Talk:Paragon/Archive 2

Leadership

They should remove the cap on energy gained from the chants. or you gain energy everytime an allie is affected by your chant and when your chant ends...Because some are crazy, cost 15 energy, and all you get back is 5 on Leadership : 10. Which is shite, for the 2pips of regen. Making it harder to keep chants shouts ect up. So yeh, buff the damn paragons. +5 energy when i shout or chant, and +5 energy when the shout or chant ends sounds good to me.

Random 4v4

There's something I'd like to add to this page. Paragon primaries are often regarded as useless in random arena to the point that some players will resign if they see one in their team. I've tried looking on sites for some decent Paragon builds for 4v4 random and couldn't find any so I made one of my own. I came up with a few others but they either had energy management problems, or to much downtime due to skill activation to be truly effective.

Leadership: 10+1+1 = 13 Command: 9+1 = 9 Spear Mastery: 10+1 = 11 Protection Prayers: 7

It's a versatile build that specializes in caster shutdown with a few other utilities. Signet of Judgment and Awe combine for an Interrupt and easily applied Daze while keeping Aggressive Refrain up with Anthem of Weariness and "Go for the Eyes" to help keep pressure on any targets you daze and to build rage faster. Keep Melle threats under control with Anthem of Weariness. If you come under attack use mending touch to remove cracked armour from yourself.

I realize that leaving a build here is generally frowned upon but I really feel for any Paragons that just want to casual fling into the Randoms. (updated) Thomasuwoo 23:44, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

The reason paragon primaries are looked down upon in RA/TA is because they are the only profession that gets better as more people get added to the team. Paragons in RA are like rangers without expertise, they just don't win. ~Shard 21:46, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

I realize that the inherit effect from Leadership is decreased in 4v4 but that doesn't stop you from capitalizing on leadership skills as this build does. (And therefore justifying having Paragon as your Primary.) Thomasuwoo 22:03, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

I think they should buff Leadership in RA and CA, for example Leadership gives the double amount of mana there, then its like youre in an 8-man team and have decent energy management 80.60.80.108 00:51, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

>Glad to see others agree<

Recent vandalism

While the poster obviously violated a number of guidelines, I am inclined to agree with his assessment and move that we restructure the page to express it. --Jette 20:04, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

I never thought there would be someone wanting to describe the Paragon wiki page as a faggot. Thanks for that god awful contribution. Im sure you have done something very important to the wiki by creating this thread. We should celebrate.--ShadowFog 23:42, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Paragon skills, skill updates, class looks, gameplay, main role and many more...

Zaqwsx 15:29, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

I'm sry anet, but this time I'm not happy about what you've done... I never complain about anything you do... but this is what paras have become...

split Finale of Restoration into Pve/Pvp or Imbagon is the only para build that will get played--Orgeron 19:07, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Nice image with the gun. They should join Ritualists and be removed from the character creation screen (PvP people). --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.161.206.131 (talk).

Why would Rits be removed? Spirit Spamming is great now.--SlitherSly 20:12, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Say hi to PvP please. Nearly no changes. And 3/4 a sec is too fast for PvE. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.161.206.131 (talk).

Hmm... where was that rant I just posted a little while ago... oh, stupid search function. CTRL+F, my con CTRL+F, enter, CTRL+F, rit CTRL+F, enter... okay, here we go. Talk:Ritualist#The_Neglected_Communing_Tree That is why ritualists are bad. —Jette 20:35, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Ritualists are bad because they drive up the trader prices of Monstrous Fangs etc. That's all. Vili 点 21:49, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Also true. —Jette 00:01, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

194.80.18.25 12:33, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

awwww why you change it back? >o< 194.80.18.25 12:33, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Paras really are great! SO UNDERRATED! And "Its just a flesh wound" is the best condition removal skill in the game! Low energy, spammable and movement increase! What more could you want? Paras make great support players. Mine runs a movo version of Imba (Wich I designed Myself ;-D), makes my party completely invincible. Canarygeorge 19:20, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

WTB Buff, Swear swipe = KD AWE=Dazed , this makes sence....noo???YES!!!

Ok sooo skill that ends after x..x..xx many x's

All paragon skills that affect all allies, which end after blah...blah times, only end on that one ally. So many people on talk pages axin does it end on all allies when one gets hit 5 times? Its like,

Para--Kay guys im gonna use Can't Touch This!, you mobs go waste your touch skills!

