Talk:Ebonhawke

VIP, very important page

I don't think we should delete this page as it will become more important with the upcomming update and because of it's importance in GW2 [1]. Instead I suggest putting some love into this page Mal 09:20, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm still skeptical of the "sources" that Santax has for it. Also, just because it is important in GW2 doesn't mean we should have it here, we don't have a Logan Thackeray page after all. It only belongs here if it has events in GW1. And with a mistake like calling Gwen an Elementalist... I say remove until we know for sure it will be in GW1, then re add (which won't be much work). -- Konig/talk 09:44, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

An official press release, unedited. Doesn't call Gwen an Elementalist there. Obviously it was a mistake that was corrected before other sites picked up the story. If we use our shiny new references tool, people can make up their own minds, can't they? --Santax (talk · contribs) 10:41, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Removal of the deletion tag?

Ummm... I was under the impression that removal of a deletion tag was to be done by consensus, not just because one user feels like it. I believe there is still enough doubt as to the validity of this information that futher discussion of the deletion is required (three days of discussion is I believe what is called for). I am therefore, replacing the deletion tag. -- Wyn talk 11:51, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

The reason given for the deletion tag being there before was "Not enough information to warrant a page. has been deleted multiple times previously". It had been deleted multiple times previously because it had at that point been thought to be exclusively GW2 content (which we now know to be false), and in the edit where I removed the deletion tag, I also added enough information for the topic to warrant a page. --Santax (talk · contribs) 12:34, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm finding it difficult to properly interpret that press release. If Ebonhawke will indeed show up in the game somewhere in the future I suppose there's no harm in keeping this page. But the press release only says Gwen and Lt. Whatshisface are destined to marry. We might never witness such an event and even if we do there's no guarantee we'll get to see Ebonhawke, or it even being mentioned in dialogue. I think should the need to link to Ebonhawke arise in such a situation the GW2W page will do just fine. As it stands Ebonhawke is only relevant to GW2. — Why 12:40, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Why would we never witness it? It happens within our characters lifetime, and it's definitely within the scope of Beyond. Not to mention the fact that we've virtually spent the last few weeks watching Gwen and Keiran's romance unfold. --Santax (talk · contribs) 13:07, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

I still stand by my original deletion reason. there is one line of text on this page with some templates, and a single relatively vague reference. I don't believe this is enough information to warrant an article, and would prefer it if we wait until there is more. I'm more disturbed that you felt it was perfectly ok to simply remove the deletion tag without discussion. -- Wyn talk 18:31, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

"Why would we never witness it?"Because Ebonhawke is off of the map and the live team doesn't have enough resources to make new area maps - its why they never made the new god realms. And despite my better judgment, it isn't "too short," there are shorter pages. The real reason for deletion is unconfirmed and GW2 related. Until we have confirmation that the articles Santax uses as references are accurate, which I see no reason at all why Linsey would spoil things (especially since it isn't so clear cut Thackeray and Gwen will get together, considering the last dialogue we saw) and the only confirmed Anet source regarding GW:B and Thackeray has Linsey saying that we'll see the makings of Logan from GW2 (she never said that Gwen will be his ancestor), I just find it unlikely. If Linsey wouldn't even tell the TK about the War in Kryta, she would never release such information out. Because, as I said, it isn't clear cut Keiran will be with Gwen anymore. -- Konig/talk 20:13, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

The press release never gives a time frame for the establishment of Ebonhawke, nor for the eventual marriage of Gwen and Thackeray. All it does say is that they will establish Ebonhawke and that they will get married. Until such events happen in the game, I suggest that this page be deleted. --Riddle 20:33, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Konig: Creating an outpost is a little different to creating a god realm, and you know it. A press release is confirmation - and just because you don't want to believe that it's a press release, doesn't change the fact that it says "PRESS RELEASE" in big letters at the top of the page. And you also know full well that Gwen and Thackeray will eventually get together, Linsey mentions in an interview which you have accepted as real that Logan Thackeray and Keiran Thackeray have some sort of a connection. Hmm, I wonder what that could be. And (a) I didn't realise you could read Linsey's mind and (b) you seem to assume that Linsey writes ANet's press releases. --Santax (talk · contribs) 22:24, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Riddle: If it happens within our character's lifetime, is hugely relevant to GW2 and is only ever mentioned in the context of GW:B, it is safe to say that even if it doesn't happen at the end of the War in Kryta, it will definitely happen in GW:B. --Santax (talk · contribs) 22:24, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Creating an outpost is different, but creating an outpost in the middle of an area which doesn't have an explorable for a long distance is not. No matter how it is done, it will be needing a new area. The very minimal would be to have a Hall of Judgement size area in a cinematic. -- Konig/talk 22:33, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Edit: Oh, and please show me where linsey says Logan is connected to Gwen. Keiran - yes, I agree. Gwen? Not proven yet. And I can't read Linsey's mind, I can however take what I know of her, especially how she is to new content which is more secretive than the Order of Whispers in Istan, and deduce that she wouldn't give such a huge spoiler like Gwen finally being with Keiran and more importantly that Gwen and Keiran establish Ebonhawke. -- Konig/talk 22:36, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

