User talk:Lilondra/Gamebalance/Necromancer/Archive

pandas

ups 10/1/09 added Foul feast Lilondra *gale* 06:53, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

50% Uptime is imba so what he loses a little health instead of the imba scythe damage. Fox007 12:19, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

To what skill are you referring ? Lilondra *gale* 14:24, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

If you are referring to Foul feast you made a small mistake.The ENEMY can not be damaged for 2 seconds.This basicly lets all pressure trough (degen for example) but prevents a spike use for Foul Feast (by reapplying DW right after again) Lilondra *gale* 14:26, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

ups Fox007 21:43, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

bump Lilondra *gale* 14:47, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Wail of Doom to strong in current form useless in old form.

Contagion that is one hell of a funny skill to play with but is the enchanted one the one who sacrefice life or the one who casted it?

Lingering Curse decrease energy to 15.

Pain of Disenchantment Either lower the damage or add a different effect only disenchanting for this skill is bad.

Fox007 15:33, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

I will change WoD later atm the best thing I can think of is Revert.Contagation Saccs the health of the necromancer.The thing is that with this update necromancers should really watch all the health loss.Lingering curse,mmm I might buff it.Not so sure of PoD though it already is really powerfull.Youre underestimating mass enchant removal.Lilondra *gale* 16:04, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

it's now kinda the same as Strip Enchantment. Fox007 16:13, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Updated all the mentioned skills exept contagation.And yh only Strip Enchantment deals 65 damage and PoD did 100 + PoD was in a better line.Anyway I updated them ;) Lilondra *gale* 16:15, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Wail of Doom to much health loss at once if user has around 500 health he will lose 125 health + 45 / 90 / 135 at once spiking himself rather then the target.

Pain of Disenchantment love that skill but i think people will just take a Ranger with apply poison and incendiary arrows to instant cause disease with it. Fox007 16:24, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

You have to remove an enchantment really.Why use skills that cause bleeding + poison with it.Wouldnt that overlap with the effect ? dont you want to do as much damage with it as you can ? And I'm aware of the huge sacc on WoD its menth to be like that really.It a Wail of Doom Its as dangerous for the foe as it is for you Lilondra *gale* 16:35, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Apply Poison is kinda standard for a ranger and using one rangers who causes poison cancels the first 2 effects (bleeding and poison or do you need both for disease to apply?) of the PoD Necro. Fox007 16:40, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Yh the idea is to have both:p will fix Lilondra *gale* 16:53, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Dood

Muchacho better than last time, keep going liek dis <3. Xhata 14:44, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Foul Feast

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL EPIC DAMAGE AND UNLIMITED DURATION WITH PLAGUE SIGNET -- Halogod35 14:56, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Actually there is a cap and it can get removed :p Lilondra *poke* 16:50, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Overpowered Deathly Swarm there.

144 dmg + an additional 48 to 216 dmg when bleeding to enemies at the location of the foe it was cast on. Just round up the enemies and it's overpowered. This should then become a EoE skill and should cause scattering.

Imagine it in a skill bar like this, this is from top of my head. This would be with your Vile Miasma, Deathly Swarm, Fetid Ground and no elite so...

I think it's really overpowered so yeah it would not be a good change. Qaletaqa Hania 15:49, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

These are pvp changes btw.Also yes it would apply to pve but you would have to see it together with the other updates (including the one where I remove pve skills) Lilondra *poke* 16:50, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Excuse me, that build is just meh. You can use Ray of Judgement or any Fire Magic for that purpose (=AoE DoT) without dedicating your whole bar to a combo that takes like 5 seconds to activate. Honestly, there are much better ways. Dark Morphon 11:40, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

@Lilondra: It still would be overpowered according to me when you would remove the pve skills. I'll check the other updates tho, don't have the time atm, but I will.

@Dark Morphon: Don't really care about the build beeing "just meh" :), I know there are better ones, this was just an example. Qaletaqa Hania 12:56, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Then what's the issue? If this build isn't overpowered (and it isn't, especially compared to truly overpowered builds) there is no problem at all. Dark Morphon 14:26, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Sry that I didn't respond earlier Dark Morphon.

