Help talk:Ask an account question/Archive 1

So, they finally made this section eh?--Raph 00:11, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Aye, you can see the whole discussion at HELP:GAME's talk. Calor — talk 01:54, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

lol, why the hell didn't i notice there was a third help page? XD - Y0_ich_halt 16:14, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Lol weren't you part of the discussion which decided to make one? -- Brains12 \ Talk 16:15, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

i remember that, but i never saw this page XD - Y0_ich_halt 16:19, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Wow, real empty talk page. — ク Eloc 貢 22:39, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Is access to 2 accounts of the same game illegal??

← moved to Help:Ask an account question 21:13, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Support

if we had a mostlinked for external links, support would be #1 - Y0_ich_halt 16:27, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Naw, I'd beat it. — ク Eloc 貢 01:07, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

"externals". Sadly, Eloc, you are a part of the wiki and aren't "external". Calor 01:09, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

Ya, the wiki has me hostage. I was saying if I could not be a part of the wiki, I'd beat Y0's externals challenge. — ク Eloc 貢 15:30, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

... - Y0_ich_halt 14:27, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

i XD irl every time a see a post title in big leeters with "PLZ HELP!!!" in it--Raph Talky 18:14, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Useful?

Looking at the page right now, we have one legit question, one question moved....and every single other question is tagged noarchive, either because its in the FAQ, been asked before, or all of the above. Therefore I ask, is this page really worth it? If we simply redirected this to the FAQ, would we get better results? Or is keeping the page and answering questions that are already in the FAQ (which nobody seems to read) still the best bet for this page? Right now the page seems pretty useless from my point of view.....any thoughts? -- Wandering Traveler 01:29, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

At least they're not cluttering up Help:Ask a game question. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 08:34, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

.....Au contraire. Even so, the clutter here is insane; there has to be something that can be done to lessen the load of repetitive questions. -- Wandering Traveler 04:52, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

But because this page exists, the questions posted over there can be moved here rather than sitting at Help:Ask a game question for half a month with the noarchive tag. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 06:35, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

I think I'm the one who has been doing the most noarchive tagging, and, well, I don't really mind doing it. Yea, there is an insane amount of clutter, but it takes like 5 minutes of my time every one, two or three days. I think this page still is useful, as long as there occasionally are questions that make sense.
One thing we might consider is making this page "harder" to reach. By that I mean, would it perhaps be useful to link to this page only from the FAQ, instead of linking to it, like, everywhere, like it's now? That way people might actually read the FAQ before posting here. Might just be a silly idea of mine though. For the moment I'm happy with the way it is, and I don't mind keeping a little maintenance here like I do. — Why 22:58, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

harder to reach is bad. That means that we get those questions somewhere else.. poke | talk 23:04, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Hm, that's true. But what about we direct all questions to the FAQ, and then have a box there which sais "Is your question not in the FAQ? Head over to X for questions about Y" and such? I guess your argument would still be valid. Nevermind. — Why 23:12, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Its difficult to say; I want to see a way where the FAQ is shown first, then at the bottom have something like "Didnt find your question? Go here" kind of thing. It would kinda sorta maybe force people to read the FAQ, though I don't know if one would just skip all the way down.... -- Wandering Traveler 23:47, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Help:Contents links to Guild Wars Wiki:FAQ before it links to any of the question pages. Perhaps subpages could be split off from Guild Wars Wiki:FAQ, and those subpages could be transcluded to both Guild Wars Wiki:FAQ and the appropriate help pages (for example Guild Wars Wiki:FAQ/Account could be transcluded to Help:Ask an account question). -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 01:02, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Since it was me that pushed for and created this page, I just want to say I think we should keep it. We always knew there was going to be lots of repetition, hence why we've got {{noarchive}}. I've also made some effort to get people to read the FAQ first, by chainging the order on Help:Contents, and also on the main page. The Help Navbar still allows people to click on "ask a (it says wiki but I don't know what that means) question" link without reading any FAQ, but in general I think we have the right balance right now. As everyone else said, if we remove the page, people will just ask the questions elsewhere. And it's not doing any harm here. :-) Biscuits 07:39, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Yea, I don't support removing it at all. It keeps me busy, gives me something to do here. :P — Why 14:16, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

