Talk:Game updates/Archive 4

Hero Glitches

It seems that now heroes are unable to cast spells from a distance, this problem has only recently occurred and may need to be looked. You must be standing within aggro bubble for any spells to work it seems. They also don't seem to follow you, or go to where you tell them to anymore.

Blindfolds

->Fixed a graphical bug that occurred when Gwen was equipped with the Deldrimor Armor in a PvP arena. ->Why are blindfolds and the insane amount of clipping associated with them not being fixed, yet an elite skin gwen gets her armor fixed? Blindfolds are popular and if fixed, would be greatly appreciated by many.-Mistha

PvP & PvE Skills

Since there is now a possibility to have different parameters for each skill depending if you play PvP or PvE, how about resetting a couple of other skills nerved only for PvP reasons? Or is there a special PvE related reason for nerving e.g. Haste of the Flame/Storm Djinn (speed and duration)?BuffyS

They will do that. With time. As they see it fit. Remember that NPCs use the PvE versions, so sometimes it would be to much to undo one of those changes. And it's better to keep the more as is possible. MithTalk 13:33, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

ursan

All of these nerfs and the one inarguably overpowered skill, ursan, remains untouched. But watch yourself and flame djinn get murdered.

I'm....missing the logic.--Ryudo 21:36, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

no one cares about pve.--207.172.193.204 21:45, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

well they killed mending refrain--85.225.131.117 00:01, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

GvG motigon abuse. --71.229 00:02, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

Never seen you on GWW before, 71.229... -- Mafaraxas 00:12, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

That's because I was trolling on my IPs before. Didn't see a reason to use an account until I found out that I got one here by registering on GW2W. :O --71.229 03:07, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, the PvE wuining skill left alone once again. PvE has been buried for good I guess. -- (gem / talk) 00:40, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

PvP balance is a huge issue, which is why it controls most nerfs (but not all). But to be honest, a LOT of players adore Ursan, because it allows them to access harder areas and get into PUGs. Is this a good thing? Well, it depends on your opinions, doesn't it? -- Alaris 03:45, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

Monsters have skills like Snaring Web. So, I see no problem in players being able to use likely powerfull skills against them. Any balance to PvE skills would have to cont also monster skills. MithTalk 15:21, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

LOOOOOL. I can't take anyone seriously who compares Snaring Web to Ursan. Actually, only very few monster skills are overpowered, and those are all skills that are meant to be hard, ie skills on some boss like monsters or very hard areas. And all of them are prtty easy to overcome with the right skill bar. Players always have the advantage of planning their skill bar according to the monsters. The stupid thing about Ursan is that you don't need to plan your bar, you can just use one skill on every single area of the game. -- (gem / talk) 00:14, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Bring 8 ursan and go Fight Shiro. Without any other professions or skills. Just 8 Ursan. You won't win. MithTalk 02:56, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Bring eight guns and go live in the desert. Without any food or water. Just eight guns. You won't survive. --71.229 03:08, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

I Don't get why people are so worried about PvE, the fact that there are skills like Ursan doesn't force you to use them right? The only thing that could happen is that showing off your tormented items will get harder. But who seriously cares about someone showing off their items? Its all you. SniperFox 10:45, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

The three Norn elites have had a significant positive effect: they have made every profession useful everywhere. Is that benefit worth the drawbacks? I'm not sure, but I'd like to believe it is. Is there a better to level the playing field? I think there is, and I would support nerfing these skills after the playing field has been leveled by other means, until then, I think that Ursan Blessing is the lesser of two evils. -- Gordon Ecker 11:17, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

If characters where able to change primary profession, or everything was unlocked account-wide like in PvP (outposts, skills, titles, etc). Then, there won't matter which character you favor and move through the plot and Ursan would be a mistake. But there were cases, too many cases, that players where severely punished for choosing one profession, because in elite areas only the 'max' combination where getting into teams. Ursan turned that unfair situation into 'everyone enters'. A fair punishment for those that never allowed such profession in their teams and a nice treat for those that chose unfavored professions. There is only one change left for Ursan, and it's to completely ignore profession by ignoring armor properties. To make up for armor differences skills are used. If you cannot choose skills, then you can't compensate that. So all effects that replace all skills with skills unrelated to the profession must ignore armor. Only that is needed. MithTalk 13:13, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Basically Ursan is driving the game to the point that professions don't matter. Why do we have the profession selection then other than looks? Why do we have a few hundred skills when all we need is a couple of other skills + Ursan? Imo a skill that makes the rest of the game mechanics useless is a bad thing to have in a game. -- (gem / talk) 18:53, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Finally you get the point. Making professions matter so much was a great mistake. I hope that in GW2 we can change primary profession and armor to be able to play all profession having just one character of each race. MithTalk 02:45, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

There was a point where PvE titles were actually hard to get, and tormented items were rare, cool to look at, and a pleasure to have. Now? "Oh, meh, another guy ursan'd his way through DoA and got a tormented scythe. Seen it before." "Meh, some guy ursan'd his way through legendary vanquisher. Big deal." Etc. -- Armond Warblade 02:57, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Of course. 'there was'. And for some time the new contest items will be like that too. And then they become 'free for all' too sooner or later. You can't pretend to keep something 'hard' forever. It's like a gaussian distribution. Things start low, then high, then go down again once no one is interested in them. MithTalk 03:48, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

It's just the same with fow-armor. Two years ago it was "wow, great armor...", now it's just an overexpensive armor - nothing more. Der moon 11:48, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

I think you give Ursan a bit to much credit, but nevertheless is made things perhaps quite a bit more easy than it should have. If they half the armor bonus it wouldn't be that overpowered anymore.

