Talk:"There's Nothing to Fear!"

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Bugged? I noticed that it says allies but minions dont get the healing bonus on its end so i assume they dont get the bonus at all, but they should because it says allies not party members. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:72.135.25.206 .

This skill totally puts "Incoming!" to shame.

Do percentage-wise damage reduction of this kind stack, and if it does, when does it cap? Because the PvE stuff isn't even elite, so you're free to use both Incoming and this. -- Jonas N 19:34, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Just wondering what all dmg is affected by these type of skills, I'm guessing everything except life stealing?74.36.49.130 17:48, 14 June 2008 (UTC)

Trivia

Is it a reference to Franklin D. Roosevelt's "There is nothing to fear, but fear itself!"? [1]--  (CoRrRan / talk) 10:44, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

That is entitrely possible BUT I believe it's in refernce to something older and the icon may help to prove it. I am believeing that it's a quote from the character Captain Ahab from the novel Moby-Dick. A very famous spear weilder to boot. I'll check in my book at home and report back. So far I can only find cliff notes like versions online though they seem to agree that quote is in there (chapter 119). --File:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG Vallen Frostweaver 14:06, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

You might be right, perhaps in chapter 119, as mentioned here. I've never read Moby Dick, so obviously I don't have a recollection of that quote in that book. --  (CoRrRan / talk) 14:13, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps the icon IS Ahab, wielding a harpoon in stead of a spear... --  (CoRrRan / talk) 14:14, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

(edit conflict)That's what I was alluding to with my above mention of the icon. --File:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG Vallen Frostweaver 14:31, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Best to leave it out unless we're pretty sure, false information is worse than no information. I'm of the belief that "There's nothing to fear!" means... exactly that. It isn't a reference to anything. -Auron 14:18, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

That's why I'm not including it until I have verified it myself - I don't want false information either. But if it is there, your view sounds very narrow-minded (especially as it's just a Trivia section and nothing that may hurt anyone's playing experience) as a picture of a similarly bearded man (to Ahab) wielding a spear using the quote "There's nothing to fear!" and possibly being purchased from a sea-going like NPC in the Luxon territory kinda narrows this down so much that it's kinda obvious. Of course, this still needs to be verified and once I do verify if it is printed in Moby Dick then I will double verify with Emily as she has graciously offered to clear up things like this. That should help close out any doubt. --File:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG Vallen Frostweaver 14:31, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

If you get an official response on each bit of trivia, good on ya. I'm against putting trivia that isn't 100% verified.

Keep in mind, trivia doesn't help anyone's gameplay experience either, so your argument that it doesn't hurt anything is quite moot. -Auron 14:38, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

It does mine. I enjoy the little quips and quotes that may have inspired them. I've even had a few laughs at some joke builds people have made to take advantage of such things. Anyway, I don't need to search as it was confirmed as the Roosevelt speech by Emily here. --File:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG Vallen Frostweaver 18:23, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

I agree, I like these trivia's too, it improves my enjoyment of the game. And Auron, any piece of trivia that we can think of can be checked with Emily, as she has explicitly told us that if we have any question on trivia, just to ask her. Which is what we then do of course. (Thx for clearing it with Emily, Vallen.) --  (CoRrRan / talk) 00:03, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

No problem. Good call on the quote CoRrRan. --File:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG Vallen Frostweaver 11:42, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Interesting take there Auron, do we really need a Category:Trivia needs verification? or perhaps we discuss Trivia on the talk page of a skill and then point Emily towards that instead of the category? --Jamie 11:53, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

It's been discussed on the talk pages so far for many skills and a category for Emily will be unfair to her. I think one request at a time to her as they come up is better so as not to overwhelm her. She's doing it on a volunteer basis after all. --File:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG Vallen Frostweaver 12:02, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

(Reset indent) I was just thinking of ways to make her task easier, but I can see what you mean. --Jamie 12:14, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

So, was it really based on that quote? It sounds rather farfetched if you'd ask me. Most trivia references are, tbh. I don't mind trivia at all, but when people are starting to make things up, they start to annoy me. Like that jumpstyle dance reference at the female assassin's dance...that was just pathetic. 145.94.74.23 08:51, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Seeing as it seems like quite a stretch to me, I changed the language to "possibly". It just seems far-fetched to me, especially seeing as the wording is different and there seems to be no evidence at all to suggest that it is a reference to ANYTHING. The Moby Dick quote seems far more likely, but I've never read Moby Dick and don't have a copy. 66.66.144.147 13:50, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

