Talk:Signet of Mystic Speed

New running skill. Will this skill make snares useless? 7 enchants and this, if you are crippled, will you move at +33% or at -17%? --Deathwing 01:06, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

I suspect the -17% scenario is correct - the maximum contribution this skill can make to movement would be capped ay 33% (i.e. 3 enchantments to max out effect). The fact that it isn't a stance and it is in a non-primary attribute will garner a lot of interest from runners. Also, the signet has no activation time, so I imagine it will have similar mechanics to Dolyak Signet 203.217.0.53 01:40, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Droks run got a lot easier if this stays as it is. I see it maybe needing a nerf though. Constant, free running skill that requires multiple enchant removals to get rid of. Maybe some kind of drawback though? Like you lose 40...15..7 armor or something, or maybe decreased attack damage? --Deathwing 01:46, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure if the cap is actually meaning u can only gain 33%, or with this ur overall capis at 33%. IE if its this skill then yes with 3 enchants + cripple you'd be 17% slower. But if its an overally cap, meaning that while using this skill u cant get more than 33%, then the balance would work that with 3 enchants and a cripple, you'd be at 5% slower. Need confirmation. --ChronicinabilitY 02:36, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Mending, Holy Veil, and Purifying Veil. Then ya got 33% buff, no cast time, and you can use a stance. Throw in Dwayna's Touch, and ya got yourself a build. ~~ frvwfr2 (talk · contributions) 03:05, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

And, everyone is totally jealous of you since your using mending, and have -3 energy regen? Watchful intervention, however, seems nice. Sword.wind. 22:46, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Yup i was thinking of watchful intervention too, id only bother with 2 enchants also, unless the enchant give me a good benefit, its only 3% diff , and yes this needs to remove and enchant on it ending, with that i could be nice to throw a offensive enchantment on you before you run in that will damage or put a condition on the foe when it ends . Durga Dido 00:00, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

Good running skill, it could give a slightly advantage to Wounding Strike Dervishes maybe, or other "enchantment-needed" builds. No need of Rush or Pious Haste in such cases :p 91.168.173.210 10:16, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

And I think that is the problem. There are already supreme Dervish running builds. I did not do the Droks run for maybe a year, and with this Dervish build it worked in the first try and I could even afford to take a wrong turn now and then: http://www.pvxwiki.com/wiki/Build:D/A_Dark_Silence_Runner . But this also has a negative effect on PvP. 1-2 Enchantments on a Dervish is not a big problem for a Dervish at all. But then it can also used by everyone else for zero energy, even with zero to little investment in Wind Prayers. 4-5 does not cost many points, and then you can use it on almost any X/Dervish char and get some 9-10 seconds of 17-33% speed boost with 15 recharge. And this definitely has high abuse potential. It is not even a Stance or Enchantment, it cannot be removed, mind that. --Longasc 10:00, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

I've submitted change later (look at the paragraph starting by 'woo' that's me). I understand this can get really nasty in some builds but i've never considered ppl running more than 2 enchants as serious since that will ruin at least half of their skill bar (+this signet + rez) and enchants can easily be stripped with the new GWN Necro skills. Actually this is maybe the downside, if you do not have lots of enchant removals you won't be able to counter the effect provided by this signet so i totally agree and vote for a nerf in duration, a really serious one would be dropping duration to 4...9 and 10max with 15-16 Wind Prayers which nobody runs and increasing reload up to 20s but i don't think that should get further into nerfing cause with at least 2-3 enchant removals you can in such conditions deal with this skill imo oO 88.122.33.120 10:08, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Forget Holy Vail... just put this on a 55HP concept monk with some Bond-o and other skills and you got yourself an Invinci-Runner... As soon as the skills were announce and I read this one, I thought about my Mo/W Tanking Monk that has 300 HP... with Bonds, Essences and Belthazar, and Mending and Blessed Sigs and such... with this skill you can run forever and only stop to recoop the lost Energy from attacks... HIGHLY nerfable for that reason... but profitable if not... - Sabre Wolf, Clan Heavy Metal