I say delete the page. Anet has a habit of putting their press release on their site, which has not been done with the release being cited. Since it's validity has already been questioned, along with the fact that the devs are usually notoriously tight lipped about upcoming spoilers, I would consider this unconfirmed rumors. If Linsey comes out and says this info is valid, or Anet puts this release on their site, then it's no trouble to ping a sysop to undelete the page.-- Pyron Sy 22:41, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Pyron: See here. NCSoft placed the press release on their website, unfortunately it can no longer be viewed (if it ever could be), but the opening paragraph is still on their front page, for now. See for yourself. --Santax (talk · contribs) 22:44, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Santax, you're reading into this too deeply. There is no established timeline for the Keiran-Gwen relationship story, nor is there any mention of our heroes involvement in their relationship in the press release. The most the press release says is that "Gwen and Lt. Thackeray are destined to marry and establish the human city of Ebonhawke". Unlike the War in Kryta, which our heroes can visibly see going down now, the most we get of the Keiran-Gwen situation is a failed picnic. You can't argue that it happens in our character's lifetime. That's like me arguing that our characters die in year 1100 and Gwen and Keiran get married and establish Ebonhawke in year 1105: There is no source from which I—and subsequently you— can base that argument.

Until Ebonhawke becomes relevant to GW1, there is no need for this page. So far, Ebonhawke has no relevance in GW1, thus we can just link to the GW2W version. --Riddle 23:42, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

(Reset indent) Keep. There's no need to remove. For full documentation purposes, it should be here -- even if it turns out to be a non-feature or a forward page to GW2 Wiki. --141.158.120.201 23:52, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Mr Anonymous, this is why we can make an internal link go to an external source, such as [[gw2:Ebonhawke]] → gw2:Ebonhawke. Thus, this page is superfluous. --Riddle 23:56, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Still, even though the source might not be reliable, I suggest we atleast keep the page until after the celebrations and everything that might be added there. It may not have that much relevance in GW1 (yet) but in my opinion something that seems likely to be linked to GW1 (yes, not confirmed but still it's very likely) and has such significance in GW2 deserves a page. Mal 13:56, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

If it becomes relevant to GW1, we can simply recreate the article. It's not like there is a whole lot to the article as it stands now. --Riddle 18:02, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm curious how you got to thinking the most we'll be getting out of the Gwen/Thackeray storyline is a failed picnic? We know that we're getting more EV stuff later, since Evennia's gone to the north, and we know we're getting more Keiran stuff 'cause Linsey said in the interview "Keiran and other members of the Ebon Vanguard will play important roles in the upcoming events". The Gwen/Keiran thing is obviously meant to tie into the War in Kryta eventually, just as the whole Zinn thing seems unrelated but will eventually tie into it (see Hasrah's dialogue). And of course they'll get married within our character's lifetimes - they're both alive around the same times as our characters, their storyline is being expanded as we speak, and there's the fact that it was announced they were to marry at the same time that it was announced that new content bridging GW1 and GW2 was being released. --Santax (talk · contribs) 15:03, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

I never said that the failed picnic is the most we will be getting out of the Gwen-Keiran story. It's currently the most we get right now in the physical game. --Riddle 15:33, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

@ Santax: I bet you died at least a hundred times before they get married...--Markisbeest 12:54, 13 May 2010 (UTC)

Evennia's deal

It's about time for this to come into play, anyone else waiting until we can smash new charr foes? Eive_Windgrace 22:06, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

You're suggesting that the Shining Blade/Kryta is going to help set up Ebonhawke? That's some interesting speculation. Perhaps that's the case, since we know the foundation of Ebonhawke is an Asura gate, and Kryta is currently the best human link to them. Arshay Duskbrow 22:12, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Trivia