There is no need for further discussion it has already been confirmed that it is a reference to the Roosevelt speach. Drogo Boffin 13:54, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

New Duration

I don't know about everyone else, but I prefered the 10 second version to my now 11 second one. Why? Because I got the healing benefit before reapplying before. Arkhar 18:18, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Lower your leadership to 13 or wait one more second to recast...problem solved. Torak321 18:54, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

The only reason you should be running your build with Leadership > 12 is if it's mostly energy skills and lots of shouts/chants which sounds like a Motivation build to me. With a few or even one adrenal shout you should have plenty of energy management. There's no need that I can see to go extreme with Leadership like that. --File:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG Vallen Frostweaver 11:55, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

What if you use Leadership skills? - - Arkhar 05:45, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

I run this at 16 leadership using ALL leadership (& PvE) skills. It's fairly easy to see when it ends when a bunch of +52s fly around everywhere. Maestro Ed 04:27, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

I found reason now. You need it to last longer so that it will end up socting less over time. Using this in The Deep for instance I am not attacking and generating adrenaline. I need all the return I can get from it with Leadership and it makes it last longer. So in most cases 10-12 is fine and in some >12 is fine, just rememebr to wait for the heal before wasting energy spamming skills as soon as they are ready. --File:VallenIconwhitesmall.JPG Vallen Frostweaver 19:43, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

With the cost of this skill it was hard enough to keep it up all the time, but doubling the recharge was not only idiotic but really cripples the skill unless you always have more than one Paragon on your team with it, and in PvE that's not likely to happen (except maybe on occasion in Nightfall) but since PvE Only skills are supposed to help you in PvE where everything has more life, attribute points, and levels than you can ever obtain... in a small attempt to balance the unbalance of power in PvE, these skills don't need to be nerfed down even more than they currently are, it's ridiculous. A 15 second recharge I can maybe see, if they were worried about people keeping the skill up all the time, but 20 is just moronic. Why do they keep nerfing skills that aren't over-powered? ~ J.Kougar 04:18, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Auron_Bushi: oh wow what the frik why would they even mess with this skill what where the monsters complaining about it being unbalance or something!!!

This is one of the worst decisions I've seen the dev's make on the Paragon thus far. I literally brought my P-gon out of retirement upon the advent of the Sunspear skills only to have its new signature skill nerfed to obvilion. I highly recommend Izzy come on this discussion and justify this change. 15s recharge I can deal with... 20s is freakin' rediculous and completely unneeded. The dev's just made me think twice about buying GW:EN! Why should I continue to support a company that continually nerfs my two favorite classes... the Mesmer and the Paragon. Bad business decision on ArenaNet's part to release this on the eve of a release! Veraci 05:16, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

This is my first time posting ever, and I have to say I am very disappointed with that changes I see so far. this is a PvE skill, and it should be a reward for all the quests and points we got for reaching the highest rank in Sunspear. Now, what was the purpose now for all that work, when in one swoop they removed ALL the incentive for PVE! Why is it wrong to OWN all those monsters if you achieved super high level? Wat is the purpose now for all those skills? I am very disappointed and I hope this skill and Seed of Life, which is not a COMPLETE joke get restored. Is it because we are too powerful for GWEN with those skills, so they want us to grind again for the same skills but with different names and icons? So what, they will nerf it later? ANET, you do realize people went for those skills as they saw them USEFUL!This is bait and switch and this is bullshit. First your EULA is changing to the point of no accountability whatsoever for ANET, and now this major nerf. I never thought of Guild Wars, ever in negative light. I will not be recommending this game to anyone as a PvE game anymore until I see some changes. Dont PUNISH players for SPENDING THEIR OWN TIME and acquiring those skills. You just told me that my time spending and playing this game for reward is now a big FUCK YOU. No thank you.You are NOT getting my money for GWEN, if this issue is not resolved amicably. I hope gamers will STAY away from this game, until such major and hard earned skills will be restored for what they were. A reward for hard work and numerous hours spent into aquiring them. If you dont restore the skills, you may now compensate me for that time I spent getting them. One green for each level . What a moronic thing you did ANET, and I hope you will quickly change what you just did.

