User talk:Isaiah Cartwright/Underpowered Skills/Ranger/Archive 2

Heal as One

I would really like to see a buff to Heal as One. As it is now, it's pretty much a waste to carry a pet for any reason, unless your a pure BM. I'd like to see more creativity in this field, and I think buffing Heal as One would be a good start. As it is now, it's cast time is too long. I'd either like to see 1/4 or 3/4 cast time, the former prefered. If you can't do that, at least buff it so it's ~5 recharge or heals around 140 health at 12 BM. It's not worth it as it is now.

We moved this stuff to different locations for clutter reason. ‽-(eronth) I give up 20:57, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Actually to be honest a couple of months ago Heal as one was the most used skill in the Hero Battles Meta. I haven't played HB in a while but Im preety sure its used by many players. Eitherway I belive HaO is a very useful skill and does not need any change at the moment EdgeBomber 21:06, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Some still like the occasional pack hunter, but most prefer either the Melandru's W/R Tanks, or an SoR E/Mo. I like them for their ints tho ;). Readem Promote My Ban Here 06:39, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

This skill is nice in HB, bit I'm cool with the 1/4 or 3/4 buff. ----InfestedHydralisk 07:01, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

/Agree Readem Promote My Ban Here 18:44, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

I already find it powerful enough. It gives you versatility, because it combines several skills into one. And when compared to let's say Troll Unguent, this skill really is much better as a self heal. No change needed IMO.Nicky Silverstar 13:45, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

I agree with nicky, no change needed ----InfestedHydralisk 16:06, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Defensive Elite. Sucks. Readem Promote My Ban Here 04:06, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Lol. You don't like defensive elites at all do you? Let me try to tell you why this skill is actually a great asset to a Beast Master:

This skill negates the need for another self heal, thus the need for another attribute, thus allows you to put more points in either Beast Mastery or Expertise or both, thus allows you to spam your attack skills more often and/or to use more expensive ones. It also gives you an additional skill slot to use so you can bring another offensive skill.

Bottom line: if you bring this skill, you sacrifice an elite attack skill to significantly increase your and your pet's durability, while the reduction isn't clear (if it exists, it is small but I think you may actually do more damage).Nicky Silverstar 06:35, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

I like this skill as it is, but I suppose that if the recharge were 2 seconds shorter, or if the casting time was 1/4 or 1/2 or 3/4, it would be better. - Anon

A 1/4, 1/2 or 3/4 self + pet heal is way too strong. --Tankity Tank 09:30, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

It is an elite heal so it should be strong. If you are using a pet you have limited yourself in a lot of way and outside of pure beast master it's not a strong build. Besides, it's not spammable - it has a fairly long recharge a lot of people won't like. Pets are already crazy durable with their easy res, the value of this skill is the self heal - being able to res the pet without comfort counters the elite status. This skill is popular in HB for reasons other than overpowered - it takes advantage of YOUR heros AI and abuses the other player's hero's AI. 58.110.141.203 09:05, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Concerned the recharge, I feel like it could be taken down to 6 or 7 seconds, or the skill could be given a buff of about 30 or so more health at 12 att. As it is, the skill has a difficult time covering any sort of directed damage towards either the user or the pet, necessitating at the very least a spammable defensive stance for the user. If an attacker wants to lay a sustained attack into either you or your pet, you won't stay alive for very long with this as your only heal. You might get in one or two uses of the skill before either you or the pet dies. I'm not suggesting the elite be spammable, however, yet I still feel like HaO could use a small buff. I'm looking at the skill more as a self heal that can warrant a 16 BM, 13 Marks (or other variant) build. In PvP it's often rather coincidental that my pet will need healing anyway, as it's rarely a target. I see the skill more as a self heal that can also rez my pet. It's a very important skill for bar compression considering Charm and Comfort have yet to be addressed. And after all, you are giving up (I would think) Wilderness with Unguent and an attack elite for it. Honestly, at impure BM levels (about 12 or lower) the elite isn't very good to begin with. Certain Dervish self-heals, for an example, can heal for as much in an instant with less of a recharge. As the skill is now, it simply covers minor damage taken as players switch targets or if you're hit by AoE. It feels more like a novelty than a staple skill for a pure Beast Master. (Not that a pure Beast Master has much of any place in PvP anyway, but still.) --Reklaw 09:43, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