War--Sweet man thanks! Its so helpful!

Ele--Shit I pulled some agro! ARrrgggggg they be vamptouchin my innsiiideees! What happened to your shout I just heard???

Para--The war used them all up...

Ele--What the balls are you talking about?? We all heard you shout it! It should apply to each of us! We are not one! Where the fudge is the Assassin?? Helps meeeeeeee, Mfffrrhhggg! I'm getting low on healthhhh </dead>

Sin-- Man does that suck, hmm time for me to come save the day! <shadowform>

Ranger--Where in the blue blazes were you??

Sin-- I went afk back there and had to pick up some loot.. Well here let me tank them! </dead>

Ranger--Hey Shadow Fail, touch skills.

Para--Can't Touch This!

Monk-- mmk I'm just gonna say take the wipe

Para-- Save Yourselves!

War-- Yea cause that works...

Para--We Shall Return!

Monk-- Dammit man, the mobs aren't even out of range yet!

Para--They're on Fire!

Ele--I'm specc'd into air...

Para-- HAVE A TASTE OF MY HOLY ROD! Muaahhaha die undead! Take theee holy rod!

War-- O-o

Monk-- O-o

Ranger-- o-O

Sin-- O_O

Ele-- Thats not one of your skills...

Ogden-Livia:We're set on avoid combat, soo yea we cant do jack...

-/- What have I done...-/- Discuss 04:16, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

[1] --RIDDLE 04:37, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

ORLY? -/- Discuss 05:36, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

I approve of this message. --Arduin 05:54, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

Whats being approved? :O -/- Discuss 05:59, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

That was epic Anubis Athul 22:14, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

55 paragons ?

Can paragons go 55 ? 12+1+3 leadership, 9+3 motivation, 9 prot?

Essence bond + Balthazar spirit + prot spirit + spirit bond + they're on fire! + blazing finale + finale of restoration + mending refrain ? no elites needed o.o

surely 9+1+3,, 9 prot and 12 smiting would work as well wouldnt it ?

essence bond, balthazar spirit, prot spirit, spirit bond, they're on fire!, blazing finale, SoJ, reversal of damage? --208.88.120.88 13:23, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Your Kidding me, right? a 55 paragon.... --♥♥Sweet ♥ Sweet♥♥ 03:45, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

600 Paragon works

Please give Paragons something!

I'm Not sure if this the right place to bring up this issue or not but its been far to long since paragons have had anything nice. All I'm saying is they could use a Big buff in all areas! When they first came out in October 27, 2006 Paragons where great there was nothing wrong with them, and since then they have been slowly reduced to a "Cute little mini pet that toss a tooth pick! Are they not suppose to be like guardian angels? I mean Shouts are all they really have to make a difference, I mean sure it helps others here and there but what about the paragons them selfs. Also in the description for the paragons it states " Through insight, they help others resist Hexes and Conditions! ... well Conditions yes very much so but Hexes.... Not at all.... NO wait theres one just one. That takes 8 adrenaline to use PLUS its only useful if your using a spell (How about them apples!?) Theres a time for a change and that time needs to be now! Or the next up date would be nice. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 188.129.240.121 (talk).

Trivia

I added the bit from Shakespeare's The Two Gentlemen of Verona because I thought it was interesting. Of course, there's no way to know if there's an actual connection between the spear-wielding Paragon and the dialogue from the play by William Shakespeare, but that's why it's called Trivia, right? Silmalel 18:02, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

I must say, that must be the most abstract connection I have ever seen anyone assume in a piece of trivia. --Adul 18:29, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

I don't think it's abstract at all; far-fetched or coincidental, perhaps and yes, but not really abstract. Nevertheless, I thought it was interesting. Perhaps other Guild Wars & Shakespeare fans will too. Ever played Trivial Pursuit? Silmalel 01:25, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

An interesting scene, but I definately wouldn't have "Interestingly, the Paragon's weapon is a spear, and The Two Gentlemen of Verona was written by William Shakespeare." in there... as above, it's a VERY abstract connection. - Revelation talk 21:55, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Oh well, my trivia piece was deleted by someone else. I'm not really sure why. It was simple trivia, and there are many trivia tidbits out there every bit as random as the one I posted. The point of it was to show an actual use of the word "Paragon" from English literature. I would defend its being on the page, but I'm not about to get into a revert war with someone. What's done is done. Silmalel 22:16, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