I don't really see the point in nerfing this skill only because Bonders or such will use it to run... Every Balanced team has enchantement removal, they can easily shut down Bonders even if they run away (and therefore they won't have enough enchants to make a nice use or at least easy use of this skill). Of course that's PvP issues, if you are talking about PvE i actually think that's a good thing and i don't either think this needs a nerf in regards of PvE, it isn't like if lots of monks would run this skill. 88.121.206.45 10:46, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

I think the big thing I am looking at is the fact that this is the only running skill (besides Avitar Belthazar w/ Eternal Aura, also a Derv skill) that can be renewed before it runs out and its at no additional cost... atleast with the other combo it costs you 15 Energy. With this, all you need is Faithful Intervention (casted once with no upkeep) and 10-11 in Wind Prayers... But why have this skill? There already is Enchanted Haste... which does virtually the same thing and that costs energy and it runs out before the recharge. - Sabre Wolf, Clan Heavy Metal

woo i didn't notice the resemblance with Enchanted Haste. Actually yeah, this signet seem too powerfull compared to EH, should it be nerfed so it will no longer be kept constantly ? Maybe not, maybe that just needs some changes in the scaling process, i mean the link between the number of enchant and the related speed buff. Enchanted Haste meets a direct 25% speed buff while the signet starts at 15%. You're likely to use 2 enchants max in GvG or so i think so droping the bonus at 10%/enchant isn't enough imo, that should stay at 15% however the duration should be reduced in fact.Sorry for the self-reflection process i'm trying to get this thing clear ^^ Yeah in the end i'll go for : Not Changing Reload Time, Reducing Duration to something like 10s and go for a scaling like 4...10...12, Keeping a 15%/enchant speed buff with still a 33% cap obviously. Concerning the reasons why you should use the signet.... i think people running 2 or more enchants benefits better from this Signet besides it doesn't cost mana and because it's an instantaneous activating signet and not a stance it cannot be removed but the effectiveness can only be -->progressively<-- reduced by enchantement removal. If you only use 1 enchant this skill looses it's leadership 88.122.33.120 09:40, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

I dont think and out righ tnerfing of the skill is in order... just a scale back like you mentioned to lower the duration time... becuase like i just noted, you dont even need full Wind Prayers in order to use this skill... at least with skills like Protective Bond, you need atleast 15 points in Protection to even just the energy lost down to -3, but then still have to have Essense Bond and Belthazar to lower further to -1.. this means runes must be used. But with this skill, you dont need to be maxed out to get the full benifit. I am going down the list with Sprint, Dash, Run as One, Storm Chaser heck i'll even throw in Armor of Mist... all of them have a 50-30% cool down time before reuse... the only other skill ON ITS OWN, that can be reused before its end piriod is Flame Djinn's Haste... BUT! Your looking 1.) a lengthy casting time compaired to zero for run skills... 2.) Disenchant = end... its harder to end a stance (wild blow) then an enchantment... so i would opt for a scale back to fit the other running skills to fit the curve of a cool down, espically when this skill is a signet....... But on a side note, ? for you guys on the topic of 33% cap... if this is true, then how is it that I stack myself over the 33% mark, but yet a Sand Drake, with no speed or stance skills can run me down and cath me? Can someone please explain or look into why Drakes posses the ability to run over 33% weather or not they contain a run skill??? - Sabre Wolf, Clan Heavy Metal

Drakes havd armor of mist, and above when I said mending and w/e else, I meant for a run build. -- frvwfr2 (talk · contributions) 04:39, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

...uhh mate...i wouldn't use mending even if I could go D/A/Mo..not worth the slot.Sword.wind. 01:30, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

This is what I ment...

Divine Favor 2+3, Earth Prayers 8, Protection Prayers 10+3+1, Wind Prayers 12

Just replace Enchanted Haste with Signet of Mystic Speed... this is one of my own builds I use... see what I am getting at? - User:SabreWolf

honestly, not really. It doesn't seem bad...but there are already better things out there. Sword.wind. 06:31, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Activation time?