That would be ok if the game was designed to work without the profession system. Now the profession system was scrapped with one skill, dumbing the game down to one skill, not multiple skills. It'd be ok to not be limited by choice of profession, but adding one skill that everyone uses is not the way to get out of the system. Where's the tactics and difference nowdays? Nowhere, unless your stupid enough to not use Ursan, like I am. -- (gem / talk) 14:54, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Or smart enough to do not need it. MithTalk 16:50, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Ursan is for people who suck at pve, hard mode is suppose to be hard, DoA, urgoz, the deep, they're suppose to be hard, and for the elite players. Then noobs complain that they can't get into groups. The noobs complain, and Anet hands them Ursan Blessing, and now elite areas are the game have turned into presearing. If you couldn't get a DoA group before Hm was introduced to it, its probably cause you sucked at the game. Thats the way it is, cause it used to be hard, damn hard, and that is what was fun about it, it was for players who where good at the game to meet their match. But now, I can grab 7 noobs from ascalon who have never heard of DoA, hand them Ursan Blessing, and beat all everything with almost no effort. That is the problem with Ursan Blessing. Tormented Items, Vanquishing titles, they used to mean something, but now its just one more useless thing that someone can ursan their way through. IMO, Ursan blessing and Consumables should be unusable in Hard Mode, and elites ares like Urgoz, DoA, UW, etc. That way noobs can still ursan their way through the game, but not ruin the economy by making titles and items worthless as it has done. Gosu Death 17:39, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Stop complaining and start making builds that can outdamage the ursans. --Fox007 17:45, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Uh... you can't? Not without sacrificing survivability, at least. That's the whole point of the discussion; Ursan is makes PvE a joke because now you need practically no skill outside of button mashing (and not being completely retarded) to do anything and cheapens the value of items and the prestige of titles. Personally I don't really care either way. -- Mafaraxas 18:05, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

well that's the challenge :) --Fox007 18:56, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Fox007, the problem is, Ursan is the quickest way to do it, there is nothing that out dmgs it and compares with its defense, added on with it takes no skill to use.Gosu Death 01:03, 10 March 2008 (UTC)

PvE is still a joke, Ursan or no Ursan, the only area where it's considerably easier for Ursan than any other cookie cutter build is the Mallyx fight. Everything else, all the missions, areas (NM and HM), almost all other elite areas can be done with pretty much anything as long as u plan ahead. And most the time not much planning is needed since whatever u choose for one area will work in 90% of this game (whether it be the 3 necro heroes, the nuker/monk/tank trinity, barragers and mm or whatever else).78.2.30.181 23:21, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

I don't like Ursan because it's boring and makes all my characters play the same. I do like that it's possible to get into groups in places like DoA, which I couldn't find groups for before. But Ursan makes PvE really boring, but it's so good it's hard not to just take it. I kill things faster and make more money when I take Ursan, so I do, but I don't enjoy it. And there's no distinction between my characters anymore; they're all just Ursans.Miss Innocent 04:13, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

"it's hard not to just take it." Try more not taking it. -- Mafaraxas 05:51, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

I only use Norn Blessings when most of the party uses Norn Blessings, that is, in full human parties. And only in areas where enmies are just hard damage deales, without other special features. The best example is domain of anguish, where enemies bring the Enraged monster skill. They just hit hard, without 'technique'. I would never bring a norn blessing against Shiro. It would be stupid. Against shiro you need to think a little bit, not plain brute force, it's the same in the whole game, there are places where it i not needed at all, places when it really comes in handy and places where it would be counter-productive to bring it. People just got hyped-up, like those eles that bring Meteor Storm everywhere. MithTalk 11:43, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

So, Every party you're in?

Ursan Blessing is a skill for people that can't play the game. Every part of the game (except the one pq where you get the skill for the time being) is playable without Ursan, and I'm the living proof of that. I am no Uber Roxxor Skillz Pwner, I just know how to play some of the chars and I know the meaning of team play. The message is simple: If you can't do it without Ursan, you are not ment to be there. There is no character in the game that is unusable in any of the areas. Just players that are too stupid to integrate e.g. a Paragon in their team are the problem, not the character classes.BuffyS

The difference between not been allowed for being a mesmer and for not having Ursan is that anyone can be ursan. But the ones that make such requirements are equally stupid. For those that made only fixed parties of fixed professions in fixed areas, Ursan is a good punishment. Without being the best possible build, it's better that all those gimmick builds that kind of players required to join their parties. No one deserves easier access for choosing a ranger instead of an assassin.MithTalk 08:49, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

The question is if you really want to play with these "Uber Pro Roxxor" players that only copy a build that has worked once and want to make you believe that it can't be done another way... Ursan is just a kick in the back of everyone that actually HAS a brain...BuffyS

I would say the opposite. Ursan is not a bother at all to anyone that actually has a brain. Because they don't need to use Ursan neither join others that will only use it. If you can't find people that do not use Ursan, then probably you haven't looked for them enough. I hardly see it used outside elite areas. MithTalk 11:22, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

I've been playing Guild Wars for nearly 3 years, and I have experienced firsthand all the changes that have gone on in PvE. I think I can comfortably call myself a good, maybe even expert player; I know a lot about the game. However, I see no problem with rampaging around with Ursan every once in a while. Sure, it's overpowered, but it's not like I'm missing anything because of it. I don't think that veterans' use of an overpowered skill is wrong--what's wrong is the fact that inexperienced players and/or noobs use it to "cheat" and get through areas too difficult for their skill level. On the flip side, the elite areas should not be Ursan-fests either. I agree with Mith above when he stated that challenging areas should not necessarily be won by Ursan. Every area, no matter how difficult, SHOULD be winnable with a balanced team that doesn't exclude any class. Unfortunately, players have decided that only "the uber pplz" can play in these cases. For example, a month after DoA came out, I tried to get in a team there with my Paragon. Guess what? Only 3 builds were viable, and they were for ele, warrior, and monk. So I can see the virtue of using Ursan when certain classes are discriminated against, but by no means should it be overused. Too bad we can't get rid of noobs... Silver40596