Well like previous posters I'm extremly unhappy with this change. I actually started playing a paragon again in PvE because of this skill, and I agree it is pretty powerfull but it is a PvE skill. Not sure what the reasoning behind this change was, if it was to make more then one paragon in a group viable, look around there are hardly any serious paragon players out there. You're lucky to get one in your group let alone 2 or more. And to do this on the night of GWEN's release feels like a slap in the face. I worked 2 months on my paragon, getting him ready for GWEN and HoM, getting obsidian armor, grinding titles etc, only to have my core PvE skill's effectiveness cut in half. If the recharge and duration were reduced I could see it still being somewhat usefull, like 7 sec duration 10 sec recharge, with the power costs adjusted ofcourse. Now you have a 9-10 second gap in between the damage reduction, that is just too much. If you feel the skill is too powerfull please adjust it in a different way like taking out the heal or lowering the % damage reduction a bit maybe, so it can at least be active most or all of the time. And again, people make decisions based on what PvE skills are avaible in what they play and work on for weeks and months. We've been given the idea that PvE skills are there to give us powerfull skills but dodge the adjustments needed to keep PvP balanced, and now you go ahead and hit it harder then most PvP usable skills will ever be. --Nadiv 07:07, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Reasons for nerf, please. This was pretty much the only skill that allowed Paragons to get into parties. I've seen all the skills I liked using in PvE being savaged because of abuse in PvP, now the specific PvE skills as well? PantsOfGlory 11:13, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Does ANet even read this? I agree with most everyone else. This is a brutal nerf for a much-needed PvE skill. Henri Blanche 13:11, 31 August 2007 EDT

No! No! No! I ground away with my friggin Paragon to get a max SS rank (even putting off going into GWEN) and this is the thanks I get. I’m giving this one week to be readdressed else I’m binning my paragon entirely. The only P skills that worth anything and it gets screwed. Yo, Anet! Listen to your customers. They’re not happy. Thanks a lot. - Faceless Consumer —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 196.25.255.218 (talk • contribs) 16:44, 1 September 2007 (UTC).

I play a Paragon myself, and personally, I am unhappy with the fact that 1 PvE skill could outshine the entire Motivation line. It was overpowered, it is still very good now. I'd rather see a buff to certain other skills than a buff to this one. Combined with Leadership, this thing was just too powerful. Players that ditch Paragons because they're weak are just ignorant. Nicky Silverstar 06:14, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Another nerf to the nerfa-gon!

Or should that be para-gone. Ok first, this shout is way powerful, can't deny that. However, it is the only true useful skill around which an effective paragon can be built in pve. I thought the skill was broken initially and then realised that it was another nerf. They talk about balancing it...hmm, I see only the nerf, a balance woulda seen it come down to 10nrg instead of staying at 15. I have played my paragon since NF came out. I have 10 Titles, not the easy ones, hard ones. Played through the innumerable nerfs that accompanied the paragon. Let's see, paragon was nerfed at least 3 times, ignored completely once and then nerfed again. Shame on you ANet. Go nerf the neccie(LOL and they! soul reaping:0) if you please! Or the Rit. Won't be seeing many paragons now, not with the other solo quests in GWEN as well. No paragon can complete a 1v1 using his classes skills. I had to use Pain, Bloodsong and Painful bond to defeat the stupid gryphon. Come on, that's a bit silly.

Thank goodness my wife plays this game too, that way I CAN get into a party with my paragon! Come on ANet get with the program here, enough with the knee-jerk reactions, do truly balance things out. If you this was a skill balance, it would have been like the rit's getting exhaustion, there you at least lowered nrgy and casting times. Here's it's just bang, extra 10 seconds. Nice. 15/15 would have been better.

But oh well, perhaps you don't read this section anyway. But realise this, there are fewer paragons in this game than any other class and there's a reason for that - your nefing attitude towards him. My paragon is a Holy Lightbringer, you think I can get into a DoA party with real players? Hell no. We do little damage with the spear (so much piercing armour on npc's these days - thanks again). We have 2 nrgy recharge yay! Anything useful we try to do costs at least 10 nrgy. Come on ANet, help us feel special for a change. Help us feel USEFUL! Help us feel like using the primary attributes of a paragon for a change, and not depending more on the 2ndry profession!

We're made to shout, let us SHOUT dammit! There's enough vocal minority and ulcerous lungs in those dungeons anyway! The same with DoA. It's bad enough that the protection chants and shouts don't work on pets or allies or co-operative teams, only party members, unlike the Command shouts, or rit spirit effects. Don't wreck the playability of the paragon for pve, we are just managing as it is! --Shaia 23:01, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Bravo Shaia, you said it all!

