User talk:Borotvaltgandalf/Shadow Form

HAPPY BIRTHDAY SHADOW FORM! Boro 17:56, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Fail less, 55ing is just as bad as Shadow Form, yet no-one complains about that. Also, it's bloody PvE, who cares? Having fun is more important than it being "balanced" (as far as that's possible). Oh and if you are trying to look for PUGs, you're doing it wrong cuz having fun with PUGs is impossible. Just play with friends, if you have any. Dark Morphon 14:23, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

I'd disagree with you on this one morphon.PvE is supposed to prepare people for PvP if PvE was hard in the right way people would be better.55-ing a) doesn't prevent int's at all b) is prone to enchant removal and c) is a whole build not 3 skills.I do have to say that this page is useless Shadow Form is obviously OP and is obviously the best tank skill in the game.It has been broken from the start and I think it is widespread knowledge that SF is godmode.Only noobs that "need" shadowform try to defend it.Lilondra *poke* 13:21, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

That's what you think PvE SHOULD be, but at the moment it just isn't. 55 is a) not at all prone to interrupts (with Mystic Regeneration) because it doesn't have skills that could and should be interrupted, b) enchantment removal is either countered by Spell Breaker or by just picking an area that doesn't have any. You are however right about c) but then again, who cares? Besides, if you think SF is bad you should be consistent and also call 55ing bad simply because they both exploit NPC AI and overpowered skills. Ever saw a tank in PvP? Yeah, exactly. People are smart in PvP. If you ever want PvE to be a preparation for PvP you WILL need to improve NPC AI. And before that happens, there is no reason to balance PvE. Dark Morphon 10:10, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

To start with your build isnt a solo build and there is no way to clear UW in under 10 minutes with 55 tanks.I agree that farming will never need real skill but it shouldn't.What SHOULD require skill is the elite areas and those shouldn't be farmfood.

Pve should show some things to players because now you can Farm/powertrade tons of gold,have pve'd for 4 years + and still suck epic coconuts Lilondra *poke* 11:21, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes. PvE needs more RTT (Real Time Tactics). Like in DoW 2 where end osses e.g. the Hive Tyrant (Army: Tyranids) uses a bioplasma to do some AoE, but he marks the target ground with a greenish circle and tarkus warns me to watch out. GW needs to be tactical instead of rollfacemode. --Boro 12:07, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Don't be so meen to wasabi, he probably is a rly fwiendly guy. Other than that, it's impossible to make PvE take skill because the NPC AI is always the same. They always make the same stupid mistakes. It all comes down to build choice and never to player skill. The only remotely strategical aspect that I can think up is making sure the enemies don't scatter which is again build choice. So honestly, what difference does it make that Assassins have to take 3 skills while warriors have to take 9? None whatsoever, it's still the same strategy, it just takes somewhat longer and you will need some more people. If you honestly want PvE to be "balanced", introduce good AI. That's the only way. Before that happens, PvE is a gimmickfest. Dark Morphon 13:15, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Just because its bad already doesn't mean it should be allowed to stay just as bad.Thats a terrible logic.Besides that the skills on the pve monsters do matter whatever their AI is.I'm pretty sure anet can make the AI use skills on a certain target and we already know they can int like a cheesy nolife korean that wants his bacon.How do you expect people to get to know energy denial if there are no real monsters that show it ? If they face energy denial they will eventually meet this guy that says this cray Idea of using a low energy set and a high energy set. Lilondra *poke* 13:19, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for proving my point. Improving AI is the way to go, nerfing the skills that abuse the AI isn't. Dark Morphon 13:32, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

How would you improve it ? And by making the AI fail to int every now and then ? The AI is a problem on hero's if they modded it slightly cancelcasting would turn the tides.Cancelcasting is mkay most of the time.Lilondra *poke* 13:38, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

I'm just trying to point it out to Boro that the skills aren't the actual problem but the AI is. I suggest taking discussions concerning changes to said AI to a different place since they have little relevance to this discussion at all. Dark Morphon 13:40, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes that's an interesting idea. However improving the AI not to attack the guy under shadow formtanking and taking no damage and not to ball up near him will (of course) have further consequences. it will then require further skill balances... That's going to be interesting. (I'm up for it) --Boro 15:04, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

You go on ahead, I really don't care about PvE that much. It's good to see you've seen that randomly changing symptons of problems won't help at all. Dark Morphon 15:28, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

That is to say, I don't care about PvE balance. Dark Morphon 15:29, 26 July 2009 (UTC)