Feedback:User/Fade8388/Overly Offensive

Overly Offensive
User	Fade8388
Categories	Mechanics

Hi there Anet devs,

Since there's just about a week left until launch, I know you guys are probably VERY busy with the whole optimization and game preparation work, so I'll try to be brief here.

The Broad Issue: Being Overly Offensive Oriented

Especially in PVP, I've noticed just how much both the number of player[s] advantage & revive/interruptions success play in on winning a fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFAlN6OSVOo&feature=player_embedded#!

It's teamwork but... I'm not sure if that's really fun when all you're doing in the game is stacking damage-related ticks (like this pro PVP player had so many videos of him 'stacking ticks on crits), that seemed to be his way of owning in a 1v1 situation in general (doing 2k damage consistantly with the right builds). I mean right now, the main issue that most PVPers have is coming up with the right synergy of builds and tactis. But eventually, damages will even out. I mean, clearly in the video y'all can tell that this Tangrium guy is ultimately doing more damage than the other guys because he knows how to build his synergy but mainly also knowing how to 'actually use his stacked ticks'. And ultimately that gives him the greatest advantage in PVP atm where most people know very little about how to "maximize dmg" (most players without proper synergy does about 100-500 damage - I tried PVP without any runes/traits compare to with runes/traits & I couldn't even hit above 1k).

[Off-topic: Dota 2 comparison]

In some situation if you play it right (in most RTS game), a pure CC person can take on a glass canon anyday of the week. It's all about positional play (who catches who off position). Is there any of that in GW2? The CC in GW2 doesn't seem to have much variation compare to offensively stack-able abilities.

Conceptual Issue(1): Understanding what Offense Means

When you guys (devs) said that you want GW2 to be an offensive oriented game, I want to clarify something about this concept.

There are many ways to create offense, but it ultimately does come down to doing damage. HOWEVER, it is impossible to say that "I want offense to be quick and fast all the time". That will ruin the whole concept of "playing offensive". Time is one of the key parts seperating what we call as a glass-canon, from burst player, from Crowd-Control player, and etc.

More Info: Roles Definitions

Think of there being a 10 second window for example when two players just stand still and hit each other:

If we stop fight at 1sec: A Burst player will do the most damage and give the most offense

If we stop fight at 5 sec: A DPS player will do the most damage and give the most offense

If we stop fight at a 10 sec: Both DPS & Burst should do about the same damage (so it's fair scale).

The only difference is in a real fight, offense can be cut-down with positioning and interruption skill, which is what it is about - in a brawl-conceptual game like Gw2.

Conceptual Issue(2): Put 'More' offense into other Areas

(The following skill effects either don't exist or are lacking in the game)

Suggestion 1: Have defensive skills which triggers better offense.

Possible Example: There could be a skill effect where if a player gets hit by magic damage, he/she gets bonus ticks or stacks on his offensive skills.

Suggestion 2: Balance out the CC in class offense. (Someone other than an elementalist, engineer, or necro) should have better CC weapons in the game (Currently as a warrior, I simply always go crit on rifle and it dominates in 1v1, there's not really no reason to deviate from this very effective/simple play style because other weapons simple just aren't as viable in it's own way). IMO the synergy between a CC weapon and an offensive weapon should synergize better... meaning nerf the 1v1 weapons and increase the skill effects of weapons for classes that aren't spell based (warrior & ranger & thief especially, their cc spells are weak -> I mean if you compare to guardian weapon CC, elementlist weapon CC, necro has got good weapon CC as well.. ).

Suggestion 3: Have support builds synergize with offense better.

IMPORTANT!!

The Problem Analysis:

While DPS & Burst builds do very straight forward and quick-to-the-point-like damage outputs, support builds usually involves around manipulating the situations more to favor their specific circumstance. A support can lower the damage of DPS & Burst tremendously with both direct and indirect skill effect impact.

For example, while a support always does less damage than DPS & Burst, they can for example - stun a DPS player, so it shortens the duration that the DPS player has to DPS. Or otherwise, they can have a shield that blocks one spell & if a Burst player chooses to waste a huge burst spell on that support, he will be in disadvantage. It does, however, drags the fight longer as a result of these CCs and unique support spell effects.

IMO, a support isn't just a healer or a player that buffs others. It's a player that brings an offensive element to the fight that's more different in its approach compare to DPSing and Bursting.

The Balance Suggestion:

A Pure support probably would drag fights longer than it should, and supports usually do that - they prolong a fight into their advantage with stun/snare/heals/silence/etc. So IMO, pure supports won't work in GW2. However, that's why you guys did come up with "synergy" of runes/traits with weapons, which is a fantastic architectural layout for the game's combat system.

This is only a reminder that when y'all (developers) are doing the weapon balancing, try to include more CC & defensive stacks other than ticking bleed and crit and poison all the time (at least with warriors rangers and thieves, that seemed to be the case).

Also, here are some examples of other types of stacks other than bleed/crit/poison - basically anything not just about offensively stacking duration/damages ticks:

- Stacking ticks on 'Pierce'(ie. weapon attacks will pierce through the opponent's armor defense by gaining stacks through fulfilling certain requirements).

A Pierce effect can take place in many forms, such as through magic attacks, dps attacks, melee attacks, range attacks, cc attacks, etc. MANY MANY VARIATIONS.

- Stacking ticks on 'Cooldown Reduction' (ie. upon successful crit, CD of the skill is reduced by certain speed).

One can gain Cooldown Reduction ticks through many different requirements, such as upon successfully crit'ing, upon having bleed on a person for more than 10 seconds, upon being bursted to 70% hp, etc. Just about anything can probably work with ticks, such as a tick in CD reduction could mean that every time you gain a tick - it means a second is reduced to 0.9 seconds, two ticks means 0.8, and etc. When you lose the stack, it goes back to a 1:1 second ratio.

My point is simply that it doesn't have to always be straight up outputting offense through typical DPS and Burst. If as designers you want us players to be able to progress in a fight, it's not about taking away all the spells which slows down the fight - and just splattering damage all over the place (making a blunt statement). Conditions and Crits are just simply two ways of applying more damage out of many other different ways to increase damage passive skill traits (such as Armor Piercing, CD reduction, unique CC spell effects, etc).

I'm hoping my suggestions will be useful for you guys as feedbacks and specifically as reminders of some balancing issues in which I personally see in the game.

Once again, I wish you guys the best of luck on preparing this game for launch.

Sincerely,

FluffyDoe.7539

Last Updated: [10:31 AM - 18 August, 2012]