ArenaNET! Paragons need and really want this skill for PvE! Please change the recharge back to 10 (or at least 15) - here is a possible solution! Proposal: -15 Cost -10 (or at least 15) Recharge

Shout. For 4 seconds and 1 second for every 2 ranks in Leadership, all allies within earshot take 15...31...35% less damage. Affected allies are healed for 10 Health and 1...8...10 Health for every 3 ranks in Leadership when this Shout ends. -Kjentei

if you do that, whats the point in upping the sunspear rank? it's just a leadership skill

Wow, why is it that the players come up with better ideas than the dev's? Lol. Good idea there, Kjentei. Further point also, in these dungeons, there is a large amount of quickening zephyr happening. It's enough to irritate a paragon with only 2 nrgy recharge. Not to mention the mesmers drinking nrgy as well. The skill is powerful, but there are enough counters and balancing criteria in place. All that this nerf has done is push the paragon out of pve parties. Why bother when you can just get a whole buncha eels - sorry meant ele's - together to just nuke the crap outta the place rather than having to actually play ;) --196.25.255.218 16:48, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

The problem with this is that there is unlikely to be much of an overall outcry about this skill (compare with Seed of Life!), as many gave up on their Paragons months ago after the frequent grinding down of their support skills in general. There are multiple issues here:

• a) Amount of cover. It took quite an extensive amount in Leadership to get the most out of this skill before, now it takes enormous amounts for significantly less cover. Yes, you could run with 2 Paragons, but as most people were reluctant to take ONE paragon in their party unless they had this skill. That, and you'll be lucky to see one Paragon in a major area in the first place.
• b) Possibly more irritating with the 20 sec recharge is that you cannot maintain Refrains with it. There are precious few skills that allow you to keep up refrains on the move and without adrenaline. While I appreciate this is important for PvP balance, its not great for PvE. Its irritating enough to stop every 10 secs to rechant with heroes/hench - try this with a PUG and see how happy they are after a few minutes of this. This is coupled with the few remaining skills of any use being ineffective against Destroyers.
• c) As Paragons (us latecomers, eh?) we do not have a particularly expansive skill set compared to the other classes, and changes like this hit very hard indeed. There are several skills which tend to be of dubious value at the best of times or are very conditional. Also, with the likes of Destroyers being immune to burning (presumably to stop the good old SF eles), it has rendered several skills entirely useless against them:
• 'They're on Fire!'
• Anthem of Flame
• Blazing Finale
• Burning Refrain
• Glowing Signet

Additionally, the following skills are significantly less effective:

• Blazing Spear
• Holy Spear
• Burning Shield

This isn't great when we didn't have an enormous selection to begin with.

• d) Finally, the change is a real kick in the teeth for everyone who ground away (myself, quite a lot) to make this skill more effective. I realise that balancing is a key issue, but to spend months testing these new skills and make balances THEN nerf them with the new game launch (I found out about this after having bought the game and entered the key. It was not a pleasant surprise, and not very professional to hit people with this on launch).

If you're unhappy with this skill as it was, well, I have little control over how you balance skills. But please remember how remarkably unpopular Paragons are in PvE anyway, due to PvP balance issues. I would prefer this skill back to how it was, as some might let Paragons back into their parties, but at the very least, can we have 15s recharge, please? PantsOfGlory 18:50, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Lol wow. This entire section is filled with people who can't comprehend how godly pure damage reduction is. -Auron 03:56, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

Shhh, don't tell everyone or there will be less fail in the game... T1Cybernetic

Changed wording

I don't do the whole wiki editing thing, but the wording on the skill was changed in-game to party members, and thus is also no longer an anomaly. Now, with a 20 second recharge and a clear set definition of who it affects, this skill has become shitty at surface level too! Thanks aNet! Appreciate the butt-effing of what used to be my favorite character!

