User talk:Isaiah Cartwright/Overpowered Skills/Mesmer/Archive 2

Enchanter's Conundrum

200 damage with shatter delusions from one caster, and still having another 100 damage to use on the after-prot? Oh, okay. Was bad enough when I had to put up with this bullshit in RA. Not looking forward to it if people start to run this more in GvG. Change too :"Target Foe is hexed with [this]. After 10 seconds [this] ends and target foe takes 30...102...120 damage." In other words, make it work like Incendiary Bonds (which was kind of how it was intended to work I assume. Put it on someone and then use it's ability to try to prevent them from getting the enchants on themselves during the time). You could even drop the recharge and/or duration. Make it work more like a pressure hex, not a retarded over-powered spike skill. Pluto 08:33, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

It's a non group spike hex, that is, you can't just stack it on from a load of mesmers for a cheap kill, therefore it's allowed to be dangerously powerful (I mean, look at shatterstone). This skill was always intended to be shatterbait and it's nice to see another mesmer elite being used, because it's not like PvP mesmers have much choice. Btw, Reversal of fortune sticks two fingers up at the whole thing anyway. --Ckal Ktak 09:46, 6 January 2008 (UTC)

Difference between EC and Shatterstone is that EC + shatter delusions is ultra compressed. Shatterstone has a 3 second delay between the damage packets. Even if you're talking about the shatterstone + gust combo, there's a long enough delay on that combo to get a spirit bond or prot spirit in there consistently. EC requires being able to recognize it and react in less than a second (good luck doing that with rof, which will probably be taken off immediately by a frenzied warrior anyway), whereas gust won't land, taking in account aftercast, until closer to 2 seconds after shatterstone hits. The more I see EC, the more I'm convinced that it's too over the top. Pluto 04:26, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Actually a RoF would work fine on that spike. Thing is, the enchanter's conundrum spike, while powerful, can only be feasably done once in a single spike, you can't just pile it on from all sources, once the first one has been cast and shattered, in comes protective spirit or spirit bond and every attempt at enchanter's conundrum thereafter is nailed. --Ckal Ktak 10:48, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Have you even watched a high or mid-level gvg? You don't just use EC on one target over and over again and curse the prot spirit. You call a spike on an unprotted target (like you should anyway), and the guy instantly explodes. It's going to be very difficult to for most people to react to EC in the .75 seconds between it and shatter delusions with rof (which probably wouldn't stick long enough, since some other damage source on the spike would probably take it off first) or SB/PS. EC spikes as hard as 2 characters. If it's a clean spike, you could probably drop someone with just a warrior and two midliners. On top of that, you already have arguably the most powerful nonelite spike skill in the game in shatter enchantment. Pluto 09:25, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

So what? It's casters doing some nasty damage, about time that frenzy warriors were shown some pain. --Ckal Ktak 19:30, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Casters don't have easy to spam shutdown like blinding surge. Lord of all tyria 19:37, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Sure they do, it's called a lack of armour. And my point still stands, allow mesmers something to work with other than mantra of recovery, it was getting boring that mesmsers have only two or three builds that work. --Ckal Ktak 23:22, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

I haven't seen anyone use mantra of recovery in months. And the EC mesmer is run on the exact same skeleton bar as any other mesmer, so it's not really doing as much for variety as you think. Pluto 15:32, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

Are you mad about Axiom in xT ;p. We HAed with a guy in xT recently (obviously euro guild lolol, recommended Snarer ele), and he was talking about the damage EC provided. It is especially deadly at VoD on frenzied targets. Somewhat imbalanced, speaking it is AI and cannot be avoided (such as Inept). Also, nice match vs Bank. Thor usually tears through backlines (even tho everyone mocks him about his build). My guild tried SoJ, but failed without diversion ;p. --Readem 23:54, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

That's why our other mesmer runs it. SoJ mes is supposed to be a role falling somewhere between a bsurge and a dom mes. Pluto 23:30, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

Moved this back out of the archive, since it was never addressed. Pluto 22:04, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

Even though as a warrior I can be blown up with this skill I like it. Makes you watch out for casters which is a good thing. If I never have to look sideways at a caster it becomes too easy. --CRASH 04:21, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

yeh i luv this skill, I got my guild from rank 3000 to rank 300 in a week 50 wins to 7 losses with 4 heros playing on spike. THis skill is overpowered but i love it. (We Rage Like [PrOs])

...u must be good. --Readem 21:26, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

I think the problem in general is the trend of giving Mesmer high damage skills that can't be protted due to short cast times (Spiritual Pain, anyone?). The recharge and energy are adequate but the effect just doesn't make sense. If this was 2 or 3 cast (and maybe damage reduced or removed and replaced by something else like energy loss or disabling enchantments) it wouldn't get abused (and used like Energy Burn/Overload/Energy Surge instead). --Life Infusion «T» 02:45, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Another thing is if you're not using it in imba spikes it is worse than Migraine and Arcane Conundrum or Air of Disenchantment in every way other than being in Domination magic and having damage. It has the same problem as spirit rits and paragons...strong as a team stack but weak as a single skill. --Life Infusion «T» 02:51, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Very powerfull skill seeing it in tourny more and more, makes for a very good spike skill yet can be stoped with a simple rof or patient spirit. NOt overpowered yet not useless. It seems balanced but needs to be reworked put it at something like 60 damage at 16 and for 4 seconds target cannot be the target of an enchantment? that way it is very usefull yet not neceseraly uber spike. For example we nearly roller DR (Dark Alley) in tourny with this spike.

