Talk:Flux

Commentary on Flux

So, basically, it's just research so they know what builds are overpowered? It's really not that hard to tell. –~=Ϛρѧякγ (τѧιк) ←♥– 01:03, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

No, each month a new environmental effect is put into certain PvP formats to mix things up a bit. This month is Lone Wolf. It's not research. -- Konig/talk 01:25, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

(this one was before your message but it never posted) Perhaps. I was thinking it was more of forcing metas and new builds for CMs. If Flux disadvantages the best builds in CMs (and I mainly play CM, the best builds have been stagnant for A LONG TIME), then people should change so they aren't weak. Anyways I think if they balance skills on it, they are going down a slippery slope... skills shouldn't be balanced due to Flux because that action assumes that Flux is available everywhere, therefore balancing a skill for Flux would likely make it weak where there is no Flux. I go back to it again and again: when something is too powerful or ridiculous in ONE place, balance it ONLY for that area. Expand (PvP) > (Arena name) only when critically necessary. Previously Unsigned 01:29, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

"The introduction of Flux is a compelling tool to help us keep our competitive formats dynamic, while allowing us to further balance the game. Because slight shifts in the meta are expected from Flux to Flux, it allows us to better target overly problematic builds. If powerful builds can thrive in environments that are not suited to them, we can review the skills to bring them more into line. We want to encourage gameplay where the team that wins does so because they've played more skillfully."

"The Flux system is the precursor to several improvements that will be coming in a PvP-specific update. We'll be taking a look at improving some titles, the incentives to play, the rewards for various formats, and more."

I don't know why they can't just slightly nerf the powerful builds instead of targeting them once a month with a temporary effect, to only nerf them if the effect didn't remove it from play. Sure, it attempts to mix things up, but after the meta is targeted, it will go back to the same meta next month and continue as if almost nothing happened or just literal FOTM. –~=Ϛρѧякγ (τѧιк) ←♥– 01:55, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

You're apparently not getting it. This is not targeting builds at all. It is targeting how people play (e.g., strategy) not merely what they bring (note: It could effect builds brought and most likely will, but the Flux mechanic is more for how to play). It's not meant to be a nerf for powerful builds. Also, it's automatic unlike a monthly nerf would be. Also, I don't think it'll "go back to how it was" since the effects won't go away, merely change. This month you get a buff for being outside of earshot from allies, next month it may be, idk, extended conditions (I am literally making such up, don't assume that's a too-be-implemented effect). -- Konig/talk 02:02, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Just thought I'd add an opinion to the "Lone Wolf" effect you mentioned. Despite the 10% damage bonus, the 10% more damage taken is what makes it interesting. Forces the player to evaluate his/her playstyle and adjust accordingly when needed. I'm looking forward to the further Fluxes that'll come out :-) Donutdude 19:08, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

I think the idea is to alter the meta a small amount every month without changing the skills, so that it can easily be changed back (and take on a new effect). This way people will get less bored waiting for skill updates. At the same time, they hope to show up builds which remain powerful regardless of the flux; these are probably overpowered, since even minor nerfs from unfavourable flux effects don't make them unpopular. So, it's something to help them balance but at the same time be more interesting for us. Might end up being a bit of a gimmick, but could be pretty cool - I guess only time will tell. 86.147.7.94 08:23, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Just JQ and FA?

The article seems to suggest that only Competitive Missions (i.e. The Jade Quarry and Fort Aspenwood) are affected but is this true? --Combatter 01:29, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

What the hell!? I could have sworn it was not in RA, but I see the effect there too!. Previously Unsigned 01:41, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Where did folks get the idea that they meant competitive missions. Dev notes says competitive formats. Format!=Mission. Iirc, it should effect all PvP. -- Konig/talk 01:52, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Since outposts are also under this effect, I can state that guild halls, HA, Codex, RA, Zaishen Elite/Challenge, and the PvP form of the Isle of the Nameless are effected. My question would be if it effects Dragon Arena, Rollerbeetle, Snowball, and Costume Brawl. Most likely, Flux is mechanically tied to PvP (effect). -- Konig/talk 01:57, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

I can say for certain that the flux is not in effect in the Dragon Arena (not that it really matters there, though). 75.201.94.85 13:02, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Actually it would matter for use of Imperial Majesty. I saw the icon in the outpost but didn't bother going inside. -- Konig/talk 20:09, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Pretty sure it is in effect in Dragon Arena. 90.212.250.210 17:44, 1 May 2011 (UTC)

Anybody wanna extract the image from the DAT file?