How about a new skill as replacement for Ursan? "Tactical nuclear attack: All enemies in the area die instantly. The magnetic charge after effect will pull all items dropped by the opponents to your location." I mean, honestly, Ursan has no place in this game...BuffyS

I don't really want to get into this whole mess (IMHO both sides are right) but Consumables are more overpowered then Ursan itself. Yesterday I was in FoW on HM. 2 HB Monks, 5 Ursans, and one Assassin (me). Everything was going way to easy... until a consu set wore off in the middle of the battle. 3 people died in a matter of seconds, and 2 more died while escaping. Just throwing that out for you to think about it. Bye. — Poki#3 17:57, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Signed... and the Lamer's Special: Ursan + Consumables... The consumables are truly overpowered. I remember when I tried the eternal grove with seven other very experienced players in HM... We failed three times in a row. Then we used a full set of consumables... 13 minutes without even one death...BuffyS

Why have I heard off lots of player recently that there's going to be some "Big Ursan Nerf"? _From^Stokoe 16:33, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Since Ursan was nerfed into oblivion, classes that have had a harder time getting into groups will once again be shunned for the Holy Trinity. GG Anerf. GW 2? I think not...

14th Update

Added concise descriptions for skills. You can now choose the traditional ones or new concise ones. Grammar pedants just wet themselves. 122.104.160.66 20:34, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

genius, prmote whoever did this pl0x. Actually it's rather hideous right now, hope it gets fixed. --Underwood 20:36, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

You can choose either so if you don't like it just keep the old ones. 122.104.160.66 20:44, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

What if I don't like either? As a consumer I demand satisfaction!!! --Underwood 20:58, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Then you wouldn't be playing GW... Calor 20:59, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

I just dont understand what the point is. I notice that the concise in some cases leaves out important details about the skills mechanics. Looks to me like it will lead to confusion for less experinced players. 71.12.20.36 21:16, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Finally someone who understands me.--Underwood 21:17, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

If you're less experienced, then you probably shouldn't be using Concise. :D

I personally like this. Just like Magic: the Gathering. More complicated effects have reminder text; as keywords get older, or if the set's a higher difficulty, then they leave the reminder text out and shorten the text box considerably. For players who don't know the keywords, the reminder text explains it all. For players who already know what they're doing, it just clutters up the box.

• Take the card Time Stop as an example. Rules text: End the turn. (Remove all spells and abilities on the stack from the game, including this card. The player whose turn it is discards down to his or her maximum hand size. Damage wears off, and "this turn" and "until end of turn" effects end.)
• Or, the concise version: End the turn.

For experienced players, that three-word effect is just the coolest thing ever. This update makes me feel the same way. -- Jïörüjï Ðērākō.>.cнаt^ 21:27, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

(Reset indent) What I'm getting at is that the concise descriptions can be more concise, formatted better, and more continuous. As right now they have "knocks-down moving foes." instead of "Causes knockdown. (No effect unless target foes is moving)" <- Thats Water Trident vs Bull's Strike. --Underwood 22:59, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps we can bring those inconsistencies up on Bobby Stein's text bug page now that they're officially trying to have concise skill descriptions? :) --Aspectacle 23:06, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Omg /fail - Wish I'd had known that page existed earlier D: and now my OCD is warring against my laziness and making me nervous.--Underwood 23:09, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

lol. I'm sorry. :P Perhaps we best find someone to ask about whether they care about consistency in their concise descriptions before you start getting too twitchy. --Aspectacle 23:16, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

If they paid me then it'd be a different story.--Underwood 23:19, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

If anyone finds a problem with the concise or traditional descriptions, please post it on Bobby's text bug page or on Mike Z's bug pages. In the process of trying to make skill descriptions more simple and clear, it is possible that important information is left out, or is described inaccurately. We would like the descriptions to be as accurate as possible, and are very interested in hearing about these problems. -Kim Chase 17:44, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Too many skill updates?

I really enjoy playing Guild Wars. I like developing new techniques and avenues to get through an area. But there are these massive skill updates. Not only does it affect my character. But it affects the entire team that I may have spent days setting up my builds to run in specific areas. Of course, this also affects how the enemies are going to encounter our group, as well. When there are 30 odd updates in all different classes, the changes are difficult to absorb all at once. We all understand that changes have to be made from time to time. But please understand, that these multitude of changes are difficult for adults to understand completely, much less for our younger counterparts. I know the changes may seem simple to development staff. But many players only have a few hours a day to enjoy the Guild Wars realm. We don't have the ability to spend hours memorizing in game details since it isn't our job. We spend 8 or more hours a day doing some other chore that we get paid for and then come home to have a nice relaxing evening on Guild Wars, if life permits (and we can figure out what the effects of 20 skill updates actually do).

Please sign your comments so we know who leaves these brilliant comments (usually 4 ~~~~ will do). These changes aren't that massive and memorization isn't difficult. Many skills need work right now and Izzy is trying to balance skills already in play and slowly getting ones viable, you know? The amount of skills he's currently changing is just enough to offer a change in the skill choice of many players but few enough in numbers that he can spot any imbalance and fix it rather quickly (such as the Imba Grenth's Aura->Pious Assault chain) I'll anyones comments later.--Underwood 22:41, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

i personally like the skill updates scince it tends to keep the game...interesting.--Simpson man 01:06, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, when I think of a guy sittin on a chair an farming with the very same build and playing with only one hand while watching TV and the remote controller with the other hand, I can't help but love skill updates. People MUST get used to check the skills once in a while, not just copypaste templates and go. MithTalk 02:23, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

The more the merrier, and there's still a lot of skills in dire need of changing. Nicky Silverstar 08:10, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