I don't compare it to overpowered builds, I compare it to normal and/or underpowered builds. Everything that is slightly to alot stronger then normal is overpowered in my oppinion, elite skills beeing the exception here because those should be slightly stronger then normal. And i'm not talking about the build beeing overpowered but i'm talking about Lilondra's version of some of those skills used in that example build to show that the skills have the potential to be used in overpowered builds.

But Lilondra pointed out to me that I didn't take the other changes into account, wich I didn't, therefore my statement/oppinion is useless. But I will make sure, in the future, that I will do that :).

Also, this is just theoretical so it is not a problem :). Qaletaqa Hania 22:51, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

As per request

Continuing our conversation on MSN from yesterday on this wiki:

• Wail of Doom: This is probably the best form for this skill idea: "Elite Hex Spell. For 6 seconds, target foe moves 15-33% slower and the next spell targetting an ally of his has only half spell casting range." 5e 1c 15r, an interesting variant on the Shame pattern, forcing positioning and essentialy slowing down help for the more far away frontline.
• Cacophony: I still think my version would be better.
• Vocal Minority: As I said, severely overpowered. Combines the best properties of Migraine and your new Wail of Doom essentialy making a beast of a skill. Also note how this skill is non-elite.
• Cultist's Fervor: I think you can safely increase the attribute bonus of this skill to 2 points. Also introduce more skills which can benefit from this effect.
• Health steal spells: Interesting addition, increasing added pressure but also a nerf to spikes. I like it.
• Blood Magic in general: I think you are not giving this line enough options as of yet. In this form it will likely still not be used.
• Minions: Probably should work fine, just fiiine.
• Envenom Enchantments: Probably works as well.
• Bitter Chill: Non-elite version of Toxic Chill? I don't know, not really a niche that's needed atm
• Death Nova: Hmm, I think this skill is fine as is.
• Fetid Ground and Deathly Swarm: Giving Necromancers AoE DoT skills is probably a bad idea.
• Death Magic overall: You fixed the minion problem and did some unnecessary changes. Just keep skills which are fine as is. Concerning some underpowered skills which you buffed, I don't think they will be used in this form.
• Faintheartedness: This change will likely take it out of play. Now, this skill is unhealthy for the game and should be taken out, but aren't there better options?
• Lingering Curse: Comparing to Defile Flesh, this is just not worth the elite slot.
• Gaze of Contempt: Non-elite Shatter Storm?
• Parasitic Bond: Still Fire and Forget.
• Wither: ^
• Malaise: ^
• Rend Enchantments: Lowering the amount of Enchantments removed on low scales is indeed what this skill needs. Spot on.
• Suffering: Still Fire and Forget, you may have nuked it.
• Barbs: That's a really harsh nerf.
• Defile Defenses: Yes, I have suggested this as well.
• Soul Bind: Comparing to Shared Burden, severely underpowered.
• Pain of Disenchantment: Aaaand this is actually a buff.
• Signet of Suffering: My suggestion as well, severely underpowered with your stats though. Decrease the cast time to 1/4 at the very least.
• Curses in general: While you fix some problems, you don't give much compensation. This way, you will probably only just kick Curses out of the game. So, you really need to think up some new functionalities for those spells. Dark Morphon 11:40, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Like I said I didn't give cacophony a int because of interprofession dynamics and the fact that I want to reduce the amount of ints each minute.I agree on vocal minority I gave it a severe nerf but will proly change it to something else anyway.

About : Fetid Ground  : Poison the ground at target foe's location. For 10 seconds, foes adjacent to that location are struck for 2...20...25 cold damage each second and suffer from poison (3 seconds) . 10 1 25

Deathly Swarm  : Create a Deathly Swarm foe's location. For 8 seconds, foes near that location are struck for 4...15...18 shadow damage each second and and an additional 5...19...22 damage if that foe was bleeding. 10 2 25

I made these skills some time ago as part of my force positioning and push necro's to pressure campaign.However I must admit that I don't exactly like the skills.Looking back I don't think its a good change.Then further in general you are right about some severe nerfs.But thinks like Faint need a nerf anyway and tbh Shadow of Fear will take its niche already.Wich imo is a more healthy skill (because of the 2 second cast for example) Lilondra *poke* 11:49, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Meh, you simply have to give Spells and ranged skills in general smart functions because they are not affected by kiting/chasing and most other positional tricks. That's simply something you always have to keep in mind when balancing. Dark Morphon 14:29, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

major blood update

discuss Lilondra *gale* 21:06, 16 January 2009 (UTC) bump Lilondra *gale* 09:02, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Angorodon's Gaze needs more damage and less energy manegment.

