Talk:Game updates/20090901

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Syncing

I'd like to know how they "fixed" it. 24.182.202.148 22:28, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

They are probably just using a different algorithm 76.188.221.120 22:35, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

taking bets on failing to fix syncing, anyone? 82.1.246.150 22:29, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

I would guess that they integrated all the different regions into one big "choosing pool," as it were. Previously, players that entered in Asian districts, or European districts, or etc, were segregated from all other regions. The trick to syncing was to enter at the same time in any Asian district, where there are very few people and sync teams courteously allow each other to enter first so everyone gets their teams. elix Omni 22:31, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

be interesting to see how this goes. ~~000.00.00.00~~ 22:33, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

People can still sync apparently.--Underwood 23:11, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Lol, good update :/ Karate Jesus 23:54, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

confirmed, syncing is still possible --Johnny Rodrigues 00:08, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Yea, I just tested it too. Got 3 of us on the first try, all 4 on the second try. Should we add a note? Karate Jesus 00:10, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Not yet. Some syncing will always be possible regardless, and we don't really know what the details of this "fix" are. I think it needs more testing by more people. -- Wyn talk 00:13, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Shouldn't we at least put something along the lines of, "Syncing in RA is still possible, to what extent is currently unknown"? Something like that maybe. It seems to be the exact same as it used to be...but maybe it just isn't working yet. Karate Jesus 00:17, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

From what we can tell, they only allowed people from different districts to join the queue. Teammate selection is still done based on the order you press enter. In short, the pool of selectable players went up, but nothing else changed. ~Shard 00:19, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

How in the world could we test that? Karate Jesus 00:20, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Use vent and people in different districts. If you can sync regardless of your district, it's probably true. Of course, confirming that's the exact change without a second RA using the old system is going to be nigh-impossible short a dev comment. -- Armond Warblade{{Bacon}} 01:39, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Also did a few tests, syncing seems to be still working, just a matter of pressing enter at the same time. 83.131.56.120 01:42, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Someone suggested this fix on Guru: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4836064&postcount=55 . Seems like it would solve the problem.

Why not randomize the team every time it loads a new map? Asuka 10:08, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

(Reset indent) It seems they've just made it a bit more difficult to sync, decreasing the number of people who'll be successful at it. To my mind syncing isn't a bug as per say but an exploit of sorts so I would hardly have said they'd fixed it anyway, but I guess it's an improvement. The previously suggested fix would also work I guess. 86.31.46.235 09:23, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

The only problem with that suggestion that I see is winning streaks would be harder that way. Its bad enough that 90% of the people there are incompetent as it is, but some people bring joke builds (for instance, the so-called "Judas Monk" mostly used to throw CM and AB - Heal Area, Kerai's Healing Circle, Aneurysm [0 domination], Drain Delusions [0 inspiration] Unyielding Aura (PvP) and a few useful skills). --Falseprophet 18:08, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

This made me lol...the things people come up with to grief when they are bored. Personally, I am less concerned with the sync than I am with the little shits who leave when the count is low so you start the next round down a man. If they fix anything they should change it so you always go in with a full team. Bad enough the majority of randomway teams suck why additionally handicap yourselves. 76.20.238.253 21:42, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Why not remake the team randomly after each round (After all random arena is random team)? This would destroy the aim of syncing. Just my 2 cents ^^ M3G 07:21, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

^ I like that idea but then they would have to do something about how Glad points scale, maybe every 3? It's hard enough in a true random team to get enough consecutive for 1 point unless you sync to avoid idiots who don't bring a rez. If you reshuffle every round it might be impossible. 76.20.238.253 14:38, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Terrible plan. They named it "random arenas" for a reason. If they had wanted to do that, they would have named it "bang your head against a brick wall with steel spikes arenas". -- Armond Warblade{{Bacon}} 15:04, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

has this update made it harder for any one else to get an competent team in RA?--Aura 17:43, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

• If anybody doesn't like the concept of RA then don't do it. Instead of trying to sync what is completely against the fixed principle of RA go to TA with your team. Don't complain about get a bad team in RA, if you ever feel compelled to complain you are definitly playing the wrong portion of the game. Hint: RA is about getting mediocre teams and having enough skill to get somewhere anyway. It's not about waiting for the perfect team. If you need the almost-perfect team to win then you deserve to lose in RA. OTOH if you feel you have to sync to win instead of just leaving non-cheating RA player alone, you may be playing the wrong game at all. If you are unable to have fun without exploiting games then even playing anything may be the wrong choice for you. Just get a life. - BTW, same applies to HB: if you don't like the idea of capping then don't go there and ask for Red to resign. etc. pp. --82.83.48.247 05:15, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