I don't know who Izzy is, and I understand that his work is difficult (probably extremely so). I was just trying to give some feedback to the larger updates and am sorry if it came across so negative. Of course, builds like Imba's Grenth's Aura have to be dealt with immediately. But even 1 build change has several effects. 1) It effects my character's build, 2) it effects the hero/hench builds, 3) it effects the synergy of my team build and 4) it effects the monster builds (or opposing team in PvP). These 3 effects snowball into 1 larger effect as to how a melee outcome is likely to be a defeat or win. This is fairly easy to understand with some light review. Until there are 30. Now I have 100's of builds saved on my computer of which some will have these adjustments and each of those may need adjustment. Izzy,if you happen to read this, you have my utmost respect with the changes you've made and will make. I'm not telling you how to do your job, as I wouldn't expect you to tell me how to fix your air conditioner if I was working on it. I just wanted to give you and others an opinion of an average player that just plays for fun. It's not that there are skill updates, it's just the amount at one time and the affect on my saved profiles. I'm just giving an opinion that you may or may not want, but hope you at least have the same respect for as I have for you. Anon

If you're that casual, why do you even care about the skills? If something changes, you just grab any other skill. Perfection (or in other terms, creating viable cookie cutter builds) isn't needed, you can basically just pick any build you want. And if it's an outdated gimmick, just ask guildmates or friends what the nerfed skill/build has been replaced with. I understand your point in a certain analogy like "I've started solving a puzzle, but someone changed the piece shapes while I was gone", but the shapes are supposed to fit in better in the amalgame of the game this way.

Besides... if you're playing GW for enjoyment after a hard day's work... why are you playing it? It's not a game that requires no thinking (well... except for most of PvE...). If you want to enjoy yourself without thinking, you might have more fun tossing a rubber ball against your wall for a couple of hours. ANet won't change the substance of which the ball is made out of. Saphatorael 14:28, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

XP not displaying

Since the update on 3/13, I've noticed that experience points (at least in Pre-Searing) are no longer being displayed if the award is 0. It may be just me, but I would rather have the '0' displayed than nothing at all ... at least this way, I know that I'm not going to advance by continuing to go after a particular level opponent.

Algonda 10:27, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, not sure exactly what happened, but all appears to be working same as before now.

Algonda 14:51, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Missing Update on Official Site?

Just noticed, as I have a link to the RSS feed for the updates on my google page, that the official site is only showing last weeks update in which a couple of the DaW winner weapons were tweaked to be longer. I'd swear that yesterday this was showing the current update with concise descriptions, etc. What's up? Dargon 18:01, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

and it's back now Dargon 20:30, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Crashes

Since the last update (march 18) my guildwars crashes regularly. It has never crashed before. Please fix it... --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:90.187.214.74 (talk).

Hello, I do not know what is involved in all of the skill updates, but as I read it seems to me the skill updates are due to imbalances in PvP. And really I do not care about PvP. I and my whole alliance purchased the games for the adventure and team play offered in the PvE area. Nothing better than getting with your friends and questing and chasing down the bad guys threating the well being of Tyria. Although I can understand the bug fixes, I really dont know why skills are changed especially when their effectiveness is destroyed. There are so many skills available?? Some are actually duplicates just named different. But really, cant skill changes for PvP be done without changeing PvE skills. Most of us PvE players will be here long after the PvP players get bored and leave the game for some other Diablo or Counterstrike or WOW. The GW team has gave us a fantastic game that just seems to keep getting better. Dont forget we are playing the content you created for us in PvE and we love it. And I suspect we are the majority of the 5 million players in the game. The PvP players well although they a definately great gamers they are a lot smaller fraction of the players and their style of play should not be confused with ours. --Greyhawk of tyria 14:58, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

That discussion has been had plenty of times before. The argument, afaik, is that GW is primarily known for its PvP rather than PvE despite what you and your friends got into the game for, and anet's already decided long ago that PvP balance takes priority over PvE nine times out of ten. -- Mafaraxas 15:22, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Mafaraxas, Thank you for you point of view although I do not think it true of ANET's because of the amount of time and resources they spent giving us PvE players all the cool stuff they do for us. I agree they do take PvP serious as reflected in some of the actual cash rewards you PvP players can get. My point is cant they do updates strictly for PvP without effecting the PvE players. I have watched some PvP battles and actually have tried a couple. You PvP players rock! But again you are a different kind of gamer and PvP and PvE are 2 seperate ways of playing. And you are always welcome to Join us in some quests Sorry I couldnt join in one of your PvP things I would suck lol. --Greyhawk of tyria 17:45, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Also, its not possible to change the way a skill behaves in pvp to be different form how it behaves in pve. Anet has stated that the current engine doesnt allow for that--Ryudo 01:54, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes it is, PvE only skills prove that. House Of Furyan 02:14, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

There's your proof it was meant to be a PvP game. — Teh Uber Pwnzer 02:00, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Arenanet would now be incredibly stupid (yes, I used the word stupid) to turn around to the PvE community and go "well, you know this game is PvP really". They'd lose so many sales for Guild Wars 2 it wouldn't be funny. Take into consideration that, whats a good estimate, over 65-75% of the games content is PvE related. House Of Furyan 02:13, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Doesn't saying it was built from the ground up as a competitive game and almost all skill balances revolving around PvP mean anything? Btw, you basically just called Mike O'Brien stupid. — Teh Uber Pwnzer02:21, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

What that proves is that Arenanet does not have the experience or talent to maintain both a PvP (seemingly the original focus) and PvE (secondary focus) game. Guild Wars is sold as both a PvE and PvP product, by the way. Yes, I would call Mike dense if he didn't understand and accept the relationship Guild Wars has within it, both PvP and PvE and that BOTH sides have allowed it its nice little 5 million product sales. House Of Furyan 02:32, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

osht

bspike nerfedddddddddddddddddddddddddd 99.235.230.36 20:59, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Reward points, too 90.128.53.75 01:41, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Anyone else feel that the skill updates, oh the last 4-5 of them have hardly had anything positive? The skill trees feel skewed now. At this rate, GW will be almost like...I shudder to say...dare I say it? .... WoW... --BeeD 01:53, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

The last couple of updates were at least a mixed bag, this one is just Izzy swinging the nerf bat at anything that moves. Boo. --Lonelypixel 02:49, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Really? Hey ANet, I see Shiro moving over there... Get him! -- Alaris 04:07, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

April Fools!

