Talk:Expert's Dexterity (PvP)

ARFGGSAFDGASDGAS NOOOOOO! --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:74.160.96.199 (talk).

It was already useless, what the hell? Arshay Duskbrow 04:38, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

LOLOLOL trolls. It was pretty damn effective. Mango 04:49, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Overnerfed. Hit dshot or debil if you think the bar is too strong. This makes it unplayable. --70.190.137.151 05:03, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Dshot isn't imba. Debillitating's scaling with marksmanship would be a good change I guess. Or take away +2 marks bonus. Mango 05:16, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Lol, this wasn't all that good, nor all that bad. Burning arrow was still better unless you went for a pure damage build, but it was quite a good skill. In fact, it was a change that there was suddenly a new Ranger Elite that was playable that wasn't magebane or BA. Since Incendiary Arrow got nerfed again, this popped up, and more people QQed and now it sucks balls again. In fact, its worse than it was pre-buff.Crimmastermind 05:41, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

To the above people who think this skill wasn't 'all that great': Try using it with Read The Wind + A Flat bow. Secksy 06:07, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

I have tried it. RtW + Flat is a staple, but using your elite for bow IAS? No thanks. Moot point now, anyway, it's totally destroyed. Another brilliant balance, Anet. I guess "Smiter's Boon"-style skill assassinations are the new procedure? Arshay Duskbrow 06:43, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

It actually wasn't all that great. It was very good, but could easily be outdamaged by Scythes etc. It wasn't so good that it deserved such a thorough nerf to the point of extinction.Crimmastermind 06:52, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Are you joking, hitting for 120+ from outside of spell range is fucking powerful, this was always going to get nerfed. 90.208.74.152 07:12, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Yup, but the fact that it used to hit for 100+ doesn't mean that it should now suck balls. Just because it was super OP before, doesn't mean that your nerf has to make it super under powered. And on a second note, Scythes were still better (120+dmg on three targets and Deep Wound>than 120dmg on one foe at beyond spell range) Crimmastermind 07:16, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

This skill would be balanced as a non-elite now. Who's going to use their elite for only 15% IAS and +1 marksmanship that you need 15 expertise to maintain?

(Late but anyway) The point about this being overnerfed is true (I call it the "balancing pendulum"), but comparison to scythes is bad - yes a scythe can hit for more damage, on more foes, and deal Deep Wound etc easily, but a scythe has melee range so is outdone by crippling, kiting and so forth whereas a bow ranger can maintain dps from range. Also, scythes *can* hit multiple people, but don't if those people spread out, and most importantly there's no "DSweep" - rangers can take interrupts like Savage and still deal damage with something like this. That said, something like an MB ele would nowadays be more useful since you can pack support AND AoE too. 188.74.101.228 17:19, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

lol[edit]

This skill has just been nerfed by ~65% while it wasn't that overpowered at all. I don't really consider making something 65% weaker as part of balancing. Seems just like a quick skill kill to me. SniperFox 11:32, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Hi, I'm Observer Mode. Use me more often, thanks :) -Auron 11:34, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

This skill is useless now, whether it was IMBA or not. Denizen Zero 13:08, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Um... not really. -Auron 13:56, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

It wasn't imbalanced at all. No other ranger elite skills functioned the same way. The +2 bonus for marksmanship may have been slightly abused but the nerf to this skill will essentially make it fall out of use. So much for changing skills to make them more accessible... 66.250.190.121 14:30, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

I don't think it'll fall out of use completely. The skills that were really the problem (sloth hunter's, hunter's shot) are still untouched. Going from a free major rune to a free minor won't hurt that much, if you do the math - what, 6 or 7 damage? Not a huge difference. And the IAS, while nice, wasn't really the point of the skill - it could have been kept up around 20%.

It's nice for spamming damage around, but the actual damage hasn't been reduced by much. Read the Wind and the same attack skills (the ones with activations, which fires them off quickly) are powerful on their own. The only option for a "damage" ranger is ED tbh - burning arrow is nice but it's a totally different concept, and usually requires apply poison. Anyone used to running pew pew rangers will probably still be running ED. -Auron 14:38, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

I seriously doubt this will see much use because other elites easily outclass this one but we will see in observer as you say, won't we? Denizen Zero 17:20, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

Maybe I should tell him that his elite sucks and is outclassed by many others... mmyes... -Auron 06:48, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

if +1 marksmanship only means +6-7 damage why is this useful? it's not for the 15% IAS right?.. --Cancer Angel

07:00, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Just because one person from a high ranked guild ran this once doesn't make it good. Denizen Zero 02:07, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

What other options are there? ED is simply the best elite in the game for a damage ranger. Incendiary is a joke with sloth hunter's and read the wind, burning arrow is very meh without apply poison, and magebane is never run in gvg. If ED was hit hard enough to stop seeing use, people would be running escape instead, because none of the other elites are worth a damn on the bar. -Auron 07:04, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Flail/Escape ownzzzzzzzzz. Misery 09:20, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Don't run damage rangers if this is what you think you're forced to use. This really stinks at damage and makes for a weak build. Other stuff is better. Denizen Zero 02:02, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

rD is running ED/rtw too. -Auron 01:33, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

If it stinks at damage, why are multiple top 100 guilds running it in tournament play? -Auron 02:07, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

While what you say may have some merit, you're ignoring that the majority aren't. It's only really useful at doing moderate RANGED damage. I for one would rather use a utility ele and have him help spike now and then, for example. Or a support paragon would do just about as much damage with the spear and still be able to support. Or just run another melee. Whatever you like really, it'll be better for the most part. Denizen Zero 02:28, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