I've never done that before, but we could use the icon to the right of the article. Previously Unsigned 06:33, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

There's no icon for Flux, just the various kinds (e.g., Lone Wolf). -- Konig/talk 20:09, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Flux itself is not a skill or an effect. It's more like a 'type' of environmental effect, and lore explanation of a mechanic. MithTalk 22:43, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

This mean we can get the images from the next few months??!?!?! ~Nelson (n122333)

That's what I was talking about! I was thinking the icon for Flux would not change... I mean look at the current one. It looks like a flux, not a lone wolf at all. My guess is that the icon will stay the same, just the text will change. Previously Unsigned 03:56, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

Ehh, i don't think thats a good move on ANETS part-to hard to (for the newbs) to tell when it changes. ~Nelson (n122333)

It's a good move. Only those that bother to read will notice the change. People should read more. I find every day people that use their skills without actually knowing exactly what they do. And sometimes they even ask other players instead reading the skill description! It's true that some descriptions are not very clear, but most are. People should read. MithTalk 13:01, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

But how will i know when to check it? I would like a slight change so i can say "Ohh... New flux, lets read it." ~Nelson (n122333)

You can check anytime after a new month comes, all you have to do is hover over the icon. If it's different than the last thing, it changed. No one will charge you for hovering the mouse over a icon and reading a short phrase after the last update. MithTalk 13:20, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

See, the icon DOESN'T change. Only the effect. It made sense then because it was so obvious. I like that happening. Now to wonder where to stick the icon in the article. Previously Unsigned 02:06, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Unnecessary Convolution

Headline pretty much says it all. I get the appeal in a way. GW should be a game with strategy (strategy being what you do to plan for the challenge, tactics being how you handle the moment to moment changes in the challenge). So I'm not sure why this sounds so unappealing to me. Maybe because CA (which also theoretically helps one have to be involved in build design) failed so bad (by failed I mean there weren't enough people playing.... one of my favorite PvP types on the rare occasion there were a decent number of different opponents to play). Maybe because I still don't like things being unique to PvP vs PvE. Maybe because I know this will make it harder for the casual player to be competitive (unless they only PvP the first day of the new Flux). Maybe because ...see headline. Anyways, an idea with merit, sure, but "things that make me go ...ewww (doesn't mean my "police-instincts-gut-feeling" is right by any means). --Mooseyfate 16:10, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

Ya.. I think CA needed more rewards, (200 factions+ a kill?) ~Nelson (n122333)

Rewards aren't the answer -- I might play it for the faction, but it'd still be a bore for a player like myself. Codex Arena was stupid in my opinion just based on the fact that it didn't have a static set of skills -- there's no room to play "your way" when your skillset is changing perpetually.

It'd be an improvement, I think, if they had laid out a subset of skills which were always playable, and were specifically designed to be balanced and then, if randomness is really necessary, add in some random skills each time span to spice it up. I might not be able to play competitively relying on only the static skills, but at least I could play the stupid game the way I want to, even with some limits. There's no fun for me in winning (or losing for that matter) either with a build copied off the internet, or just "dealt" to me randomly. --Kite 02:12, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