Signet of Agony Conditions come after the damage or before? and besides that does it have a Shockwave effect? i.e foes in earshot get 45 damage per condition.

Fox007 17:52, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

The condition damage is before the conditions are applied ofcourse.And it Isnt shockwave effect Lilondra *Poke* 18:05, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

i know reading is difficult for me :3 Fox007 18:12, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

As a whole,

it looks good. I like that some of the AoE skills affect allies, too; I'd like to see all AoE like that, since it puts some positioning strategy in the game. Also, it just makes sense... "Lookit me! I'm standin in teh meteor shower!" is kind of strange.
I don't see any huge issues, but I'll come back and post again if something occurs to me. Raine - talk 20:26, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

update

Guess I'll fix curses next followed by death magic Lilondra *Poke* 19:41, 19 January 2009 (UTC)

B U M P Lilondra *Poke* 12:32, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

Balance

I'm only listing things I don't like here.

• Giving hexes more than 100% uptime is bad. One hex should only affect one person.
• Blood Bond has life loss in its effect, it doesn't need a sacrifice cost.
• Vampiric Spirit - why?
• Flavor wise, cacophony and daze don't mix. Cacophony is latin for "bad sounding."
• Some people might want to use tons of vampiric spells. Why take all but one of them out of the game while one's in use?
• Vampiric bite is overpowered that way.
• Unholy Feast is unnecessarily confusing.
• Toxic chill is OP. hint: It's the 5 recharge enchant strip.
• Lingering curse recharges too quickly.
• Rend recharges too quickly.
• Pain of Disenchantment is too long and recharges too quickly. ~Shard 20:22, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Will add more later but the previous description of dazed was silenced so if you hear someone sing that bad that you're speachless you're silenced xD Lilondra *Poke* 07:06, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

• I want to create 2 sorts of hexes.Hexes with a very long duration that create pressure but are not nearly as strong as the current insidious or faint for example.And hexes that are very active and strong (diversion for example).However covering them is quite stupid Its more the timing Lilondra *Poke* 12:01, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
• Perhaps gave it other buffs will look at it again .
• Vampiric Spirit - why? So it combines with Life bond.
• The idea is that the necromancer spreads very "bad sounds" towards the opponent causing him to be confused,dazed,silenced,...
• Some people might want to use tons of vampiric spells. Why take all but one of them out of the game while one's in use?
• Perhaps slight nerf
• MMM will look at it
• Perhaps a harder to meet condition :) + a upped recharge
• Might change indeed
• SACC
• mmm Perhaps a greater downside and a slight buff so description remains short.

Feast and PoD remain,The thing is you can carry more then 1 lifesteal you just cant spam them on ONE target.Also forgot vamp bite Lilondra *Poke* 12:40, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

ail of doom

wow suicide D: --Super Igor flame my shove sin bar! 14:28, 10 February 2009 (UTC)

If emo's can kill themselves here it might prevent them from doing it IRL or atleast prepare them before they start doing it wrong Lilondra *Poke* 17:14, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

Never thought Anet takes emos into account when balancing! :p --Super Igor flame my shove sin bar! 17:19, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

You should have known xD Lilondra *Poke* 17:33, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

BTW its not that suicidical really 60 damage each enchantment.3 enchantments is quite common I guess (stacks dont really happen THAT much or you should stop spiking their WS shitter).Well in that case you would take 180+150 damage = 330 = 55 % ish the thing is that the guy you target will proly be dead (if you see it that way it actually still is OP) Lilondra *Poke* 17:37, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

Contagion has that restriction to only yourself to keep it from being exploited.