Stick Figures! :D SniperFox 10:16, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

April 1st 2008, 4:20 Eastern Time

The game got updated, so why didn't we add into that update, a way of allowing pvp characters to have their armor set without using templates, this is screwing up pvp =S

• Checks later* Hallelujah! 65.34.193.183 20:28, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Um yeah....i can see peeps saying pay me 50k and i will run u to pre searing...if u dont believe its possible look on the guild wars official website under updates...theres no tag at the end saying april fools...and honestly not all of those skill update notes are rediculous compared to some of their "balancing acts". the mechanic updates also wouldnt surprise me.--98.135.31.185 23:14, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

4/1/2008 Bug Fix: Other then the update for the Stick figures... there was a bug fix to fix a problem with PvP armors... the Stick figures use the emotes of a Ranger, and this carried over into the PvP armor... so if you were a Warrior and you wanted to change you head piece from Sword to Axe... you couldn't do this because there would be Ranger Masks in its place... this was fixed around 15:00 EST SabreWolf 00:22, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

LOL Blackout good one

Known Updates

- Blinding Surge - nerfed duration to 4s at 12 attribute; reduced recharge to 3s

- Aegis - 15e now

- Song of Restoration + Ballad of Restoration; recharge increased to 30s, SoR Energy increased to 10e

- Lightning Orb - no longer causes cracked armor

- Energy Burn/Energy Surge - now 9 e-denial 14 spec, reduced damage per energy from 12 to 9

- Death Pact Signet - 4s cast time

- Flesh of My Flesh - 10s recharge added

- Eremite's Attack - 1s cast time

- Disarm - 20s recharge

- Shockwave - 1s cast time

- Splinter Weapon - 8s recharge

- Ancestor's Rage - 1s cast time

Lutz 23:31, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

You can use the main update page for this specific update - Talk:Game updates/20080417. -- Brains12 \ Talk 23:36, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Gotta love Anet's response time on this crap Mcsneaksneak 00:27, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

AR is still OP, but at least they acknowledge that. The prob with Shockwave spike isn't shockwave, it's Shadowsteps, don't see any nerfs to them. moush 00:59, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Naturally...

no nerfs to shitway. No trap range reduction, no revert of Escape or Pious Assault, no nerf of the simply ridiculous Rending Touch, no changes to expertise, barely a nerf to splinter weapon... What the hell, ANet? You missed, again. Thanks for spending your time nerfing Shelter and Displacement for GvG, they were so common and definitely gamebreaking. Failure of an update overall, didn't even fix assassin's remedy - immunity to blind is pretty ridiculous for a non-elite, maintainable enchantment. -Auron 01:13, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, cause Escapeway is so overpowered and ruining the game! rofl 70.238.160.59 01:31, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Er... name one way it isn't overpowered. The skills on the bar make up for the lack of skill of bad players running it, and allows them to roll pretty much everyone of equal or slightly more skill. That's pretty much a perfect example of the term overpowered, in case you've never bothered to think about what "overpowered" meant.

There are varying levels of overpowered. Just because this one is on a lower rung than say, hexes and sins, doesn't mean it isn't imbalanced. If it allows you to regularly beat people of your skill level without trying, the build is imbalanced. -Auron 02:13, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

You can't expect a coordinated lego spike to function on ventless unranked pugs, ever. Bad players beating other bad players with a bad build isn't overpowered, it's merely inevitable. FoxBat 15:55, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Paragon Update

Anet can you plz rape the Paragon a litle more its too good when played in 8 paries with only paragons, and it totaly destroys my leet Searing Flame ele spike buildz in HA. I mean the have like too much armor so can you PLZ nerf them MOAR?--85.225.130.55 11:09, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Um paragons not that great of a class, something always does something better than it. You loose because of lack of skill, and because there are 8 paragons, there's no true monk support so, just kill em. Paragon's suffer loads of nerfs, especialy due to the temporary torney changes. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:24.47.41.80 (talk).

Not sure if you were being sarcastic, but if you weren't, just take a necro and shut the paras down. Maj

Not that easy. Paragons are broken as hell. -- Armond Warblade 21:57, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

Gotta love how someone who doesn't even play the game anymore considers a class broken because it's been reduced to one decent build that revolves around leeching off the rest of your friends/guild members until you manage to farm the titles up enough to even make the skills decent, and that's still only in PvE.  ;) ~ J.Kougar 23:48, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

Not a bug

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/5682/15608012sr5.jpg Stop reverting. 71.98.84.249 20:38, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Huh

Why is it alright to balance pvp but not pve? Surely that's a large proportion of your players you're ignoring.

Balance takes into account PvP and PvE, and if there are PvE imbalances, then those do get adjusted as needed. The main reason why PvP gets more balance updates is that (1) it is competitive as in tournaments for money, and (2) you play against players who try to break the builds whereas in PvE you don't. Also, imbalances in PvE tend to be about abusing a given build against a give opponent / mission, which is often easier to fix by changing the opponent / mission. -- Alaris 15:29, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

I disagree at the moment anyways, what with Shadowform being buffed, Mystic Regen servituding a cap of 8 enchants (perfect for 55ers/330ers...), Ursanway Spiketeams etc... You either solo-farm, duo-farm, Paraway or go into a bear blessing for PvE... GW PvE no longer allows for CustomiZation among the community because of ~all~ of this, which is false advertising from whoever Promotes what USE to be a fun Player Vs. Enviroment friendly endgame.

Eve - Henchmen is missing in Central Transfer Chamber.

Just wanted to pass on that Eve (Henchmen) is missing from the central transfer chamber in Eye of the North. She is in every other outpost in EotN. Believe this has to be a bug/error that occured with the 05/01/08 update. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Riffhard (talk).

