might cause problems then the change is bad.

Are you talking about Defile here? The longer cast time is to make sure using it to assist spikes is weaker than using it for pressure. The pressure is pretty big as it increases Guardian's cast time to 3(!) seconds.

5 Energy¾ Activation time12 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 4 seconds, the next time target foe uses an attack skill that foe is knocked down and the attack skill is disabled (0...16...20 seconds) ==> Ineptitude (on steroidz ?)

More like ranged Shield Bash. Ineptitude needs to be improved, by the way. Currently it's just "olook I uus diz on melee boom blind". Not very skillful.

==> No more like ineptitude because it IS ranged.2 of these would be crazy defense and you're adding spike assist aswell.Good thinkin bro .

Uhm, Distracting Shot on a Hammer attack or Blinding Flash before the spike kicks in would do roughly the same.

10 Energy1 Activation time20 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 6 seconds, the next time target foe is the target of an allied Spell with "heal" in its description, it fails and you steal 15...59...70 health from the healer." <--- NOTE: Shouldn't trigger on a heal from Divine Favor. Otherwise, that's all it would ever do. ==> Just keep current function and give it 20 recharge already.

This one is stylisher. Dark Morphon 09:21, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

==> Shure,why not.

Reworking Blood Magic[edit]

Currently, Blood Magic serves no other purpose than Bloodspike and some utilious Spells such as Strip Enchantment and Blood Ritual. This needs to change. I suggest following the pattern of Strip Enchantment, ie making it a support line. To do this I suggest the following changes:

10 Energy1 Activation time5 Recharge time "Enchantment Spell. For 5...13...15 seconds, target other ally inflicts Bleeding (5...17...20 seconds) with its physical attacks." Move to Blood Magic. Yh because we need bleedspread on frontline.If you're trying to remove the dead spot on sword wars I wouldn't count on it.Any decent team will dshot this and bye bye DW so people would still run Sever.Besides that its just a plain bad idea.

First of all, this skill needs to be reworked. It's laaaame. Secondly, if people want to use this on their Sword bars I have no problems with that. As you said, you still need to take Sever Artery. This skill would speed up the Deep Wound, which is of course useful. Thirdly, I think this will most likely see use on a Ranger. Doing pressure with both Bleeding and Poison is pretty strong, although it also makes your target more RCable.

=> If you are counting on RC to balance it out thats already bad.Another condition to spread is worse.I just assumed it was melee attacks for some reason.I'm just saying its broken and powercreep so bad.

Ugh. Of course you count on a commonly used skill to balance something out because it's common. Using two spreading Conditions has both up and downsides: You exert more pressure, but it's also easier to counter by RC. That's not something you should just ignore.

5 Energy1 Activation time8 Recharge time, change functionality to: "Hex Spell. For 3 seconds, the next time target foe blocks, that foe takes 10...50...60 damage and the attacking ally gains 0...2...3 strikes of adrenaline."

17% Sacrifice1 Activation time8 Recharge time Changed functionality to: "Signet. Inflicts Bleeding (5...13...15 seconds) and Cripple (5...9...10 second)." ==> I liked these 2 from the beginning

==> I'm starting to like the energy gain to some point but shure why not.IMO Nuke plague sending,Let necro's spend a elite to do anything more.Its similar to enraging charge the skills get alot weaker without their buddy.

Removing the energy gain is essential. Transferring all Conditions from an ally to you shouldn't net energy gain.

17% Sacrifice5 Energy¾ Activation time5 Recharge time, changed functionality to: "Enchantment Spell. For 1...7...8 seconds, target ally and nearby allies move 25% faster and gain 1 adrenaline on hitting attacks. For each ally, this skill ends the next time that ally uses a skill." Similar to my OoV.I'd like to see this one more expensive and not maintainable but perhaps (PERHAPS) more powerful..

I like the numbers on this one.

=> Its to get rid of orderspam tbh.

...? What has this Dark Fury to do with orderspam?

5% Sacrifice5 Energy1 Activation time5 Recharge time, "Enchantment Spell. Lose all Enchantments. For 10 seconds, gain +1...5...6 energy regeneration. Whenever you cast a Spell/Touch Skill, you lose 5% of your health for every Spell/Touch Skill you have casted while under the effect of this Enchantment. Ends if you use a non-Necromancer skill." ==> OoB fills the niche,There is no need for this one.

Offering of Blood would be a general skill, this would be better when you cast less Spells but worse when you use them a lot. Both would have their uses.

==> Keep dreaming Lilondra User Lilondra Sig.jpg 09:39, 1 January 2010 (UTC) Lilondra User Lilondra Sig.jpg 14:51, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Dark Morphon 09:27, 1 January 2010 (UTC)
Dark Morphon 14:11, 2 January 2010 (UTC)