I updated it and I sympathize with you. There are alternatives like Echo or Serpent's Quickness to help soften the blow but still, my paragon has lost all glamor for others to bring her along now. She has been shelved for now and I am playing other characters. It's just so sad that they took this away as it was the big seller for bringing a paragon and seems to be the only one at times... -- Vallen Frostweaver 02:26, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

I started my paragon just around the time that this skill was released and i have been playing her since then, IN SPITE of the nerfs, you know personally, i was HAPPY after this nerf, i could finally use this skill without feeling guilty, and make no mistake, it is on EVERY build that i have, this is one of the few skills that can sustain such a big nerf and still be so useful. All i need now is a like nerf to SY and i will be happy (as long as we finally get the MASSIVE overhaul that this class has been begging for)--Lorddarkflare 14:57, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

TNTF is still ridiculous. -Auron 10:46, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

i've noticed that although i need 15 energy to cast this it only takes 10 energy off. i'm not sure why .... explain?

Uh, Leadership. Spec more into it, you should be getting 6 back ideally. -Auron 11:48, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

i run 10 leadership with a few of my paragon builds... 5e is generous. I like this skill not only for the dmg reduction but the heal at the end of it is nice to heal up all the bits of dmg the team has taken. if under heavy presure i use "stand your ground" and if its really bad "FALL BACK" ;-) --Justice 06:26, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

lol, you called TntF shitty. you, sir, fail at wuild gars. 71.230.145.170 23:28, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

August 08 update

w00t! another skill buffed in my imbagon party tank build. this couldnt get any better... T~T i think im the happiest man in gw... *tear* maybe this might promote what paras were made for, SERVING THE PARTY! lmao, this is absolutely fantastic. im just waiting for focused anger to become maintainable. lol. --~Phill Gaston ‎ 18:09, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

i'm under the impression that you think this skill got buffed. if you don't max out your SS title on your garapon for this skill you pretty much fail at wuild gars. 71.230.145.170 23:31, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

ok....awesome skill, Starts at 20% and by the time you get off newbie island(4-5 hours later), you will have it by 30%. This should be an obvious example of a Paragon...of course..."They're on Fire!" is a laughable, fail, missed conception, 10 second duration, 10 energy cost, 10 recharge, bad used of number 10, waste of protozoacompared to this skill. Like always, responses comes at the same taste but in the form of one sentence like "yur wronz. 00.00.000.000 agust 00 2008".--ShadowFog 04:05, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

"There's Nothing to Fear!"

→ moved from User talk:Isaiah Cartwright

Dear Izzy,

the normal description says party members, while the concise description says allis. Would you please tell me which one is correct? Thank you in advance. 87.210.150.58 09:49, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

I just tested it, it's party members. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 10:38, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. Where can I report an incorrect description? 87.210.150.58 13:08, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

I just reported it at ArenaNet:Skill bugs. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 02:18, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. I can understand why they named an NPC after you. 145.94.74.23 08:42, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

Incorect healing value?

I noticed that at rank 9 ss healing is 55 here on wiki but on my para's bar it actualy sais 57 and I am now at rank 9 ss. I'm also sure that at rank 8 it was 55. So if any1 can confirm please change the values. DustScorpion 13:26, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

• Interesting - I would like to get the skill, but the only places Wiki has it listed as being available are from hero trainers. Went to all 3 hero trainers listed and they don't have the skill. Does this mean that it has been nerfed completely out of existence? Also noted that the skill is listed as being unusable by heros - if this is the case then why are only hero skill trainers listed? Something really doesn't add up here...

Sunspear skill Vili 12:23, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Be sure to click the "Sunspear Skill" from the profession list when you talk to the hero skill trainer. (77.208.43.3 23:09, 26 January 2009 (UTC))

Energy cost

The skill costs 15 energy, yet when i was in the Ruins of Morah mission i tried to use this skill a couple of times when i had between 15-19 energy only to get the red 'Not enough energy' message. As soon as i hit 20 energy it would cast without a problem though. Can anybody else clarify that this is happening to them or if its just a bug with this mission? I don't recall this happening in prior missions but maybe i haven't been paying enough attention.Luger 06:38, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Quickening Zephyr Vili 06:33, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Ah of course. Sorry for stupid topic and thanks for clearing it up :) Luger 06:42, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Combine with enduring harmony? wtf lol. Would make more sense to say that ritualist skill since at least that affects the shout used and not simply the duration of a shout on one ally. Justice 01:48, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

Skill description discrepancy: "party members" vs. "allies"

The descriptions specify different groups being affected: "allies" (concise) "party members" (normal). Should this be documented as a bug or anomaly?--24.45.47.32 04:40, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

well ip i think it just needs to be have allies changed to party members because thats all it effectsAurenX 00:40, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

Anomaly, since the normal description is correct. elix Omni 00:43, 17 November 2010 (UTC)