The problem is, you have to get 5 in a row in RA *before* you can even use TA. ~theirah

i was meaning i usauly enter from inter or korean districts where majority players know what builds are effective in ra n know how to resign i myself was not refering to finding it harder to sync--Aura 14:48, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

Great job, Althought you sometimes have mending noobs in team but still way better than it was before xD. I faced nomore Syncs in ra :D. You guys roxx. (by Juky) 26 September 2009 (UTC)

bug?

So does this tie with golden gates for being the longest living bug?--98.238.169.189 22:31, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Well, previously this was a "feature", it only became a bug a few months ago after they introduced the zquests :).--Fighterdoken 22:37, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

What 'bug' is this--Jarge 22:59, 1 September 2009 (UTC)?

A "bug" is an unintentional mistake made by a programmer. RA has always worked the way they wanted it to, they just improved it for fairness. The note really should say "Modified RA to make synchronized entering more difficult." ~Shard 00:07, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Reminds me of what they said when they "fixed" ghetto-hearthing in WoW. -- Armond Warblade{{Bacon}} 01:39, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

You misunderstand me, I meant which bug in golden gates was s/he referring to?--Jarge 17:07, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

lrn2wiki--Underwood 17:14, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

This is more of an exploit honestly, to bad you can't report people for it. --99.2.138.209 06:55, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Nick Failings?

First they have to cheer him up, and next they send him back to school. I wonder what will be next. :) --Lord Remedias 22:47, 1 September 2009 (UTC) (Forgot to log in)

imo they're spending too much time on nick, who the hell cares if he talks or not?! 188.26.199.121 22:40, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Well, you know, it does make it easier to know what he wants... Mini Me 12:25, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

hehe I had a mental image of Nick just pointing and grunting to what he wants Tim the Toolman style... MrPaladin talk 12:28, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

I think there are more people that care than you think, we're not all so materialistic :p 213.17.21.103 16:36, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Time of the next update.

Any guesses? If not being too serious, i would say in a week or two :D - J.P.Talk 22:36, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Heh, didnt you have enough updates for a while? You should be glad they are updating this game ever 2-3 days! Although they are mostly stupid bug fixes that should have been filtered out in the first place, but they are updates nevertheless! So according to getting the promise of one update each month, we are already satisfied for the coming 6 months! 82.176.174.199 23:02, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

It's expect the Sealed Deck and PvP love update to come out within the next month or so. ~~000.00.00.00~~ 23:07, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Actually, I think the next update will be to fix the XTH bug. That's why they removed Kun Shao; they'll fix it and put him back soon. --RoyHarmon 23:30, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

I approve of the new piecemeal update approach, fixing little things one at a time. It shows they're working on a day-to-day basis. elix Omni 23:32, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

I think the next update they will make on the skill it will be a lot after the new hencman of gvg and ha.Ciotto 01:02, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Sync Fix

→ moved from Talk:Game updates:September 2009

I'm just curious what kinds of things were done to prevent or reduce syncing...any elaboration? I think it's just the software engineer in me, wondering how ANet goes around implementing things... 98.216.204.201 23:36, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

As far as I've understood, they just gather from all districts now rather than the district you're based in. It's of course still possible to sync with extremely good timing, but it's a lot harder. 81.70.128.51 00:19, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

That makes sense to me. After all, does it matter who you play with in Random Arenas? Not really. It should be random from everyone who wants to play there at a given time. If this is true, I like it and might start playing RA more. 98.216.204.201 00:24, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Sadly, it's still very possible to sync. I've been testing it with some guys and we've gotten all 4 of us in 3/8 times. The rest of the time we got at least 3 of us. :/ Karate Jesus 00:31, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Lol they made it easier to sync xD 71.74.239.140 00:53, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Syncing (2)