A bit late, but you realize that the term paragon means "a model of excellence". I'd be much more inclined to believe that's what Arena Net was going for the origin of the name and if there were any interesting tidbits it's that these characters that are named after the term paragon resemble Seraphs, somewhat, and Paragons in Guild Wars at least have some connection to six wings and holiness. And Seraphs are supposed to be ecclesiastic models of purity, because they circled God's Throne in Revelations and praised him. 98.186.172.103 01:58, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Worst Profession

I have the feeling that Anet thinks making the paragon was a mistake, seeing as they've nerfed everything except the overpowered Imbagon build from viability. If not, as much as scythe dervishes need an update, I'd say the need for a paragon rework outdoes all the other professions' needs combined. I mean, when's the last time you saw a good single paragon (because the way things are now their still fairly powerful when grouped with other paras, but otherwise weak)? 74.235.62.209 07:20, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

IMO Paragons are great! but yes, they are team players. my paragon finished nightfall with 0 deaths and no imba build! --The Holy Dragons 07:26, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

Paragons should not need to rely on PvE skills to be effective, nor should any other profession. I see the recent Ritualist and Mesmer updates as great examples of how to make underused professions viable and useful... and note that some of their most powerful builds really don't need PvE skills at all, their native skills are quite effective. I have put a lot of thought into how Anet might make updates to the Paragon skills and I have compiled a long list of suggestions which should address some of the problems. Please read and leave comments if you so desire. http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/User:Khomet/Paragon_skill_changes Khomet 22:25, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

Unfortunately, the Paragons AND Dervishes suffer from the same problem. Lack of skill diversity. The PVE skills fixed that slightly, but they are still a game behind the Assassins and Ritualists, and two games behind everyone else. Its part of the reason I always felt they should go back and add access to each new chapter's classes to the old chapters, with a proper list of skills for each. Then at least there could be a fair comparison to the other classes to fix problems. Guildwarsrunner 20:07, 6 February 2011 (UTC)

I have to agree that they truely are the worst profession since there nerf goodness knows how long ago. Can someone name me 1 decent elite that they have. Seriously I've been playing guildwars for 5 years and i've never seen a more pointless class. Its about time that they gave them a good kick up the arse and make them useful. The dervish update was great but i think the problem is now is that they're too linear as grenths aura is so powerful, any who its about time Anet did the same sort of massive update to the paragon so it can actually work with some effectiveness. Ultrametroid 09:13, 7 March 2011 (GMT)

Song of Purification? 184.97.213.74 16:48, 7 March 2011 (UTC)

When the paragon was first introduced, they were practically god. They were able to spam chants, echo's and shouts and was able to keep the team alive. It was like "god-mode" without using SY. Soon, they nerfed a large number of paragon skills because it was unbalancing PvP, causing the meta to shift to a boring survivathon with both team going far into overtime because both teams won't die due to the paragon's godly defensive capacity. Part of the reason why they can't really do much other than SY-spam- imba, is because of how so much of their skills were nerfed for PvP, but were never really considered for usage in PvE. They should have split the skills for PvP and PvE usage. Now, paragons are just kinda lame in both PvP and PvE except for the imba build for PvE. --Lania 18:05, 07 March 2011 (UTC)

Yeah imo when you go to RA or AB and you see people of every class but paragon, then you go there as a paragon and people wonder why you're there, something is very wrong. I played as a command paragon in AB the past week and after all that I can say this: spear mastery needs better synergy with the other paragon attributes (I was tempted to set it to zero), a lot of paragon skills only work under super specific situations from being nerfed, and paragons need at least one more pip of energy regeneration because some skills are high energy cost even though they aren't good enough to deserve a high energy cost (which is why I avoided motivation). Basically (at least in my opinion) paragons need an overhaul kind of like the dervishes already got...or gw2 should hurry the hell up so it wont matter anymore. Granted I'm not a very experienced paragon player so I'm sure they're not as broken as I think they are, people still avoid them so I think some big changes should come. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 129.138.36.35 (talk).