Umm, I doubt this skill needs anychange anyone with a brain can put up agis and when enchant is removed rof the target. U can see this spike comeing from a mile away bro, if u have no monk then it could potentialy be overpowered but then again every bar has patient or rof in it and as long as a monk has 5 energy this could be stoped especialy with a recharge of 20 seconds... Also stop making this skill sound like its a overpowered spike if it really was it would be the staple skill on most GvG mesmers, as of right now that is not the cast, dont change a skill because someone in RA complains about it.

This skill was not meant to be a spike skill. It should only do damage when the duration runs out. ~Shard (talk / Nerf List) 09:25, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Umm im kinda sure that it WAS intended to be a spike skill seeing as the nerf to it had nothing to do with the damage it causes or its effect. It was nerfed to a 2 second cast just because you guy complain way too much this skill is not imba and didn't need a nerf and its just as usefull as an extreamly condition 20 second recharge spike as any other. And if people choose to run something like this like people been saying previously it can ohh so easily be stoped not only not with a sim[ple interupt but also with any enchantment...

Ineptitude

If I must explain myself, I will surely rage. Tired of watching ineptisin teams get gold trim. --Readem 21:26, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Lol, omg I'm a warrior! I'm not supposed to take damage! --Ckal Ktak 09:36, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

Lol, omg I just tried to be good at the game, but when I attacked I took 400 damage and became blind. ups i must be bad. --Readem 23:08, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

Stop using frenzy like an noob. Prokiller88 01:32, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Let's nerf Ineptitude because you take double damage from frenzy ? I don't think skills should be balanced around frenzy + :::::Ineptitude was already nerfed and got higher recharge time. 87.189.228.125 11:37, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Ineptitude is so strong because with the current meta all damage is physical. The problem of a completely physical damage meta has been around for a long while, and its not being changed. Anet want to see warriors/dervishes/sins killing things, and want to keep eles blinding/snaring etc. Its basically that simple, if you think Inep is OP then its only because of the meta that we're in. Personally i would prefer to shake up the meta, rather than just fit skills around the problems. --ChronicinabilitY 14:03, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

No one is going to switch to caster-spike, merely because it is bad at VoD. Ineptitude is OP, if nubs think otherwise, they are just plain bad at the game. There is a reason teams are able to run 3 copies, and not fail. --Readem 22:11, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Tired of dumb people... --Readem 01:03, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

So you can't notice that you get inep on you when you fight? Because other people do. Prokiller88 23:40, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

You mean to say that when you face groups that run three copies of this skill, you get hit by all three? Wow. That's actually worse than frenzy... congratulations you've discovered a new tier. (Terra Xin 17:06, 2 February 2008 (UTC))

Readem's just trolling again, ignore. --Ckal Ktak 18:57, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Not nearly as good as it once was, and seeming as one of the best ways to deter the heavy damage from melee i think if anything the recharge should be boosted. This skill is awesome for what it does and yet it not even good enough to balance the game, every one still runs almost every build based on solely physical damage why, because it has the highest dps+armour. So this skill should be boosted to balance the game and give some thing other then the 2 war 1 para 1 ranger teams a try.

100+ armor ignoring damage is over the top. needs damage nerf imo.--Life Infusion «T» 21:38, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

sure if u nerf the damage must boost recharge for example u can make it 70 damage cap but 10 second recharge and 5 energy cost. the skill is balanced if damage is reduced so should everything else. If u think 140 damage at vod is bad then half all perameters of the skill half recharge energy cost damage and blind duration. Only that way u can reduce it but still keep the skill effective.

this skill is not overpowered at all , increased the recharge , decrease the duration of the hex , nerfing the damage would make this skill useless , if the damage gets decreased , than lower the recharge to something like 10-15sec.--189.12.67.75 22:24, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

BTW if u run 3 copies then u MUST fail lol? And as is it lasts for 4 seconds and gives a 4 second blind? OP? lmao with 20 recharge u must be kidding meh, an extramly "SLOW" warrior who frenzies at VOD is the only thing that i can see having much trouble with this.. Besides that Look at the effect of the Non-Elite skill [Steam] lol way better recharge and longer blind duration and u think Inept is OP lol? If anything recharge on inept should beh brough down to 15.

Steam At 16 in water = 104 Damage (roughly 40 less), 10 Seconds of blind (More then twice as much), and way better recharge. Guys use your head this skill is underpowered as compared to a non elite spam skill.

Steam has the condition of target being buring remember. 165.199.5.192 14:23, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

Steam isn't elite or armor ignoring, I think it would be better to compare Ineptitude to Blinding Surge, which deals far less damage, but inflicts unconditional blind and has 1/5 of the recharge time, making blind nearly sustainable on two targets. I think the damage and recharge should be reduced and the blindness duration should scale. -- Gordon Ecker 01:39, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

This skill is underpowered than Blinding Surge or Eruption,it needs trigger and more recharge time. Blinding Surge make a meterial man can't affect others for 4 sec loop. But if Inep is not triggered or in the 6 to 10 sec that was triggered and finish the duration ,even it was remove by himself or others, the long recharge make this Elite one seems to be NON-Elite.Or you should think that Blinding Surge or Eruption are too powerful !! -- duceethar