Nice touch skill, especially the one with 5 energy cost, laughable recharge, steal 3 energy+70ish(cbatodomath) damage

Spoil victor is laughable. Energy management that is worth than gole, gives the enemy energy management aswell HOWEVER at the terrible cost of...2+r..? Awesome against flarespammers.

faintheartness. Target stands still for 3 seconds, 25 sec recharge

Nerfing deathly swarm? Why? Do explain, please.Oni 19:46, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

You steal energy,You do NOT steal health you GAIN it.Contagation your right.Spoil victor I upped the additional recharge.I think the functionality might be a decent monk shutdown (WOH every 8 seconds).Remember if you cast it on a attacking foe it is only 13 secs recharge.Your right about the terrible duration.DM might have a point it is a broken functionality.I rebuffed DS and no it wasnt to nerf the deathspike. Lilondra *panda* 11:46, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

Honestly, Spoil Victor is still useless :/. Dark Morphon(contribs) 11:50, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

Point taken removed SV Lilondra *panda* 11:52, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

Honestly, you should change the entire skill-list for the necromancer. Nothing is balanced correctly here. And the vampiric touch is useless if you just gain health.83.249.112.17 16:54, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

Mind to give me a hand ? If its just numbers then I will think through but the main objective now is to take out the functionalities that are broken Lilondra *panda* 05:57, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

note

BTW most balances are just I check description of a UP OP skill and do the first thing that comes in my mind.Later on I check again,remove change sofisticate etc. Lilondra *panda* 11:54, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

General Rebalance

Pls give (constructive ) comments.IF numbers are wrong say so.If the mechanic is bad say so.No backup = no answer Lilondra *panda* 14:07, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

Fine, I'll give a full opinion.

• Reaper's Mark: Do we really want this skill back in the game?
• Wail of Doom: Nice idea, but namewise I would rather give this to Weaken Knees.
• Foul Feast: Already gave my reasoning why I think this is not a good idea.
• Order of the Vampire: Order skills are fine, they are rather costy but powerful.
• Blood Bond: Why? Irremovable buffs are bad for the game. (Note: Can be used by two Necromancers that use this on each other, making it party-wide free regeneration which is bad.)
• Blood Renewal: Yeah, pretty nice.
• Life Siphon: Really, the 2 second casting time is the only thing that keeps this from being overpowered.
• Cacophony: Too costy when being like this, too unconditional with less cost. I would say give it a condition but also make it more practical.
• Ulcerous Lungs: Possible.
• Vocal Minority: Omnomnom? Why would people use this over Signet of Humility?
• Cultist's Fervor: Quite a nice idea, has a lot of potential.
• Vampiric Gaze: Yeah, I was thinking alongside those lines.
• Ravenous Gaze: Possible.
• Angorodon's Gaze: Again, possible.
• Oppressive Gaze: Luks prewtty strong.
• Barbed Signet: I'm having a discussion with Oni at the moment about this possibility because, at the moment, no caster skill is able to do a thing such as this (unless you call Deadly Arts caster).
• Blood is Power: 1/2 cast time is :/. Also, this is a very powerful skill. Buffing it may be dangerous.
• Blood of the Agressor: Again, possible.
• Dark Pact: Interesting idea. Perhaps a bit too powerful.

Will continue this later. Dark Morphon(contribs) 16:16, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

• Reaper's Mark: Do we really want this skill back in the game?

The Idea is to have as many skills back into the game.

This skill was rather overpowered, so rework or it will be that again.

• Wail of Doom: Nice idea, but namewise I would rather give this to Weaken Knees.

Perhaps your right

• Foul Feast: Already gave my reasoning why I think this is not a good idea.

Yh but as long as its not OP I prefer changing it to this.

Fine, have it your way. This won't be used in GWz.

• Order of the Vampire: Order skills are fine, they are rather costy but powerful.

YH This basicly is putting OoV back into the game without having an OP rangerspike

This is a nerf. A pretty big one, too. Melee classes usually are not in nearby range unless you are running a meleemancer.

• Blood Bond: Why? Irremovable buffs are bad for the game. (Note: Can be used by two Necromancers that use this on each other, making it party-wide free regeneration which is bad.)

Remember they suffer degeneration for EACH guy they cast it on ? Your plan wouldnt work and it would be renundant to take 2 necros for that anyway.

If Blood Magic is going to be good, it absolutely is worth it taking two necromancers. One necromancer buffs 4 party members and the other one does so as well. That is a total of -12 health degeneration. 12-6=6, so you have two characters with -6 health degeneration against a whole party of +6. I would say that is totally worth it, as it is irremovable.