Are you sure? I just checked and she's in both the outpost itself and the party list. -- Brains12 \ Talk 20:39, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

She wasn't just after the update, fixed now - ty Anet--Riffhard 20:48, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Eve is gone again.... poor Eve. ~ Sabastian 04:01, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

The last update took her out. ~ Sabastian 04:02, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Eve, Devona, and Aidan are all missing, actually, since the last update. ~ Sabastian 04:05, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Confirmed. Eve, Devona, and Aidan have been removed from the CTC with this update.

~ J.Kougar 04:14, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

They're there for me. This isn't anything new either. They disappear from time to time, always have. I take Eve a lot with me on the final mission and sometimes I have to change zones a few times til I find her. Just took this screen now, she was there when I first zoned in, but I have had to zone a few times to find her in the past.

Oops. Forgot to sign. Fae 05:17, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

They aren't there in International and keep disappearing... I'm in International right now waiting for their return... ~ Sabastian 05:21, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Yep. Was in American dists when I took that pic. Can confirm they're MIA from International though. Though they've been missing from Int. before. I don't think this is anything new. Maybe they'll come back when no-one is in the Dist? I mean, it'll stay bugged til it empties out, right? Fae 05:25, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Skills Moved

I dunno if it's old news but Mystic Regeneration and Victorious Sweep can be bought it Yohlon Haven now. I would update the skill pages but new to this ~ Sick Dezign 2:28 am, 13 May 2008

Can you confirm that they are available before being unlocked? -- Gordon Ecker 06:52, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

My mistake, Im still kind of new to this game. Sorry about that. ~ Sick Dezign 3:10 am, 13 May 2008

Exploit

"Fixed an exploit." I'd rather see no text at all than something this vague. But I'm hoping that the next update notes will be "Did some stuff." Because that would just amuse me (no, I can't explain why one bothers me and the other would be amusing). Is there a reason that the update notes are so lacking in detail? Was the exploit only partially fixed, and there's a possibility of further exploitation? --Nkuvu 00:19, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Apparently the fix may be a sensitive issue, and ANet is deciding not to release any specific details. Drago 00:20, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

probably some embarrassing shit 80.193.1.106 00:21, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Or....not. It could be an instability in the system, or perhaps a packet exploit. Could also be something that would be incredibly harmful to the game as a whole. And I think if it was embarassing it would've been an undocumented update. But no, they chose to display it. Now play nice, anon. Drago 00:26, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

If it was undocumented people would be asking questions about a random client update. 80.193.1.106 00:33, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

There was a game update last night for me, and it wasn't listed in the update page. Big deal? Nope, just figured something or other was fixed. I think fewer people are going to ask about a small, undocumented update than they would about vague text. My point is that if no details of the exploit are given, that's fine -- but I see no value in writing update notes like this. --Nkuvu 00:44, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

That seems pretty backwards to me; I think more people would be upset to see undocumented updates than they would to see "X fixed" updates. People engineer conspiracy theories when vague text is presented, so I suspect that they would be wilder and more prolific if no text was presented at all. ArenaNet may be trying to head off the wilder of the conspiracy theories, so they are telling us all we really want and need to know: an exploit was fixed. That should really be the end of it. 207.191.205.18 18:35, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

So you'd be perfectly happy with update notes like "Fixed a bug" or "Updated some skills"? I mean, that's telling us what they're doing, so that should be sufficient, right? --Nkuvu 06:34, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

Yeah like, account hacking. Anet admitting that would drive a serious (monetary) hole in faith in their swiss-cheese security. FoxBat 23:16, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

FoxBat, does that have any grounding in fact or are you just trying to vent? -- Frozzen 00:01, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

Well, it's possible they didn't fix the latest hacking method yet, you tell me which is more disturbing. If they had fixed such a loophole, I can't see them admitting it. FoxBat 01:25, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

Watchlist ping

It really bugs me that Game updates doesn't ping on my watchlist anymore. Any chance we could fix that? -elviondale (tahlk) 00:27, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Have anyone updating the talk page, since the watch is shared. MithTalk 22:33, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Hmm. I don't think there is any good method without removing the dynamic addition.. Or would a link in the upper right, as it is on the Main Page and on Recent changes, help? poke | talk 22:37, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

If the wiki had a 'watch children' option that would help. But it seems that there is no such feature. So the a change in the page is the only way. MithTalk 22:41, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps add {{latest update}} on a page you see regularly (i.e. your userpage). Won't ping you, but it would be easier for you to notice. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Brains12 (talk • contribs) at 22:42, May 14, 2008 (UTC).

For a second there I misinterpreted what you meant by watch children. --Kakarot 22:45, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Bad Kakarot. At least now we know what your imagination is inclined to... Backsword 16:40, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

GW Store Broken?

Anyone notice that the In-Game Guild Wars Store is Broken? 159.153.129.39 14:12, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

What do you mean by "broken"? --Master Fast 23:02, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

The free stuff isn't there anymore. :( Drago 04:48, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

Something was free? <.< — Poki#3 14:21, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

To my knowledge there shouldn't be any free items in the Guild Wars In-Game store. Maybe you're thinking of the PlayNC Store? They carry a couple of items that are free to download. -Kim Chase 20:29, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

June 12 Update

A little bird (namely, top level guilds) tells me that today's the day A.Rage and Splinter finally bite the dust. Fact or fiction? Also, how do top level guilds always know about the skill updates before the rest of the community (and therefore gain the ability to adapt before the rest of us do)? I realize ANet plays favorites, but seriously.24.116.45.1 14:03, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Nothing like a good ol' conspiracy theory to start the day off. ;) Kokuou 14:12, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

[1] 62.3.32.27 14:44, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Most likely a real update, seeing as half the people I've talked to say it's real. BTW Hundred Blades is now fucking awesome. Antiarchangel TROLL 14:49, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