Contacting support

Should the FAQ address more completely contacting support? Specifically, including Gaile's suggestions/tips for info to provide? Not sure where this would go. --Freedom Bound 21:58, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Some of the support links in the Game account section of the FAQ can be changed to link to Gaile's Support FAQ instead of www.guildwars.com/support/, since Gaile's Support FAQ page also includes a link to www.guildwars.com/support/ and has details on what information to provide. --Silver Edge 22:18, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

I'd be hesitant to change only some of the links, since some of the people looking for answers won't know to look at the links to know that they're different, or won't pay attention to answers to questions that they don't think apply. I was thinking more along the lines of changing all of the links to point to an internal summary of Gaile's tips, preferably not on her page, to keep it within the help namespace. --Freedom Bound 22:32, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Help bought guild wars dont know what to do.

← moved to Help:Ask an account question

Useful? No.

Sort of a renewal of the older topic by the same name, this page serves no purpose. We are not NCsoft support, and the best answer we can give anyone who has an actual account question is "contact support." All other questions are answered by the FAQ.

That's stupid. All we do is delete email revisions from this page because people mistake it for actual support. I propose we simply lock this page with the FAQ listed, and have a huge header saying CONTACT FUCKING SUPPORT. It's the same effect with none of the autism and revision deleting. I'm not joking either, this page is retardedly pointless. -Auron 00:06, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

This current edition? yah, 2 of 8 cannot be answered by the FAQ. However, check out the last Archive: of 16 questions, I found 7 that couldn't be answered by the FAQ. So, is 9/24 useless? (There are a few questions in the previous archive that probably could be answered via FAQ; it just didn't have the info.)

On the other hand, some people feel better if they get some sort of immediate response (even if from volunteers). Maybe it's worth indulging them.

 — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 00:26, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

The ones that cannot be answered by the FAQ are the ones that don't belong here to begin with. The last one about the command line isn't an account question at all. My point still stands - this page is useless. -Auron 00:30, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

"The ones that cannot be answered by the FAQ are the ones that don't belong here to begin with." I kinda agree. — Why 00:36, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Ok, take away the ones that don't belong. I still count 6 in the previous archive that belong and aren't currently answered in the FAQ. Also: I'm willing to indulge ppl who want a faster response then they get from ANet (and, when I'm not, I'm happy to ignore this page in RC/WL). If we go 8-10 weeks with less than 1/10 questions both relevant and not answered in FAQ or through Support, I'll <ahem> support your suggestion.  — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 00:39, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

(Edit conflict) At first i was here to defend to keep this page as it is.

But then i realized Auron has a very good point. Giving the FAQ right at them might solve faster the problems they have. I think most of the people don't even bother to check the FAQ in our current Help form. No word how fast you get the solution from Support...

If we're going with this option, then FAQ needs some improvements in my opinion. It has to be pretty damn accurate if we're gonna rely on it. - J.P.Talk 00:53, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Auron, your apathy is showing. I'm sorry if having to do the occasional revision hide is too taxing for you.... Other than seeing this in the RC, I don't see how this particular page affects you in any way, you don't answer questions, you don't archive it, you really have nothing to do with it, so why the big push to do away with it? It's obvious that it does serve a purpose just by the volume of posts that are placed here, no matter how faulty it may be. I do agree that it's unfortunate that people don't take even 2 seconds to read the top header, or to see if their questions are already answered, but nothing you are going to do is really going to change that. I disagree with your suggestion of locking the page. -- Wyn talk 00:55, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Why have 15 people say "contact support" over and over again when the FAQ will answer their questions and tell them this in the first place? Auron's right; the few valid questions usually belong in either HELP:GAME or HELP:WIKI, and the rest are answered by the faq. You said it yourself, Wyn: if people don't take the two seconds to read the FAQ, why not close the page and make it the only thing they can read? Force them to that, and stuff might actually happen. -- Wandering Traveler 02:08, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