• Blood Renewal: Yeah, pretty nice.

=)

• Life Siphon: Really, the 2 second casting time is the only thing that keeps this from being overpowered.

I like pressure alot.Perhaps your right the thing is right now it isnt being used.On the other hand that might be because of the whole line.

With one cast time, it might be abused with Blood Bond the way I stated above.

• Cacophony: Too costy when being like this, too unconditional with less cost. I would say give it a condition but also make it more practical.

Mmmm Got any suggestions for me ?

Interrupt, if interrupted daze?

• Ulcerous Lungs: Possible.
• Vocal Minority: Omnomnom? Why would people use this over Signet of Humility?

No Idea.Perhaps because your not running a mesmer ?

Trudat, but I think it's not worth the cast as you make it.

• Cultist's Fervor: Quite a nice idea, has a lot of potential.

yh :)

• Vampiric Gaze: Yeah, I was thinking alongside those lines.
• Ravenous Gaze: Possible.
• Angorodon's Gaze: Again, possible.
• Oppressive Gaze: Luks prewtty strong.
• Barbed Signet: I'm having a discussion with Oni at the moment about this possibility because, at the moment, no caster skill is able to do a thing such as this (unless you call Deadly Arts caster).
• Blood is Power: 1/2 cast time is :/. Also, this is a very powerful skill. Buffing it may be dangerous.

Remember that it already isnt a super attractive to invest a ELITE SLOT into energy management perhaps a small nerf might be usefull

Just keep it as it is. It's fine. Dark Morphon(contribs) 08:57, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Blood of the Agressor: Again, possible.
• Dark Pact: Interesting idea. Perhaps a bit too powerful.

^what you said Lilondra *panda* 17:50, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

Decided to Nerf Reaper's mark using the duration to start with.It basicly is free pressure so you shouldnt be able to keep it up on that many people.Added weaken knees with WoD's previous functionality given WoD a similar but more anticaster pointed effect. + some General updates.Thx to all for posting and helping me :) (yh even oni) Lilondra *panda* 08:12, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Wither

Wither is overpowerd. Do I really have to explain why? <Oniwhocan'tbearsedtosignin>83.249.112.17 22:22, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

Changed it around a bit.Reduced recharge but because of cast time you wont be able to spam it (dshot says hai) Lilondra *panda* 06:30, 15 March 2009 (UTC) ........................................................Now it's like 100x stronger. Mesmer, anyone?Oni 08:50, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Continuation of full opinion

• Signet of Agony: Sacrifice half of your health bar to cure all foes of any condition they had, grief much?
• Wallow's Bite: Still discussing this with Oni
• Touch of Agony: -11 health degeneration with downside -4 degeneration may be too strong.

perhaps Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Vampiric Touch: So does it still give you health?

No,Might change again this is mainly because it was only used on touchers Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Make it a touch spell so that it has synergiez with already existing skills. To be honest, removing health gain makes this skill vewy weak.

• Unholy Feast: Exactly what is the "feast" with this skill?
• Well of Blood: Why nerf this skill? It's fine.
• Awaken the Blood: To be honest I don't really get this move faster less armor thing, but it's fine I spose.
• Soul Leech: Life Transfer gone imba?

Life transfer still is UP imo,Dont know if its OP though Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

It is. -2 energy degen which you gain as regen? That would even be imba when there was no health regen/degen and when it would only hex one target.

I nerfed it yesterday,It only affects one target Lilondra *panda* 11:34, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Doesn't put it out of the imba list. Dark Morphon(contribs) 14:36, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Virulence: This skill is already fine, doesn't really need changing.

Nobody is using it and thats mainly because of the recharge Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

It's mainly because those other skills are imba.

Its also inferior to non-imba skills.Lilondra *panda* 11:31, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

It's very useful in splits, putting -8 degen from no-where on your target is win. Dark Morphon(contribs) 14:41, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Yh on splits its mostly combined with fragility and other fragish things thing is does it have a use besides that ? Arent there much better ways to split available ? Lilondra *panda* 14:45, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Envenom Enchantments: Fine with me.
• Verata's Sacrifice: Personally, I don't think damage was that much of a problem with minions anyway, combining it with Death Nova is the real issue.

