Feedback talk:User/Kethatril Thotaesar/Buildings and conditions

Good suggestion. I like realism in my games and this is certainly in keeping with that desire. To add even more depth and strategy, do the following:

• Any skill that causes the "Chilled" effect will cause siege weapons to freeze up such that they won't operate until the effect wears off. Applying "Chilled" to a non-siege object such as a barrel or crate will make it shatter if struck by an attack.

• Wooden objects (including siege weapons) either take double damage from the "Burning" effect or the "Burning" effect's duration is doubled. Furthermore, these objects can eventually be consumed by the flames and destroyed if sufficient damage is caused by the "Burning" condition. Maybe even add the possibility of the flames spreading to other adjacent wooden objects if the fire isn't brought under control in a timely manner.

• The "Burning" effect can be countered by "Chilled". If a trebuchet is on fire, for example, any skill that applies "Chilled" can be cast on it to douse the flames. Doing so does not freeze the siege weapon; the "Chilled" and "Burning" cancel one another. This would apply to enemy skills as well as ally skills. Now enemies have to better coordinate their attacks against a siege weapon to make sure one isn't setting it on fire with a "Burning" skill while the other is extinguishing the flames using a "Chilled" skill.

• Any "Chilled" siege weapon can have a skill that causes "Burning" cast on it to thaw it out and return it to service. Doing so does not set the siege weapon on fire; the "Chilled" and "Burning" cancel one another. This would apply to enemy skills as well as ally skills. Now enemies have to better coordinate their attacks against a siege weapon to make sure one isn't freezing it with a "Chilled" skill while the other is thawing it using a "Burning" skill.

• Permit players to throw buckets of water (if available) on a "Burning" siege weapon or object to put out the flames.

• Permit players to use torches (if available) to thaw a "Chilled" siege weapon or object.

Also, while on this topic, the fires in the game need more smoke. The flame effects are very realistic. However, real fires put out lots and lots of steam and particulates; what we generically call "smoke". There needs to be more of that. An example where they got the effect perfect in GW1 was the raging forest fire in that one Sacnoth Valley mission (I forget the name of the mission itself). Though there were certainly plenty of bright orange flames everywhere, the overall lighting was quite dark. This is what a real forest fire looks like due to all the charred trees and ash and smoke being generated.

Guild Wars 3 perhaps 21:20, 30 June 2012 (UTC)

Realism vs fun/playability

I think our idea (and GW3P's expansion to include Chilling) is intriguing, but I worry that it would make the game more tedious (remove condition, repair damage, attempt to restart siege, repeat). That could be mitigated by making it really hard to apply conditions to objects. For example, a single player could never set a trebuchet aflame. Instead, it might take five near-simultaneous bow attacks or three overlapping, fiery combo fields to cause the object to be lit up. Similarly, a building could be protected against burning by freezing it (again, using a coordinated set of fields).

This would mean that organized teams would become much more powerful than disorganized groups (and also add the type of realism your suggestion seems to recommend). – Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 17:31, 26 July 2012 (UTC)

On reflection, you're right, TEF. If every cast of a skill that caused Burning or Chilling affected siege weapons and environmental objects, it would become tedious as you described. I like your solution of such effects being applied only through multiple, coordinated attacks. This supports the spirit of cooperation in which GW2 has been crafted while also dovetailing with the Guild Wars philosophy of "easy to learn, hard to master".

It could even have a time limiter; X attacks which inflict one of these two conditions must be received within Y seconds (either total or within Y seconds of one another) before Burning or Chilling, respectively, will be applied to the object. If an attack is received in the middle of this chain which inflicts the opposite condition, then the attackers have to start the sequence over again (and the timer, if added) before they will be able to inflict the desired condition.

The other overarching thing I like about this suggestion is it will permit a small group of players to have a measurable impact in WvWvW. A small commando group could be assigned the task of taking out siege weapons or wall defenses. If the group is well-coordinated and experienced enough, they could turn the tide of battle through the elimination of siege weapons using this mechanic. As you're well aware, I'm very much in favor of anything that can be done to increase the depth of play in WvWvW while also giving small groups a means of contributing to their world's success. Guild Wars 3 perhaps 19:33, 26 July 2012 (UTC)

To be fair, I got the idea of coordinated, platoon-sized groups from my colleague GW3P; it seemed to match up well with Kethatril's burning buildings (plus: freezing siege machine! great idea). – Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 21:24, 26 July 2012 (UTC)