So, are we finally getting Ursan nerfed? Erasculio 14:49, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Click the link, no Ursan nerf, unless it doesn't include PvE only skills Antiarchangel TROLL 14:51, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Random Conjure + SoH + 100 Blades = 3..2..1..SPIKED xD Fox007 14:54, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

Errr, excuse my candor, 100 blades has been changed?...

nope O.o i lurve 3x hit blades maybe izzy found it overpowerd when he saw our thoughts xD Fox007 12:07, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Top level guilds know when things are going to be changed because they're the ones teaching Izzy how to balance the game via forums. Izzy has a private forum somewhere where a few handpicked players can post balance proposals (read: teach Izzy how to do his job). -- Armond Warblade 16:39, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

at least he's not above taking suggestions. the game would be completely dead if he was deaf to players' concerns. instead the game is only mostly dead in waiting for gw2. --VVong|BA 17:53, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Typical. Give him trouble for being stubbord (i.e. not taking advice) AND for being incompetent (i.e. taking advice). Either way, he's doomed. Meanwhile, I think that GW has a very high standards of balance, and much of which thanks to Izzy. -- Alaris 20:46, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Layout

I feel we should make the layout of this page like [2] as its better designed. Dominator Matrix 01:28, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

It's a box. With a nice colorful header. It's fine as is imo. It gives the info in a clean, efficient manner. No need for unnecessary bells and whistles. Calor 01:30, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

RAVEN AND WOLF

Please add more effectiveness towards these two blessings. Ursan is the most capable, I do not wish to request nerfs, but the other two aspects are heavily incomparable in usefulness and efficiency. Possibly bufffing the recharge or skill effects and making them cost 1 energy? Just a suggestion.

For the people whining, its basically you being graced by the greater Norn spirits. What make you think an ephemeral blessing from a legendary creature is going to be weak? Congratulations on not paying attention to the storyline, whiners. Phill Gaston 19:07, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

First off, please sign your comments, Phill Gaston. Secondly, how can you not say Ursan is not overpowered? Anything that makes pve that easy is broken. It does not matter that you are imbued with some godlike spiritual essence, it should be balanced to meet the other skills' power, pve or not. Kelvin Greyheart 15:05, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

Gaddamnit, how do you people find me?

Clumsiness/kite > Ursan. Nuff Said. D: Phill Gaston 19:07, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

What is true is that Raven and Wolf as not as used as Ursan. Each blessing should be used 33.33% of the times a 'portable blessing' is used. MithTalk 19:10, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

@Phill: Clumsiness doesn't really affect ursan at all, as it uses skills, not attacks. And as for kiting, you have a contant IMS and an AoE knockdown. Plus, monsters are stupid. ¬ Wizårdbõÿ777(talk) 23:52, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

Only one note to the above: AoE knockdown is not that helpful for avoiding kitting when the range is "adjacent", and monsters are not that stupid since they just start running as soon as you hit the knockdown button, so they avoid it 9 out of 10 times in open spaces (specially if they are healers). I would pay for having a good Cripple or Dazed effect in any of these forms, actually. Oh, and 2x Diversion >> UB.--Fighterdoken 23:57, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

Only if the Ursan is stupid enough to skill through the Diversions. Not that there's that much diversion... pretty much anywhere, really. -- Armond Warblade 00:30, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

spammable 150 damage x 6 in a well synced team dominates anything though :\ 58.179.73.202 20:32, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

No update this week?

I though there was supposed an update every 2 weeks. What happened? --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Phill Gaston (talk).

Well guild wars 2, and holidays...really. Dominator Matrix 06:00, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

that, and no one stated that there would be an update every 2 weeks. (Terra Xin 06:10, 28 June 2008 (UTC))

GW has many times gone way past the 2 week "rule". Theres no reason to have a update every 2 weeks...but it would be nice. Dominator Matrix 06:17, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

It happens traditionally. and I do recall one of the GWiki Mods speaking of skill balances weekly. Just gotta find it. Phill Gaston 22:00, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

I remember them talking about having skill updates after every monthly tournament, and with the new division of PvP and PvE skills they're expected to occur more frequently, but then lessen as more balances are released. (Terra Xin 03:54, 29 June 2008 (UTC))

If they dont get this ni the next update, Im quitting GW. I swear.

Im gonna say these slow so Anet doesn't miss it. AVATAR. OF. GRENTH. DOESN'T. DEAL. COLD. DAMAGE.

Saw it? Good. It current state pales in comparison to all other avatars, and its broken (in a bad way!) to boot. Please fix this so people can at least use conjure with this mofacker, eh? At first I thought i came up with something cool because i thought I could use conjure w/ a sundering mods, and figure that would own and it would have a blessing in disguise. but no, it doesn't work.

But no, Anet. Fail. Fail to Oblivion. And close the gate on your way there.(Inside Joke?) ((Edited)) Suggestion- Not really asking to be considered. Oh yeah, possibly add some bonus dmg against enchanted foes, if you thing that would be fair. nothing big, maybe +10 at 15. Fix Wounding strike while your at it, make deep wound trigger only if they have one enchant derv enchant on them. (not two, not three, ONE.) Ma

Can someone PLEASE tell me how to make a wishlist? o____o --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Phill Gaston (talk).

You want User:Phill Gaston/Skill changes. Also, no, Grenth doesn't need to be made viable again. -- Armond Warblade 12:22, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

So should we cry you or something in case it's not fixed? --MageMontu 13:05, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

@Armond TY, and Every skill should be useful in gameplay, especially Elites. IF an Elite isn't being used by anyone the whole community, then either it isn't fit for use, or sucks. Just saying. D: --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Phill Gaston (talk).