I think hat lots of minions + barbs or any similar buff is zomgWTFROFLLLOLOLOL LOOK AT THAT

So how does this change that?

The damage they deal themself gets reduced to like 0.Basicly usefull in PvE as they become a meatshield Lilondra *panda* 11:23, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Aura of the Lich: Inferior to Cultist's Fervor?

Death magic version will give it another touch.Remember this increased the cap of minions incredibly (half saccrifice of BOTM)

Trudat.

• Minion Spells: Whatever. I really don't care what you do with them.
• Bitter Chill: Non-elite ver of Toxic Chill? Meh, I'd rather see something more original.

The Idea is to balance not to be original :p

Then your balance page is obsolete because you are actually introducing more problems than fixes.

It isnt finished either Lilondra *panda* 11:23, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Death Nova: Keep as is imo. It takes some time to use it that way. Like it is as you suggest, people will abuse it for minion armies.
• Vile Miasma: This skill seems balanced to me, not really a need to change it. But as yours doesn't make it imbalanced, go on ahead.
• Taste of Pain: Sure.
• Fetid Ground: Can't it just inflict poison every second? Much easier.

Perhaps thats better yh

• Deathly Swarm: Meh. Keep as is.

• Faintheartedness: As I already stated, overpowered when viable and too weak when not. Therefore, broken functionality. Avoid this.

/agree final attempt did not work out Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Lingering Curse: Whoa whoa wait, the high cost was the only thing that kept the pre-buff ver from being overpowered. So really, think up a different functionality.

/agree again Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Parasitic Bond: With seven recharge it's still possible to use this skill as a cover hex.

Remember I intend on making most hexes a Lot LESS powerfull if they do stick up.My Idea is not to give hexes pressure single alone (with some exeptions that dont function well with covers) but to make the stacking of them that adds to the pressure.So Alone they arent that much of the big deal but when one starts stacking them all those little bits of pressure add up Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

And how do you intend to do that?

• Wither: Wat? 3 recharge is way too low, it's begging for abuse on mesmers like this.

changed this already.TBH primary attributes should just only affect skills of that class it would do away with a lot of gimmicksLilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Rend Enchantments: So the only thing that changes is the energy cost? Honestly, this skill needs more change than this to be not imba.

2 sec cast already is a big nerf,Cast time and damage Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

It already has 2 cast time due to last update. But really, enchantment removal should be limited to 3 at a time max. Dark Morphon(contribs) 11:12, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

It does but People dont run more then 3 enchants most of the time anyway . Lilondra *panda* 11:23, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Defile Defenses: Can still function as a power cover hex.

It can but I already explained why I dont think cover hexes will be as much of a problem with my balance Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

That's how Hexes work at the moment and that's why they are a problem tbh. Dark Morphon(contribs) 11:14, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Exept Faint kills your damage,So does blurred.VoR Fucking kills you in general.There are a lot of hexes that dont just pressure but make you worthless for a while and when those get covered problems start.Also I buffed hex removal Lilondra *panda* 11:23, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Weaken Knees: I kinda suggested this didn't I? Point is, Necromancers don't have any snares at all, so it's really hard to say whether giving them that ability is wise.

I think it should.Snares make a class versatile.If 1 class is a lot better at it thats normal and fine but it makes a class versatile and I think snares if not driven to the imba promote good play Lilondra *panda* 11:01, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

• Pain of Disenchantment: So basically you gave 1 more enchantment removed and replaced the damage with conditions. I don't know, really. I think giving this a 2 cast time would fix it already.
• Soul Bind: That's a really awkward way of nerfing this skill. I think there should be a more elegant solution.

Wellz, that's it. Dark Morphon(contribs) 10:23, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Morphy,Make a list of all skills that are imba on this page plz ;) Also I think I fixed Soul Leach now Lilondra *panda* 14:38, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

update

FOR REALZ Lilondra *panda* 18:46, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Exactly what got updated? Vampiric Spirit is still a skill, so is Blood Bond (they have lolsynergy like this). And that's just one point on many overpowered skills on here. Dark Morphon(contribs) 10:50, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Your the necro guy so tell me :) Lilondra *panda* 15:28, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Read your archive hmmkthx. I'm not going to point all out again. Dark Morphon(contribs) 16:16, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

You mentioned 3 skills that are still broken in this update (or might be). Lilondra *panda* 18:13, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Oh ffs

Dear god, you buffed wither even further. This is the third time you screwed the same skill up. It's a passive low recharge easy as hell to upkeep bs fire and forget skill. This isn't trolling. This is a negative comment. You might try to remove this comment and say NOT CONSTRUVTIVE so I'll say this: Skills arent supposed to be passive or fire/forget.