So what's the cast speed on this puppy, or is it an insta-signet? --arredondo 21:56, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Insta-Sig from what it looks like - User:SabreWolf

Yeah, but if you activate it while running your character stops then you have to start running again. (69.228.41.224 04:01, 26 August 2007 (UTC))

This skill still cleans the floor with most warrior and dervish running stances124.177.71.100 02:47, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the skills activation and whether you stop or not is really clunky. I've been using it for a while and it seems that if you're charging a target and use it it's an instant activation no stop. Any other circumstance you stop to activate it. To clarify charging, I mean if you were to Ctrl-Attack and then use the sig a 1/2 second later the sig wouldn't stop you mid way to target. Gothica 18:48, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

I think that with the coding of this skill, it was a spell type skill, but with an activation of 0, so you have to be still to use it, as with a normal spell. 90.210.90.30 16:55, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Reading from the usage section of the Mystic Speeder build you can remove the aftercast delay if you strafe a bit while casting - Byakko 01:07, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

If you're auto-attacking, you run toward your target automatically, even if you stop to cast a spell (or in this case, signet). The coding for auto-attacking makes it resume itself after being overridden unless the override is another movement (strafing, for example). So, if you're auto-attacking (running toward) a target, using this will immediately be followed with a command to run at the target. Since there was no activation or aftercast, there isn't any real stop. However, if you're running of your own accord (WASD), using something like Mystic Regeneration causes you to stop, and isn't instantly followed by a "keep going after that target" command. So you stop, and have to start running again. It used to annoy me, but after using it for a while, I can activate it while moving with almost no delay at all; it just takes some getting used to. To comment on that "no one serious runs more than one enchantment" deal... This and this are typical on GvG derv bars. Raine - talk 17:27, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

Nerf

was nerfing it in PvE to stop runners? I cant think of any other use for SoMS other than this - Byakko 00:32, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

I would guess IMS for WS Dervish in GvG. Didn't require a lot of wind prayers to get the full effect. --Link4all 02:35, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

I still don't see why they couldn't have reverted Wounding Strike and left this and Chilling Victory alone. 72.81.247.139 05:16, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Because Wounding Strike is a balanced skill that deserves to be left alone! It's the only decent condition-causing dervish skill for PvP with a non-niche requirement. And as the PvP assassin has shown us a billion times over, conditions>raw damage. Besides, there's a whole bunch of skills that can easily counter WS, and if your monk doesn't have the brain capacity to bring at least one of them when Wounding Strike is the dervish metagame then get a new monk. Or better, bring your own counter, since you know you'll be facing WS eventually. But to be honest, I'm glad aNet is finally attempting to balance the synergy between skills (ie. SoMS + WS + Mystic/Eremite's + Chilling) rather than simply blasting individual skills into non-existance half blindfolded. T'is a good thing ^^ Silavor 10:38, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

I mean't why they nerfed it in PvE and PvP the notice on the dev page is pretty vague

"Signet of Mystic Speed costs no energy, has no cast time and can be maintained permanently. By increasing the recharge, it now requires a high investment into Wind Prayers to achieve this same effect." - Byakko 12:22, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

Oh I wonder why WS isn't overpowered. I suppose DW + Bleed every 3 seconds isn't a lot really. We should make WS cause burning and cripple too, and interrupts on hit, then reduce activation time to 1/4. *vomit* >_> ---->(SWAY)220.255.7.229 19:00, 11 July 2008 (UTC)

[Sigh] this must have been for the runners, with Chilling Victory nerf as well, people are using enchanted haste as permanent speed boost in pvp now - Byakko 13:39, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

You know, I hate to have to sound like this, but there's only one way I can think to say it that gets the point across:

Fuck Sway.

Anet's been nerfing everything because it's imba on Rangers. Pious Assault and Chilling Victory are the ones that bother me, though I'm sure we can all think of other things that broke with Expertise. Just, damn, stop making other classes suffer because you love your rangers. Nerf Expertise. Nerf Expertise. Not Derv skills. Nerf Expertise. Everything else that someone finds a way to abuse gets nerfed, but this has been a problem since, what, forever? If you're not going to nerf Expertise, then buff some other primary attributes.