Please sign your comment by placing ~~~~ at the end of your comment --MageMontu 23:07, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

So, err, quitting GW? Hope you enjoyed your time playing... Calor 23:08, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Teleportation nerfs and major skill "balancing" in general

I was deeply disappointed today, when I came home from vacation to find that most of the shadow stepping skills were rendered pretty much useless for surprise spikes and to close in on distant foes. Previous updates that dramatically changed the game have pissed me off pretty bad, but nothing like this. I'm sure I am not alone when I say that Anet just took out one of my favorite sets of skills in the game. Anet's reasoning appears to be that tele-melee is too powerful and that this nerf will offer opposing monks some reaction time. Well that is just totally pathetic, monks should not be the answer to everything in the game, and are overly capable in tipping the scales already, with the WOH changes. In addition, tele spikers typically have bars dedicated to SPIKING to make full use of the long recharging shadow stepping skill.. which means they have little to no defensive skills. Trade-offs like this is what makes Guildwars great, and it is why I play the game as opposed to some others such as WOW. As a G5/R6 who doesn't have the time for dedicated GVG, theres pretty much nothing left in the game that interests me. I don't understand why Anet continually dumbs down the game to a point were everyone will have to use a balanced build and just hit each other until one falls dead, but I guess I'll never find out because I'm quitting, and I don't think I'll be getting GW2 so I can put up with these "balances" again either. --BZ 18:14, 16 July 2008 (UTC)

Where is my meta/balance update?

I've been patiently waiting for months for a big skill change. The current meta game wants me to crack my keyboard over the developer/balancers heads. Overpowered weapon sets run rampant, blinding signets show no pause, gimmick combos and teams reign supreme and for some ungodly reason its been this way for months. Why? Why must the player base be subjected to this (not just this, these are only examples)? Do the staff just not care? Do they even play? I'm sure they have some record of the most used skills on skill bars, that might be a good place to start from. However I still see no change, nothing whatsoever.

With this pvp only skill system (of which I call a cop out, but jesus christ team at least use it) the developers should have a very VERY easy time making changes. The last major update only have one skill of which I could see some merit behind (recharge on strength and honor) but even that didn't stop it from staying in use. You might say something about signet of judgment but if was only changed due to heavy overuseage and is not in use anymore If you want some tips on what skills to change then here is a pro secret: look at every skill from this page thats listed as being great: [3] and do something about them. Not every bar, every skill.

An example of something that took way to long: Changing chilling victory to wind prayers, this skill has been a core for many dervish bars since the first few days of the nightfall release, and you change it now?

Something a vast majority of players see is Ranger love from the dev team, thats not good policy be it true or not. Also this "arena net interaction portal" was a good idea, if only we had proof that it gets read at all! Suggestions are in place for many skills under that section, yet we don't see anything implemented. Failure for shock at air magic 4 or less (just an example)? Sounds simple but we get nothing.

I'll put it simply, the game is basically broken. Either you run a few specific skills per class or you spend half a battle on the ground. I was under the impression that this games name was guild wars, not build wars. I know a pve update is on the way but were is my pvp update? I play half and half pve and pvp, while I enjoy a good monster stomp I can't exactly get faction from monsters can I? (excluding from certain areas under certain conditions). I don't enjoy playing pvp and being about to tell in about 3 seconds exactly what someone is running 95% of the time just from looking at them. Guild Wars has over 1200 skills, at least half of these should be present and in use by a majority, rather we have around 150-200 skills used over and over again.

Basically, give us and update (and a very large one please) in regards to player versus player or guild wars will lose more and more players. 69.247.22.37 03:19, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

It was moved to Wind prayers because of the r/d scythe dervish.However this was a very bad update as it didnt nerf the wounding strike at all.Even worse it didnt nerf the r/d but it DID nerf all the other "balanaced" builds (in as far as a derv can get balanced).The problem is that izzy often sees a build is OP and then starts thinking about how to fix it but comes out with WRONG IDEAS.Then because of this you still have a broken skill (of like 50 atleast) but you killed some skills in the meantime.For example the lightning orb with cracked armor was a great idea but was deemed to OP.He did NOT restore damage.Same with healparty.Izzy should clean up a bit and FFS READ his own page he has barely seen anything on it wich is quite obvious when you check his updates.Lilondra 07:27, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

A good friend of mine said that there was supposed to be a massive PvE update soon. Does anybody know when this is supposed to come?PvE Champion 02:26, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

It was mentioned in the July 10th developer update. It's due to be released in August at the earliest. -- Gordon Ecker 07:42, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

Thats all well and good, but pvp is a more pressing concern, mainly due to how the majority of the player base don't go pve that much as they did before. Then again if it took them this long to understand what ursan did to pve then just imagine how high they have to be all the time, or something 69.247.22.37 03:00, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Where did you get that statistic from? -- Gordon Ecker 03:43, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Statistics like that usually come from out of there arse! T1Cybernetic 08:16, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Your balance is coming this wed-thurs.

Be patient, this isnt going to make the Anet employees want or try to complete it faster. Phill Gaston 08:26, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

At the earliest. According the the update "Depending on how testing goes, some or all of these changes may be released as soon as next month.". In other words, if testing doesn't go well, we may not see any of these changes until some time after the end of August. -- Gordon Ecker 09:04, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

There are 1200 skills, and only 400 are used. Go A-net.

ANY WHO, the metagame is fine, Sway is fair, Escape is balanced, and wounding is the shat. That was the best elite Anet ever fixed. They shouldn't have nerfed sunder/penetrating attack, though, they were that good how they were. and the fact they nerfs MoR was reason enough to leave SoJ alone. they really need to buff Searing flames, though =< Phill Gaston 00:23, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

Wow, that was rather epic... Buffing SF is like making PS/SH/SoA reduce Life Steal. --Viper 00:26, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

They should. Wacth yourself too. Phill Gaston 01:00, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

Phill I hear ya, but being patient for months takes its toll. Basically I'm saying they should had made tons of chances since the pvp only skill update yet we have less than before this change. 69.247.22.37 02:34, 29 July 2008 (UTC)