Why not just base the amount of people who are able to enter from any give district based on the district population at the time of entry?
Consider this: American - English - District 2 of RA has 200 people. Alg. 1 says 25% of those 200 can enter within the next 30 second spam (ENTER, not Join the Queue).
This puts the 25% of the 200 from D2 with the 25% from D1, D3, ID1, etc into a big pool, who are then selected.
Why this would work against syncing:
25% of 4 is 1, meaning you can't really sync based off your district. Which also means, if you are in different districts, you'd need a far superior set-up to even have a chance at syncing, in which case the 4 (or however many people you are trying to sync with) are all placed in a given pool of X amount of people, and have the same chance of getting in your group as your non-sync'ing RA-buddies. Yeah, it'd probably take about 5 seconds of "Choosing team-mates", much like what GvG is like, but I think it's a possible system that, in theory, may work. Moo Kitty 02:09, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Edit: what I failed to try to say was /randomize a pool of people, don't base it off of time of entry. Moo Kitty 02:14, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

"District 2 of RA has 200 people." Isn't the district population max 100 though? That's what I remember it being, but I'm not 100% sure on that. personn5 02:26, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

It's the idea that counts, not the actual numbers. Moo Kitty 02:27, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

A more effective and more easily implementable solution is to randomize the join queue as matches start. This would completely remove all the "tricks" involved with synching, and leave none. ~Shard 02:44, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Lol, an easily implementable solution. Effective. That's the ANet we know and love, right? Moo Kitty 02:47, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Local chat: "ALL DIS1 SWITCH TO BUILD X" ; "ALL DIS2 SWITCH TO BUILD Y, DUDES" , etc. xD Inevitable set-ups! | 72 {U|S|T|C} - 02:51, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

No offense, moo, but they're certainly not going to use your harder-to-do idea. ~Shard 02:54, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

If it were up to me, I would just prevent players that have been on each other's friend, alliance, or guild list in the past 2 weeks from being assigned to the same teams unless there are no other players available. But I suppose it's not, and I don't know if that would be a feasible option from a programming point of view anyway. —Jette 02:59, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

GW is a friendly MMORPG that let's you sync with your friends? Moo Kitty 03:00, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Let's clear something up right now. If GW was a "friendly" MMORPG, there wouldn't be a skill that says "Don't play this game!".

Why do people always come up with supercomplex solutions to mind-numbingly simple problems? ~Shard 03:17, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Cause, Science. [1]personn5 03:23, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

You know... if you could just wait til tomorrow to post all these wonderful ideas, Anet will be able to actually read them :P -- Wyn talk 03:29, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

You know... if you could just realise you are talking to humans. Pika Fan 03:32, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

The probability that ANet cares (0) + the probability that they will read this page (0) + the probability that their programmers could do this, even if they wanted to (0) + the amount that ANet has cared about this in the past (0) leads me to think that no matter when ideas are posted, ANet will always go internal for ideas, and those internal ideas are bad. Moo Kitty 03:52, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Only time I ever used sync was in the Shiverpeak Arena off from Yak's Bend. We just used internation district. Justice 06:57, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

The new feedback namespace is up, so you can post your suggestions and now ANet could read them. --Silver Edge 22:56, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

FA and JQ.

Is it possible to sync in these places as well? Before and after the update. - J.P.Talk 10:27, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Yep, it is still possible84.194.165.200 11:07, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Sure is. We almost sync'd both sides in FA last night (lol). We wanted to do an ally vs ally thing. Got all but 3 people in, I think. Karate Jesus 13:15, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Is it possible to fix syncs in FA? There are not many people, who play, sometimes there are no players at all. A chance of sync therewithout Zquest or event is almost 100%. Kigamo 14:51, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

You can sync in with your friends in both places.Dunno if it will be easier this weekend with double cm rewards, probably not.--Wealedout 19:55, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Played 11 games last night, all synced with 2 friends. Hasn't been any different since the update for me =P--Silven 06:30, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

My 2¢, for what its worth

Well, I personally like the merging of the districts. It is refreshing to play with the ID people mixed in, but as far as stopping the syncing problem, it’s a complete bust. I’m sure a lot of it was people testing the waters to see if they could still sync in, but they were EVERYWHERE last night. From most accounts, it was marginally more difficult to sync if even that. IMHO, some sort of solution needs to come to fruition or it will wind up being a deal breaker once TA dies and the 10 round cap is lifted. A couple thoughts from my pea brain…… may work, may not but nothing ventured, nothing gained.

1. Pool everyone who enters in a given period of time into a staging pool. Once the staging pool reaches 16 or 24 players, randomly draw the teams out of that pool, irregardless of what order they entered to fill the slots for 2 or 3 battles at the same time.