• Strength: For each rank in strength, you get 1% AP and +10 maximum Health.
• Energy Storage: For each rank in energy storage, you get +3 maximum Energy and you gain 2% of the spell's energy back each time you cast a spell.
• Fast Casting: Your spells cast 3% faster and recharge 2% faster.
• Divine Favor: For each rank of Divine Favor, allies are healed for 3.2 whenever you cast spells on them and whenever you cast a spell on an ally below 25% health, you gain 1 energy at ranks 3 and above, 2 energy at ranks 8 and above, and 3 energy at ranks 13 and above.
• Soul Reaping is fine, IMO. Maybe a Health gain?
• Critical Strikes is also fine, IMO.
• Spawning Power: Whenever you create a creature, that creature's level is increased by 1 for every 2 ranks in spawning power. Weapon spell durations are increased by 2% for each rank.
• Mysticism: When an enchantment ends on you, you gain 3 health for each rank of Mysticism and 1 energy for every 3 ranks in Mysticism. The attribute level of enchantments cast on you is increased by 1 at ranks 3 and above, 2 at ranks 8 and above, and 3 at ranks 13 and above.
• I know nothing about Leadership, really. I don't know how to change it.

Because Expertise is broken. It. Is. Broken. You know, it's so broken, in fact, that I'm going to start a petition here. If you think Expertise is broken, please sign, not that anyone's ever going to look at it... Raine - talk 18:01, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

I'd love to see strength and divine favor's effects in play. -- Halogod35 02:25, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

I'm a derv primary, and our class gets VERY little love. I'd be thrilled to see this implemented. It might make us actually preferential with our own weapon! 141.165.171.95 19:36, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Note

"if you have 3 or more enchants, speed boost will not negate snares", It wont? This note is odd and cofusing Justice 00:34, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

It means that if you have more than three enchantments, and are under the effects of a snare such as cripple or mind freeze, the effects of the speed boost won't stack above 33% to counter the snare. Look at it this way, some people think, "Okay, I have signet of mystic speed, giving me a 33% movement boost (capped). Suddenly, I become snared. I now only have (let's say 10%) movement speed boost. Logically, that isn't the signet's cap, so I should be able to stack enchantments to get boosted back at 33%." Thing is, you still have the 33% boost cap from signet, but some of it is being counter-acted by a snare. It's still present at cap, though, and cannot be exceeded. This note is just a concise way of explaining that. ~Ryuu[ Talk | Meow :3 ] 00:56, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

OH ok ty. The signet will give a max of PLUS +33% to your speed, not stack enchantments untill you reach a speed of 133% Justice 04:35, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

New Function

Ok, so looking at this new version, it seems pretty hard to stay dead in PVE now. Eternal Aura when you enter a map, then if you die, this and Eternal Aura cast instantly right after it. A fast cast mesmer could fire the combo even faster to prevent interrupts, for a seemingly solid backline auto-res. Guildwarsrunner 06:41, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

This + Orders

Given what the skill states, this makes all the orders insta cast even tho they arent exactly self targeting. This a bug or are orders actually self targeting as such since you dont have to target allies to cast it? 82.22.107.194

"Self-targeting" is a misnomer for any skill that does not target, including orders. –~=Ϛρѧякγ (τѧιк) ←♥– 18:51, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Aftercast?

Are enchantments cast under SoMS affected by aftercast? 174.6.141.54 15:00, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

They ought to be, the same way that Glyph of Sacrifice and Glyph of Essence spells still trigger aftercast. elix Omni 09:56, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

Bug

it seems as tho this acts as spirit bond before it was fixed. it doesnt renew the counter if recast99.155.88.209 04:30, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

Yeah..if you have 4 wind prayers and cast this, then use 1 self targeting enchantment and then recast SOMS and use another self targeting enchantment SOMS will end as it doesn't renew and will only be good for 1 more self targeting enchantment. oh well.119.224.98.92 06:27, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

I'd really like this one to be fixed makes somethings much easier 82.161.39.143 09:47, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

It says instant cast but some times it gets rupt or doesnt give me the enchant. --145.53.206.77 12:58, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Really should be fixed pretty annoying. 82.161.39.143 10:02, 23 August 2011 (UTC)