I use this skill in AB all the time, and it works really well, mostly, because it heals more directly than Troll Unguent. In the few cases that I need additional defense, I simply use Whirling Defense and I can beat 80% of all opponents 1 vs 1 without breaking a sweat, and cap shrines too. I think this skill is very useful as it is. I'd like a buff, sure, but I don't need it. 145.94.74.23 07:54, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes, but that's AB. It needs a balance for PvP. (Real PvP.) AB isn't known for requiring much defense. You spend most of your time ganking NPCs or solitary people running around. If you want to test it, heaven help us all, play in RA at least. --Reklaw 07:24, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Magebane Shot

This skill is limited in usefulness because even if it interrupts a spell and recharges instantly, there is still an aftercast delay with all ranger interrupts. Thereby making the recharge instantly benefit a little pointless. My suggestion, remove the aftercast delay on this shot but make it do no damage. It'd probably be best if this shot didn't benefit from damage buffs either as that would improve rspike. --67.188.28.71 01:16, 8 August 2007 (UTC)Jaen

i never liked this skill. it saves one skill slot as it can replace the distracting/savage combo if you're only going for interrupts. but concerning damage this is just inferior. it has no side effect like deactivating or bonus damage and, as you said, the recharge bonus isn't that great, either. even if you can constantly interrupt anything the ele over there does. i wouldn't remove the aftercast, that would simply be imba imo. but i'd e.g. add some bonus damage if it's not a spell. or something. - Y0_ich_halt 01:26, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

If this arrow interrupts a Spell, you automatically fire another Magebane Shot and this skill is instantly recharged... GG queued spells. Unfortunately this would lock you in one spot and on one caster if they're stupid enough to keep queueing. |GD Defender / contribs 01:35, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

rofl. imagining how that looks if you just keep hitting the key. (me=ranger; enemy = e/d tank) - Y0_ich_halt 01:36, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

lol Stone Daggers interrupt x10. The most important part about the auto-redux shot is that it would bypass the aftercast without actually removing it. |GD Defender / contribs 01:49, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

If anyone gets hit by 2 or 3 magebanes in a row and keeps chain casting then I don't think the problem is with magebane shot being overpowered.--67.188.28.71 02:17, 8 August 2007 (UTC) Jaen

This double shot thing could be interesting. Atm my main problem with the skill isn't so much that it's bad that i don't feel it actually competes with the 2 standard interrupts, and if you have those 2 already you definitely don't need a 3rd with no effect except possibly recharging faster (cause with DShot, Savage Shot and a 3rd interrupt with a normal recharge, you wouldn't need it to recharge instantly). I mean, Savage Shot has a better recharge if you end up using it to interrupt skills or you miss/get blocked, and its recharge is still VERY good with 5s even for spells. I mean, you have 1s aftercast after an interrupt, so that's already 1s of recharge gone, and so for Magebane to be better than Savage, you'd need to interrupt a spell consistently in that 4s window before Savage would usually be recharged. And you get no +damage while Savage does on spells. If both were non-elite, there would be a competition between Savage Shot and Magebane Shot for a slot, and it would actually be a real competition (i can easily see different rangers picking a different choice cause both would have advantages). With Magebane being elite, there's actually no competition : DShot + Savage Shot + another elite >>> Magebane Shot + DShot/Savage Shot + another non-elite. Savage/Disrupting Shot are just SO good that for an elite interrupt to be interesting, it has to offer something unique, not just interrupt on short recharge (since with DShot/Savage Shot recharge is NOT an issue) or deal some minor damage like Punishing. To go with the 'Magebane' theme, i could see this skill being '10/.25/8, interrupt target foe. If target foe was casting a spell and was enchanted, target foe is dazed for 5 seconds' (or move it to Marks and scale it). Now it would be interesting. You'd have the option of a short, spammable daze, comparable in a sense to a cheap Concussion Shot but with very short duration. Now you might want to use your elite on this Patccmoi 02:30, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