2. Add a random delay of 0-15 seconds from the time you hit the enter battle button until it actually starts your timer.

Maybe something like one of these ideas, coupled with the larger pool of players from merging districts will make syncing too much of a hassle to deal with. Beating teams with 2 people synced in isn’t generally that big of a problem. You just gotta mix it up enough to make getting 3 or 4 on a team a rare occourance. I don't think any completely painless solution is going to happen. We may have to deal with waiting a little longer to get into a match, but C'est la vie--IninefingersI 16:37, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Hey, Nine, good to see you on GWW :D. If anyone knows what they're talking about with RA, it'd be you. However, if you want to make suggestions that Anet is "legally" allowed to use, follow the link at the top of this page and post your suggestions there. Karate Jesus 17:15, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, KJ. I'll do a copy/paste there.--IninefingersI 17:19, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

They will need to add a limit for that system, because what if you were never picked and you kept waiting?. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:71.161.206.131 (talk).

Well, you would probably have to wait a little longer at low traffic times, but I doubt with all the districts linked together it would take that long to fill 2 or 3 matches.--IninefingersI 19:20, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Ghost update

Um....wtf was it for? Karate Jesus 17:03, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

srsly.-- anguard 17:04, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Apparently they're not telling us :/ Karate Jesus 17:11, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Yea, the update is normally posted by now.-- anguard 17:11, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Well, good thing they're being more open now :D It was probably nothing important. Karate Jesus 17:13, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Update was probably for weekend event, though it is annoying when it forces you to disband... Elephant 17:15, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

They don't normally do updates for weekend events, so I would guess that it was something else. Karate Jesus 17:16, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

They probably had to do an update to zip up Nicholas the Traveler's fly.--IninefingersI 17:20, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Or shove more anti-depressants down his throat. Karate Jesus 17:24, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

I seem to recall being on 8 flawless in RA when I had to logoff because there was an update to take good old Nick the Transient out from behind a bush. Easy going & usually mellow Ninefingers had some unkind words over that business.--IninefingersI 17:39, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Well, they took Kun Shao out in the last update, didn't they say that they had to take him out, fix something, then put him back in? Maybe this is that middle update (way sooner than I thought it would be, though, so that's probably not it). -- FreedomBound 17:45, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

I would assume it's not that because it seems to early. Idk, I wish they would just tell us. Karate Jesus 17:56, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Everyone that normally "Tells us" is at PAX. -- Wyn talk 19:30, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

I thought Emily normally tells us. Is she at PAX? Karate Jesus 20:16, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

I would assume so. The heck is a webcomic doing setting up an exposition, anyway? Makes no sense. —Jette 20:51, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Probably a syncing fix, since the majority of teh ra players quit the game over it and have no interest for guild wars 2 since they wont fix exploits. Which is the last thing they want their customers to think. Idiotic for them to let this go for 2 years. --99.2.138.209 23:50, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

I figure it probably is the XTH thing. Yeah, it's pretty early, but they did say that they thought they had figured it out. If they know enough about it to know that they have to remove him, fix it, and put him back because anyone talking to him in the meantime would crash the game, then they probably have enough of an idea to implement it quickly. Just my thoughts, of course. --RoyHarmon 23:55, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Have mass updates died?

It's been said that Anet will be trying to make their updates smaller but more frequent. How much smaller are we talking about? The massive updates that had 20 skill changes to every profession were the things I would always look forward to every month, and would usually bring me back to play if I had stopped out of boredom. To me it's nice to have functionality changes and reworks (like sand shards) even if things aren't over or under powered. Are we ever going to have another super update like August 6th, June 18th, May 14th? Or are we slowly being doomed to small "here and theres"? Also lol synch fix. 68.193.113.198 20:35, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

It's ironic you say that, because GW will only improve if small balance changes are done frequently. Content updates are still coming every few months. ~Shard 20:47, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

I know; let's do 5 skill changes a week every Friday night, so ANet can't fix bugs over the weekend and everybody gets kicked out of PvP. —Jette 21:15, 5 September 2009 (UTC)