I'm in agreement with Auron. It's rare (like, black-people-turning-white rare) for someone to ask a question that isn't in the FAQ, is related to their account, and doesn't contain their email address. Most of the answers, as Auron has said, are "Contact support." ~Shard 02:11, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Because people want a personal answer, they don't read the FAQ (which should be obvious given the number of posts that end up here that are answered on the FAQ). -- Wyn talk 02:34, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Nice fallacious argument, Wyn. It is unfortunate that people don't read the faq to begin with, but them being stupid doesn't make this page less pointless. The people who care to contribute are still parroting the same line over and over, with the rare exception of answering a question that they can actually help with, 100% of which are completely unrelated to game accounts. -Auron 02:52, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

I don't think that locking the page would result in no questions being asked, similar to the feedback space, this page, and the other help pages, probably do a great deal to consolidate the questions. If they were locked, the questions would just migrate to other pages, you can see examples on pages like inscription. The FAQ could be updated, though I'm not particularly sure that would help. I do have to admit that I've often wondered why the page is maintained, since so many of the answers do seem to be "contact support". -- FreedomBound 11:00, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

I'm sorry you find me wanting to provide a service to the community that IS, rather the one you wish it were fallacious. I prefer to deal in facts rather than fantasy. You lock this page and you will just see these questions popping up in other more inappropriate places as Freedom pointed out. It's not going to stop the community from being what it is. -- Wyn talk 11:07, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

I'm inclined to doubt that. Behaviour which ceases to be actively encouraged could be less common as a result, y'know?

If people have somewhere to post their e-mail address and ask a question, they will. If not, they're more likely to actually bother with the FAQ. Which, imo, this page should redirect to. A F K When Needed 11:41, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Do people still post on Izzy's page 100 times a day to complain about skill balance? No. Same thing will happen here. There will be a transition period, but the posts of "here's my email help me get unbanned plz" will go way down. -Auron 23:33, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

(Reset indent) This page does seem rather a waste of user resources and redundant for the majority of questions asked. From what I've seen, those that ask the questions do not even read the giant, green notice at the top of the page or the really obvious red floating box. Because of that, most replies are either one or a combination of a) Don't post your email address <email removed> b) Contact support c) Read the FAQ. This section gives false hope to those that use it because they think we can actually help with their account problems. If a transitional phase is used, I would suggest archiving all threads, rewording the notice at the top of the page, and locking the page. Eventually leading to the removal of this Help section all together, or at least rewording the title from Ask an account question to something along the lines of Account FAQ. — Gares 14:32, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

The numbers of posters here are small. There's about 15-20 questions every 3 months, based on the last 2-3 archives.

• How many of those have to be legitimate questions to make it worth keeping?
• Some of the questions are in the wrong place — so what? Not everyone is familiar with how a wiki works and not everyone cares about the distinction between game and account questions.
• There are plenty of people happy to answer the questions so that those who think this page useless need not visit it.

OTOH, there's something to be said for making people have to click past the FAQ before posting an account question. Can we do something similar to what we have for the Feedback? Before anyone can add a new suggestion, they have to at least scroll past the intro.  — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 16:59, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

1. More than half.

2. Yes, and locking the page will prevent the off-topic questions from being asked here. If the users are only allowed to post on help:game and help:wiki, their chances of getting it on the right page will go up dramatically, even if only by mistake.

3. That is not an argument and you know it.

There is no way to force users to read stuff. Having them scroll past text is a joke in this day of high-res monitors - it takes a second or two at most. Putting big green boxes or floating red boxes doesn't work. The only way to get them to understand what to do is to lock the page, so when they go to post their mindless question without reading anything, the page tells them "whoops, you're dumb, you need to read ____ before posting this question!"