If the name IS a reference to anything (which I doubt), wouldn't it make more sense to be a reference to, say, something that is already in the game? 97.80.119.149 23:02, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, I highly doubt that it came from anything other than GWs. Just too similar to Ebon Falcons to not be related, in my opinion. --- NessHrin | 23:04, 25 Jul 2010 (UTC)

The place existed prior to the Ebon Vanguard, according to the book, and was simply fortified greatly by them. -- Konig/talk 00:12, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Wait, which book? Ghosts of Ascalon? That doesn't come out until the 27th if I recall, so not sure how you would get that info from it. --- NessHrin | 0:18, 26 Jul 2010 (UTC)

Barnes and Nobles released it a few days early. I got it yesterday and read it throughout the night. -- Konig/talk 00:52, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Neat. Now I have to hunt it down. Thanks for the early notice! --- NessHrin | 1:18, 26 Jul 2010 (UTC)

Explorable

Has there been any word if we'll be able to explore this as an area or outpost? T'would be nice. 161.184.88.202 23:34, 12 November 2010 (UTC)

In GW1; i dout it. (but in GW2; all areas are persistent, so its both and neither >.<) --Neil • 23:43, 12 November 2010 (UTC)

It's possible but no word. -- Konig/talk 02:31, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

I heard talk about new outposts with the GWB content, but Ebonhawke is unlikely though it would make sense. --Spigs 13:16, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

There's certain areas that should be converted to outpost, in my opinion, one of which is the Blade camp. Let's just see what GWB brings. - Lucian Shadowborn 16:46, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

Actually, due to the dialogues, the camp wouldn't work as an outpost. -- Konig/talk 18:39, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

The dialogues could be done outside of the camp, or have an inner camp (outpost) and an outer camp (right outside the outpost) where the dialogues would occur.Snowstone 22:04, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

"According to an official press release, Ebonhawke will be established by Lieutenant Thackeray and Gwen during Guild Wars Beyond."

Wouldn't that mean that when they do establish it, it can be an outpost that we can explore in GW1?! 71.194.87.164 19:05, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Doubtful. They're reusing old maps for new content because it's difficult for them to get an artist. I highly doubt they'll be able to produce an entirely new outpost that would probably only be used a couple times during Beyond.-- Pyron Sy 19:20, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

I'd say its more doubtful due to location. If I am reading the maps I have found and compared properly, Ebonhawke is SSE of our current Ascalon City outpost, and due East of Sorrow's Furnace, which would place it at least one decent sized map zone south of Regent's Valley and/or Pockmark Flats, though that hinges on accuracy of maps released before GW2 is. So we might see some scenes leading to it, but I doubt we will see a new location because of them.66.228.16.64 10:24, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

I don't know, a New Outpost sounds nice, and if you think about it, with an Asuran Gate you wouldn't need to physically attach it to current maps. Could Kinda be like Embark which isn't physically attached to anything( with exit portals), even though that was recycled from an unimplemented outpost and if they have the cash, a small outpost probably wouldn't be too hard to build and add to the game file. We'll really have to wait though to see exactly what they will do after that part of GW beyond starts rolling. 74.220.50.81 20:13, 17 March 2011 (UTC)

Date

By no way do I want to re-spark the should-this-page-be-here debate (we have a page for Khylo and that never existed in-game, or is currently undergoing a rebuild and renaming), but there really ought to be a reference for the date Ebonhawke is established, I can't find a source for that info anywhere, unless GW2W has a reference I can't find (I'll admit now I havent yet read the books, but if those are the source they really ought to be referenced as such)188.222.77.162 11:48, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

It comes from the timeline provided in the two books. The books, just like quests in the game, don't really get referenced. Konig/talk 15:04, 27 September 2011 (UTC)

Glad to know, I just wanted to make sure it hadn't emerged from the ether. 188.222.77.162 13:24, 28 September 2011 (UTC)

Map

So we want see see the ebonhawke on maps? --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.233.85.15 (talk).

When can we see ebonhawke? --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 173.48.78.226 (talk).

In Guild Wars 2. To be more serious, Beyond has been postponed until after GW2's release. And besides, from what we were told, Elona is next and ot was Linsey's plan, not Stumme, to have Ebonhawke in the game, so it may never be (besides, it is waaaay off the map of GW1 accessible areas). Konig/talk 15:21, 6 June 2012 (UTC)