I understand the logic behind their new update approach. I also know about the content updates, but those are still pretty new. I was referring to the awesomeness of coming home from work to find a nice big list of changed or new skills. The awesomeness of reading all the hundreds of comments on the talk pages. The anticipation for next month! If we're only gonna have smaller bug fixes or minor changes, all I have to look forward to now is bi-yearly content infusions which will probably be riddled with cash-shop hijinks. Actually, they're already saying those updates will contain even less than April's. They say they're going to still keep GW1 alive and strong after GW2, but I get the feeling that eventually all we'll be getting are things like the Aeon wings. 68.193.113.198 03:00, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Really big updates are sometimes too much, however. Nobody likes seeing an update, thinking "great, they've changed some things, let's see what" and then finding all they did was nerf whatever they overbuffed last week, nerfed some ranger skill and buffed a couple for PvE which didn't need buffing. However, a massive long list can be a bit overwhelming imo, and I'd rather they changed only a few things but did them well, since it's easier to see what the impact will be then (both for them and for us). I myself would kind of prefer some sort of middle ground (enough updates to keep things moving, but not loads of pointless ones for the sake of it). 82.3.249.58 10:42, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

I suppose you're right, but at least now we'll be able to give alot more pre-fact feedback since they're apparently going to post the updates before putting them live. 68.193.113.198 19:38, 7 September 2009 (UTC)

Fail

Since the update, I have had over 50 groups with 2-3 other healers. 26, I kid you not, 26 of those have been since 5 pm today. It is now 7 pm. I have a feeling the chances are against me, somehow, lol. -- Tha Reckoning 00:04, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

IT IS THE AGE OF AQUARIUS! 68.193.113.198 03:01, 6 September 2009 (UTC)

Should we add a note about the delayed September skill balance?

Not that it's a surprise to anyone that the update is delayed, but should we add a note? Karate Jesus 19:05, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

What would jesus do? 68.193.113.198 20:59, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

Continue being a non-existent being. personn5 21:04, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

(Edit conflict) Well, Karate Jesus would add a link, but he'd then get reverted. -- FreedomBound 21:07, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

^ It's true. Karate Jesus 21:14, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

It would be more noteworthy if an update wasn't delayed these days. elix Omni 01:15, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

It's too easy of a solution...

To me, it seems if the goal really was eliminating syncing, removing the "team selection by time entered into the pool" would be the first thing to change. Joining regions would just be a way to ensure variety and lessen the chances of seeing someone you know. You really only need add on a couple seconds waiting time after the timer hits 0 (dropping the cancel button so you can't leave as easily), during which the teams are randomly selected from the pool list, leaving no regard for when you entered the pool, and the last 1-7 people not in two teams of four get pushed into the next cue. Anyone who joins during that period of time is put into the next 30 second cue. It wouldn't need to be any more detailed then that, and any other more complicated solution is bound to have stupid problems/exploits. I mean, it's RANDOM arena, leaving it up to the players clicking abilities and not making the system use randomly chosen teams was the biggest mistake in the first place. Obviously I don't know the restrictions they work under, but if something like that really can't be done someone failed when making the system. --75.169.104.1 01:06, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

In my humble opinion, if they can't shuffle a team of 4 players with the amount of traffic RA gets, they aren't trying very hard.--IninefingersI 16:48, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Do they have a reason to try that hard? Also, we can't really know how complicated it may be. Mediggo 16:50, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

They have a HUGE reason to try hard. With the proposed 4v4 changes, not controlling syncs would completely ruin 4v4. I can't imagine they haven't tried to do something about it before. They even announced at one point that syncing RA wasn't considered an exploit. Random Arenas is intended to be random, hence the name. How can an activity done specifically to keep it from being random not be an exploit? As far as fixing the problem goes, even though its just a game, Anet is a business and Guild Wars is their product. A multi-million dollar product, no less. I've been an Aeronautical Engineer for 15 years, and a Manager for over 2. I can tell you that, in business, if you have people who tell you "It's too hard....It's too complicated....I can't do it", you get rid of those people and surround yourself with people who will table solutions instead of problems. If you don't, your business will soon be out of business.--IninefingersI 19:04, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Armor of Sanctity Nerf

First they buffed AoS to cause weakness, then they nerf it to 3x the cooldown. I understand it was overpowered after the buff, but why did they screw with it in the first place? It was a relatively obscure enchant that was good as part of a combo, but not overly powerful on its own. Adding AoE weakness to it was a bad idea, now they have to try and fix something they never should have screwed with in the first place. Best way to balance this skill is to put it back the way it was to begin with and leave it alone.--IninefingersI 01:39, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

Then we're back to the issue of a highly niche and unused skill that needs tweaking to bring it into the game. ---Chaos- 15:50, 19 September 2009 (UTC)