We can't count on conditioning over time (like we did for the admin noticeboard - giving increasingly strict warnings to anyone conversing on it until they finally realize the red box isn't joking) because these are mostly new users. Putting a misleading page title up and pretending we can do jack shit about their problem is what's leading to this mess in the first place. If you want to answer their questions, make sure their questions land in the right place first.

People are dumb. Even though this page specifically says we are not ANet support, they will assume it is simply because of the name. All the questions we can answer already have pages created for them, and the rest of the questions are answered by the FAQ. Our goal should be to get the right questions on the right pages instead of answering them on the wrong ones, and no amount of "we are not ArenaNet" is going to stop people from posting their email addresses. -Auron 17:21, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

I'm ambivalent about this page. I feel that if even 1-2 people are helped each month, it's enough to make an article worthwhile. So, I don't necessarily agree with all of the reasons put forth for locking the page (nor, perhaps, with how they are phrased).

On the other hand, if the goal is to get people help quickly, we know we aren't succeeding for a larger handful of others (who should be going to support first) — perhaps another solution would help more people mo' bettah. Redirecting to the FAQ is merely the easiest-to-implement of those other possibilities. For any other solution to be worth the extra effort, it would have to be impressively effective.

Locking the page doesn't feel as friendly, but it seems likely to be more effective.  — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 18:07, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

I feel that people will ask questions no matter what. If we lock or delete this page, all account related questions will migrate to the game section since people think... account... game account... game question. I agree with the notion that many people who post here are misinformed (or dumb {idiots who haven't mastered google[should just be humanely euthanized for the good of the society]}) j/k and posting here gives them false hope. Game questions for the most part can be answered by the forums like guru forums or even google, so I don't think we even need the game question section either.

I don't think we should even be answering account questions here tbh. Most of the time the person have to contact GW support anyway so just having a FAQ specific for account related stuff is fine for here. Even for questions that can't be answered by the FAQ is better answered by Anet support since at best we are guessing on a solution because we are not Anet and can't access their account info to give a better support response.--Lania21:31, 21 Jul 2010 (UTC)

Is this page benefiting players?

A while back, someone asked whether this page was useful. The claim was that we are not NCsoft and the best answer we have is "read the FAQ" or contact support. At the time, I disagreed, thinking that enough people used the page to get help they couldn't find elsewhere. I have changed my mind based on recent usage:

Out of 33 questions recently answered, only 5 can really be said to be relatively unique (and even those, support would be the better place to address them). 5 others probably should have been asked elsewhere (including one that was moved). Worse, many of the questions are identical to the one that came just before (or two before).

Metrics (based on posts up until Wynthyst's archival edit)

1. Questions that could (should?) be asked on another page: 5
2. Questions that are answered in the FAQ: 17
3. Questions that are account-related and require help from support: 6
4. Questions that are account-related and could use our help: 5

For convenience, here's how I counted (by header title):

Type 1 (other page): hello; code 027; GW campaigns; ONE character not loading; GW to GW2; characters change appearance; I need to re-download;

Type 2 (FAQ): Code =227; where are my characters; i forgot my characters name; Forgot pass-Account-security question; can't log in; forgot my players name; game account; forgot my guild wars account name; character name; forgot character name; don't remember charicter name; forgot account info; cod 277; error code 227; forgot account info; email address no longer valid; access key; account question; not getting help from support; forgot my character name

Type 3 (support): i cant create an account; Account name; HELP; banned account; activation code; lost my CD-keys

Type 4 (GWW): Server Change; Aion wings; Resetting account; problems with husband's account; second account confusion;

So, I would like to re-ask the question: does this page really help players and readers to get the assistance they need?  — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 19:17, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

I would say that it doesn't provide the help that players actually need and give them a false sense of hope. I've also said something similar in the section above too. --Lania 20:48, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

My main concern is, as Gares and Lania pointed out, giving people false hope. On the other hand, we are giving them some hope, and for a person in a panic over what happened to their account, that can be a good thing. Is it tiresome and defeating to see the same questions posed right after each other, and in the FAQ? Yes. Does it disgruntle me, yes. But do not forget the cathartic response that we supply when we respond to those looking for someone/anyone to help them. A few words, and a push in the right direction, helps.