I think the idea of it causing a short daze is interesting, but I'm not sure if it will really have a place. With BHA and Conc shot, the ranger daze options already feel pretty crowded. Perhaps what they can do is make so that when magebane shot interrupts a spell, it returns a percentage (scalable maybe?) of the energy used for that spell to the ranger. That way it'd be a nice alternative to savage for emanagement. Jaen--67.188.28.71 06:09, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Could steal energy equal to the cost of the spell. Maybe cause exhaustion. |GD Defender / contribs 09:43, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

'If target foe is casting a spell, that foe is interrupted and suffers from exhaustion.' Instead of no recharge, which is already quite redundant with Savage Shot and Distracting Shot on just about any bow ranger build... Saph 19:56, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

"If target foe is casting a spell, that spell is interrupted and you morph into the Avatar of Destruction. For 666 seconds fire rains from the sky and scorches the earth. All mortals burn like the depths of hell and the world shifts to pure chaos." I think it sounds like an interesting concept. A few numbers might need tweaked, but overall a fun skill. --Deathwing 20:03, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

I love it ! --Faena 12:11, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

would've to be "Worldbane Shot" then xD - Y0_ich_halt 12:12, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

I really love the exhaustion idea. It would make it very unique and useful. IMO make it interrupt also skills, I'm not sure if it should cause exhaustion when interrupting those cause it could make it overpowered (daze on sins, warriors and dervs xD).--PunkSkeleton 13:02, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Exhaustion on a 10s recharge bow interrupt would be flatout ridiculous. You could exhaust out any caster playing normally in a minute. It's totally different from something like Exhausting Assault which is melee and can't be used straight (requires a lead first). And Exhausting Assault is actually kinda broken on heroes too because they nearly always get 2 spells interrupted in one shot (when a spell is interrupted, they automatically start casting another one most of the time, and Exhausting being a dual attack hits both. Before the change of Exhausting to requiring a lead, i used to Exhaust out hero casters in 30s in HB doing Moebius-Exhausting chain), but i don't have much pity for heroes in PvP anyway. The problem is if you can reliably, EASILY exhaust out a caster player. Being exhausted out is by far the harshest shutdown in the game. In a sense it's even worse than dying, cause at least when you rez you're functional again. Exhausted out, you're not. I'd actually like ways to exhaust people to be slightly better and i got my ideas for it, but a 10s recharge interrupt causing exhaustion is just far beyond anything i could have in mind. Patccmoi 17:06, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Add cannot be blocked, bam useful elite. -Warskull 04:11, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

That would work nicely... compared to all those non-elite Mesmer interrupts, none of which have the ability to "miss", it would still be a fair skill. Unblockable interrupt that recharges on spells? Nothing superpowered, but at least worthy of an elite slot. Might even see use on a pure interrupter build of some sort. -- Jioruji Derako.> 09:39, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Cannt be blocked would be great. Even just 'if target foe is enchanted, this can't be blocked'. Wouldn't allow to go through Shields Up! or Defensive Anthem, but it would go through Aegis, Guardian, SoD, etc. and all in all this is what the 'Magebane' skill line seem to be about. Doesn't mean i wouldn't be happy with just 'can't be blocked' though =p Patccmoi 16:13, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Maybe "if Magebane Shot interrupts a spell, it is instantly recharged. If the target is enchanted, this skill will instantly recharge when interrupting non-spell skills as well." -- Jioruji Derako.> 22:13, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Warskull's suggestion is very good. Right now, this is shit compared to Distracting Shot (disable spell, same recharge) and Savage Shot (superior recharge, unconditional). I'd like to see that suggestion being implemented. 74.14.106.67 01:38, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

+1 for Warskull's suggestion. Man, those margo rangers might get annoying in PvE too. ;) ~Seef II <☎|→> 04:27, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

How about something like this. If magebane shot interrupts a spell, that spell and all recharging spells on target's bar take an additional 2..4..6 seconds to recharge. For every spell affected in this way, magebane shot takes an additional 4..3..2 seconds to recharge. This would then have to be linked to marks; Numbers may have to be adjusted but I thought this affect might be interesting. Jaen --67.188.28.71 18:22, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Remove aftercast delay and/or add anti blocking.--Renegade 11:58, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

How about "moves 3 times faster and cannot be blocked" like Called Shot? Granted under Read the Wind it wouldn't help that much...--Life Infusion «T» 02:26, 11 October 2007 (UTC)