A paragon do as much damage? Good joke. You have no idea what you're talking about. -Auron 02:34, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

You're missing/ignoring the point. Also, to quote you of all people, "People go to ranger because of troll unguent, natural stride, apply poison and filler elite. Paragons are better DPS at stand, but lack the ridiculous amounts of self-preservation that a ranger has. A paragon would be an idiot to try to solo a ranger." Paragons are better at DPS? Am I taking something out of context? Denizen Zero 02:38, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Maybe I'm missing the point of using a Ranger for damage to begin with when I'd rather just use standard axe bars and its ilk. For the range, ease of hitting, targeting, and spiking, with bonus interrupts? I would conjecture that the build isn't about doing lots of damage, but being able to deal DECENT damage and still interrupt stuff. I do still think other stuff would be better, not just for damage, but also utility, including standard Burning Arrow rangers or Melandru's Shot rangers. And in general, I fail to see how this build justifies a team slot against everything else you could use instead. Denizen Zero 23:54, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

P R E S S U R EI would assume. --

Riddle 01:35, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

I guess I was asleep when rangers became better at pressure than warriors. Gotta be more to it than mere damage pressure. Denizen Zero 01:48, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

From a range. --

Riddle 05:57, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

With D-shot/Savage Shot. Denizen Zero 20:27, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

I would like to say that Expert's Dexterity was not the only damage for a Ranger. Several people I know enjoy using Glass Arrows. Glass Arrows is extremely powerful, and with Lightning Reflexes, a little Weaken Armor as a R/N with Needling Shot (when they're below 50%) is severe damage. Of course you can always add Rigor Mortis so that the target cannot block whether they use an enchantment block such as Guardian, or if it's a stance block such as Whirling Defense. Than 01:40, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

GvG, not HA. You'd be bitchslapped if you brought GA into GvG. --

Riddle 01:46, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Same with HA. Glass arrows is trash outside of rspike. -Auron 01:50, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

burning arrow pew pew says hi. --Readem 02:31, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Pretty sure nobody is running that for a reason. -Auron 02:33, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

actually, reflected showed it to me. isn't he in your guild o.o? --Readem 02:44, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Yes, and even our guild isn't running it :< -Auron 02:45, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Cirq and ref were testing it yesterday. IT gets about 300 DPS or so. Dhaina seemed quite interested in it as well. --Readem 02:45, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Keep in mind this isnt the entire update. Could be on thrusday Anet will be buffing some other ranger elite to see it compete with this for pvp usage.

Come on 1/2 second activation Barrage!--Ryudo 03:43, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Nah, if anything it's Marksman's Wager --

Riddle 05:40, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

LOL, I want 1/2 second Barrage for PvE at least. If there's something that really needs 1/2s activation...

Poison Arrow 5e 1/2s 1r "If Poison Arrow hits, target foe is poisoned for 10...22...25 seconds."

Yeah, they run BA and Flail now. "Maybe I should tell him that his elite sucks and is outclassed by many others... mmyes.." Guess what? He doesn't run ED anymore. BA instead. 98.226.112.109 21:49, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Smiter's Booned?[edit]

It has lost 18% and +1 Marksmaship addition. Is this even reliable now when compared to other elites like Burning Arrow?--ShadowFog 20:45, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

Garbage. It seems to me Anet only ever wants Rangers to run BA, or possibly Magebane. What else is there? Incendiary? Recharge already nerfed once, and since its still actually usable I suspect it'll take another hit eventually, probably to its AoE size. Cripshot? Its day is long past. Melandru's Shot? Unreliable with bad recharge. <Insert other Ranger elite here>? Don't make me LOL. (Oh, and...Punishing Shot? $@*()$#@*()$!!!) Arshay Duskbrow 06:48, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

Still viable, see above section. -Auron 08:00, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

We seem to be agreeing, actually. "No other choice" doesn't mean "good". It means no other choice. That's not viability, it's a lack of options. Just what we want in a PvP metagame... Arshay Duskbrow 08:26, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Well, since Anet obviously loves BA (never been nerfed, actually been buffed), I bet they are either going to nerf this again (what, -50% IAS and +1 Marksmanship lol) or buff BA (I'm hoping for 10 seconds of burning). Oh, and I'd rather run Magebane over this in GvG after this nerf.Crimmastermind 08:39, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Is someone butthurt over this nerf lolol? between this skill, and Warrior's endurance, I don't think euros mind playing this game. --Readem 02:55, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

Anet wants to force people to buy Nightfall so they can use burning arrow. Oh, and you forgot Quick Shot and Poison Arrow on the list of "Bad Bow elites". Hmmm... you ask why everyone uses burning arrow? Because everything else is inviable. It's like asking 10 random thirsty people if they want a glass of pure water, a glass of mud, or a glass of soap detergent. Can't blame them for all picking the water.

ONOZ!!! *Update!* Izzle continues to kizzle our skizzles, fo' shizzle! More nerfs at eleven. --Warren G 07:09, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

Hi, please use me --0bs m0d3

Have to agree with Obs here. Last I checked, Melandru's was a Factions Elite. --

Riddle 05:24, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

New Skill Idea[edit]

If you wish to discuss changes to skills, you should wait until the Feedback namespace is open and post your ideas there. Mainspace is for documenting the game as it is, not for discussing how you'd like it to be. -- Wyn