Now, I do wish there was some way to force people to be directed to the FAQ before they can edit this section, but I'm guessing that is both difficult to do, and would only make responders tire of the extra steps. Somehow, this page needs to be reworked in a way where relevant information is getting to the people who need it. Then again, to stop myself mid-thought, we have no way of knowing how many people are getting the information they need and do not post....

Should we block this page? Looking ahead, I say no. People who are unwilling to read the FAQ are very likely the same people who will access another page and ask the same question. If there's going to be idiocy, I'd rather it be in one spot than spammed over the wiki. So for that reason, and the fact that a small percent do receive the help for which this page is intended, I say we keep it, but find some way to rework it. G R E E N E R 21:52, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

How about something like this?... Whenever someone clicks on account question, instead of it going directly to the account help page, have it go to the game account FAQ section. Then if the person that needs help doesn't see the question they want to ask, have another link there that's something like "If you don't see the question that you are looking for, click here to ask a new question.". then that directs the person to the actual account help section. --Lania 22:18, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

Makes sense to me. G R E E N E R 22:31, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

Simple, easy, straightforward, and functional. Brilliant. — Raine Valen 2:18, 18 Sep 2010 (UTC)

Okay, who wants to implement this? Maybe we should get some more opinions before doing so. I'm going to request more comments. --Lania 21:20, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

It's above and beyond my limited knowledge, that's for sure. But yes, more opinions/suggestions are always good. G R E E N E R 05:35, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

I stand by all statements I've made and others have made in sections above and beyond. -- Wandering Traveler 15:45, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

So are you still thinking about this, or did you find that it wasn't needed? Seems rather dead to me. Backsword 01:25, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

To whom is your question directed, Backsword? The metrics haven't changed that much: most questions are misplaced or answered in the FAQ. The consensus here seems to be that the page isn't as useful as it was meant to be, but there's no agreement for any particular resolution.  — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 02:00, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

To whomever it may concern. Backsword 02:14, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

Redirect it to the FAQ; put a link at the bottom of the FAQ that sends people here if you "Don't see your answer? Ask a new question here!" or some such. — Raine Valen 2:58, 5 Nov 2010 (UTC)

Yea, that works. I seem to remember bitching about this page months ago. -Auron 03:10, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

I made the changes to 3 different pages 1,2, and 3. Thoughts? --Lania 19:14, 09 November 2010 (UTC)

So far I see the addition to the help section, which is great. Now, should we have some of the links in the Template:Help navbar header lead to the FAQ first, or is that a bit overboard? Perhaps just the Help:Account link? G R E E N E R 19:28, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

I went ahead and changed it too, if anyone thinks it's too much then go ahead and change or revert it. --Lania 19:37, 09 November 2010 (UTC)

I like what you did. Thank you.

The first line of defense for people should be a link to support and to the FAQ. It should be harder to appeal to Gaile or to this page, since those should used only if folks can't get they help they (think they) need from the primary sources. We might want to change the links from Gaile's feedback space, too, e.g. to something that is specific about support (in theory, Gaile could change jobs, but the support info will always be useful).  — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 19:40, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

I gave the mods so far a trial run from a few different perspectives. For those looking for commonly asked questions, it's great. The only slight downfall is for those who have asked a question on the Help:Account page. For them, checking for a response is now slightly more difficult, but nothing that can be done by retracing their original steps to post. In other words, I like it. G R E E N E R 19:44, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

I really hope this [1] doesn't become more common... LOL --Lania 20:45, 09 November 2010 (UTC)

Only time will tell. I wish there was some way we could take a formal poll of people, asking them how they got to the page, whether or not they read or skimmed the header, etc. I especially wish to enumerate those who visit the page, find what they want, and have no need to post additional questions. G R E E N E R 23:24, 9 November 2010 (UTC)