To quote morphy:

If his "balance" was fixed totally it wouldn't change anything to the game at best

He isn't good at seeing problems

He's even worse at creating solutions

This is exactly the same problem izzy had ;/Oni 16:28, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

I'm not removing the comment simply because you didnt troll or anything.I removed the other ones because you used caps when you had absolutely no reason to and couldnt talk on a decent way NOT because of what you in essence where trying to say ;) Lilondra *panda* 18:04, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

btw, The problem izzy had is that he ignored everybody I do not ignore everybody ;) Lilondra *panda* 18:06, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Izzy doesn't listen to GWW, who cares. 99.99% of the people can't balance anyway. I'd rather have them not listen to the fags here and do good balance than them implementing every single random crappy suggestion they find on this site. Honestly, be happy they don't listen to the players here. On his balance, read what Oni said. Dark Morphon(contribs) 18:44, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Wether they can balance or not doesnt matter really.IF 100 people say a skill is OP its clear you have to nerf it (if auron,ensign or hell even shard is one of them).The thing is izzy should just check suggestion for IDEAS not for actual balance.Ow and 100 % of the wiki cant balance.Lilondra *panda* 18:46, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Yeah and single skill changes truly are going to help. Honestly, even if those single skill changes would be of more quality than my trash can of horrible skill suggestions, they wouldn't fix the game. I'm done with commenting here. I think I made it clear why I think your skill balance is bad and this isn't leading anywhere anyway. Dark Morphon(contribs) 18:57, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Exactly! So you see; Izzy couldn't understand that the solution to the prob was to listen to people. Your problem is the same thing.

Listen to this: this balance page is laughable.Oni 18:50, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

So is your face Nah JK.Single skill changes can help btw remove the 15 most imba skills in GW and the game is a lot more healthy Lilondra *panda* 19:01, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

So what skills are the 15 most imba skills in the game? Dark Morphon(contribs) 19:04, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

WoH just because there is no skill which can be seen as an equivolant. Fox007 19:17, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

CBA to look at all skills.Skills that instantly come to my mind are WS,VoR,Lingering curse and WE Lilondra *panda* 19:19, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

And you balanced none of them. You tweaked it so its not overpowerd, but you didnt balance.

Learn the diffrence between balancing and tweaking, seriously. This page is just a long way of saying nerf op skills Not my balance list

got it?

gosh.

I'm done with you.Oni 19:30, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

I agree with Oni, when trying to balance you should look outside of the box, trying not to tweak single skill problems but actually balance the problem these skills have. WS, what's the problem with this skill? Covered DW on a SCYTHE. And that's exactly it. The only reason that skill is overpowered and broken is really that the whole mechanic is broken. If we nerf WS, AoM dervishes with Wearying Strike will be back in the game. If you nerf these, another problem will arise. It's simple as this. Your "balance" doesn't take anything of this in consideration. So why would your page be any better than Izzy's? Point is, YOURS ISN'T BETTER. Yours just reflects your random opinion, poorly. In conclusion, if you honestly want to have a good page, start looking why skills are a problem instead of just tweaking them. Until that happens, this will just be another random opinion. I can point out why a skill change itself is bad by giving an example (I've done that a couple of times), and so can I do with a whole "balance". Dark Morphon(contribs) 09:35, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

What exactly are you trying to accomplish besides getting on my nerves oni ? And ofcourse you do DM Your his mimic bird.Anyway thx for the tips.Lilondra *panda* 16:55, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

As a troll I feed on drama. Also, you suck at avoiding the issue you fucking izzy duplicate. You went over to insulting dm instead of actually answering what we said?Oni 14:37, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Didnt I make myself clear ? If your here to troll go seek your lack of attention elsewhere Lilondra *panda* 16:54, 19 March 2009 (UTC)