I think the biggest flaw of Codes Arena was the immense amount of limitations and restrictions placed on players. Firstly, it was not random, therefore cutting out the people who just like to go in and play and those who don't have PvP buddies (be it via friend list, guild, or alliance). Secondly, as Kite said, the constantly changed skills made it bothersome since every day you had to go with something else - if it changed weekly or monthly, it may be a different story rather than daily. Finally there was the 1 profession per team, limiting who you can take when you're forming a team if you fall into the first issue. I'm sure there's more I don't list, but rewards isn't the sole issue - those who think it is are just conditioned by video games via the Skinner Box scenario (something I hope slows down in video games but most likely won't, especially subscription games). -- Konig/talk 02:34, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Tbh Konig most of those things you complain about were implemented specifically to add balance to the arena that other arenas lacked, and to fix some of the problems Team Arenas had (i.e., people running 3 monks). The "point" of Codex was to imitate sealed deck play, where you were dealt a shitty list of skills and did the best with what you had - in lieu of letting you pick from a randomly populated tiered skills list, they simply forced it to change every X hours (a subpar solution, but then the entire arena was a subpar solution, so I guess it fits).

There are definitely flaws with it, but Codex wasn't supposed to be exactly like Random Arenas. -Auron 02:49, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Auron, I wasn't meaning that those were poor design actions, rather I meant that from a casual player's perspective (perhaps even a hardcore PvP'ers), those make the format less appealing - that it isn't merely the lack of interesting rewards. -- Konig/talk 02:56, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Personally, I'd play CA if it was random teams. I don't know 3 people who want to play it with me, and I don't have the ranks to get onto the few teams that form there. Manifold 03:10, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

I feel that's the case for most people. Those that want teams go to HA or GvG. Those that do not want to wait to form a team go to RA, and CA is left alone. MithTalk 13:49, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

So much ^this^ and what Konig says. It started off with 9 districts when it went live then dropped to 1 in 2 days b/c the MATCHING SYSTEM WAS SHIT. There's no other "AH HA" moment to be observed about the way it's set up or the skill choice limitations or the poor UI. Contributing factors those may be...they sure didn't hurt Costume Brawl which was even more limited. Why? B/c No one wants to spend every minute getting PuGstomped by Rank-Snobs or oraganized smurfers (guild teams) all on Vent together. The worst part was Linsey told us they'd change the matching system or atleast allow a random ladder but they never followed through on it. --ilr 23:08, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

But you know what the best part about codex is? You can match manipulate your way to max codex by getting together a group to take turns /resign ing since noone is there to interfere! Zencow 09:00, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

Yeh and then you get banned beacuse manipulation of matches =( so no is no good idea--Ivy Thunder Goddess 17:13, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

When does it change?

as above when does it change will it be towards the start of each month or at the end of the month just as Lone wolf was? 82.22.107.194 13:38, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Probably the beginning of the month so players have a chance to get used to the effect. The end of the month timing was probably just a coincidence due to where the update fell. -- FreedomBound 13:42, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

It will probably change after the MAT --Riddle 06:46, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Since there was no update to add it.

Maybe .dat miner can go check the next few fluxes, if they are put in already? Sennar talk 22:38, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

spoilers, they're all there, if the source is trustworthy, I don't know. udas 22:55, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

I checked the history of that guru user, and I don't think user is really trustworthy (not syaing he isn't though), but we'll know tomorrow anyway.^^^^

Lookg like a heap of bullshit to me 82.176.8.4 09:02, 31 July 2011 (UTC)

There Can Only Be One is actually a decent Flux, it changes the targetting priority and makes things like Smiters theoretically viable (though nobody's been using them anyway - I guess even a +30% boost can't remove the stygma of ages). Hopefully tomorrow's will be likewise interesting; Lone Wolf wasn't much use since it generally had an effect based on arenas, perhaps on splitting in GvG, and Unyeilding Spirit only really meant killing the frontline first was a bad idea, which it generally is anyway (and it had no effect on CMs and AB). 86.27.42.158 15:14, 31 July 2011 (UTC)

Current flux

We are suffering hard in AB with the new one :). For the moment. "Your movement speed is increased by 15%, and you lose 10 health per second while moving any faster". Yseron - 90.48.130.184 00:30, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

Peeps Are killing themselves in outposts with sugar rush now- i can't upload a screen for some reason but yeah 64.231.5.146 00:55, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

Order: alpha or chrono

The flux list is long enough now that I think the default order should be alphabetical:

• Alphabetical is the default sort order across the wiki, in the absence of a compelling other principle (e.g. profession order).
• Other articles consider when something was introduced to be an item for the Trivia section.
• It's easier to read something sorted in alpha-order.
• There's no particular advantage to chrono order.
• The columns are sortable, in the event someone wishes to see the effects in chronological order.

– Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 20:05, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

I'd suggest a chronological order with the current flux highlighted, but after the full cycle is complete. Sort of like the event cycle. Of course, this depends on whether the flux is yearly or not. I'd suggest highlighting the current flux in any case. Reverse chronological order seems counter-intuitive to me if it's not highlighted. udas 21:53, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

+1 for chronological. --The Holy Dragons 22:01, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Time is clearly more important in this case. Much as with the Zaishen quests, Nicholas items, client updates and other sequential events, they must be sorted in order of appearance. Them being monthly is a rather important part of their nature. And the table has that neat arrows to sort them if people want to see them alphabetically anyways. MithTalk 23:05, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

January 2012 = no flux?

No Flux appears to be currently in effect for January 2012. PS: Happy New Year! --Combatter 00:34, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Happy doomsday year and ofc no new flux, let them enjoy new year a bit. Da Mystic Reaper 00:50, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

ArenaNet's offices are in Washington, USA so the servers operate off of PST (-8:00) where it is not quite January 1st yet. I'm sure they've got everything setup and since they don't need to roll out an update to start the new Flux, we'll see it pop up sometime tomorrow (their time). ~FarloTalk 01:18, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Two and a half more hours at the time of this post. :) [ Tyloric ] [ Talk ] 05:34, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

I doubt it'll come into effect at midnight, probably a few hours into the work day tomorrow, but who knows, I guess it depends on how automated it is. ~FarloTalk 06:26, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

It automatically changes at midnight UTC. The fact that there's no flux now means the new one hasn't been added or isn't working. 24.197.253.243 06:54, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

A new flux, Xinrae's Revenge, was supposedly added to the Gw.dat (the user that created that page also created the Minion Apocalypse and Hidden Talent pages before they were active in-game). So either the new Flux isn't working or there's not going to be any Flux at all this month (i.e. back to PvPing prior to the Flux being introduced). --Silver Edge 07:27, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

The Main Page currently reads "Flux: None". Is this official? --Combatter 12:46, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

Official or not, there's no active Flux atm. (It's possible ANet always intended for the Flux to change on the 2nd, but then again, they might have seeded the date at Jan 2011 instead of Jan 2012 or... well, lots of possible reasons it's not available right now). – Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 21:56, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

It just sucks that everyone's too hung over from last night to bother fixing it :P ~FarloTalk 23:00, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

thought tht maybe it hasnt been added yet cause it would cause havok to snowballing, 1 person uses fort everyone else on both sides cant use it for example, i think it will start when festival is over.Spark-TBa 11:19, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

(Reset indent) John Foreman has confirmed that the January flux's non-appearance is unintended, i.e. it's borked. They are looking into it. – Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 21:13, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

While doomsday is happening at the end of the this year, this is one of the many ripples leading up to it. Previously Unsigned 21:30, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

can't wait for the next flux

monks having hard time uno. 145.116.127.223 11:08, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Next up: if you equip 2 elites, you have -1 to attributes and to health/energy regen? 98.196.144.194 00:42, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

How about for every empty skill slot you gain +2 armor? --Combatter 09:20, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

+2 armor wouldn't be enough to make an empty skill slot worth it. +10 armor, in my opinion, would. OutlawJoe 01:48, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Hm I thought about the same kind of stuff, even though it would resemble this flux too much. I think +10 Armor wouldn't even be enough. It would have to be something like +10% Damage and +1 to all attributes.--DIVA 12:28, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

Frenzy Rush Bull's Dismember lol I do +40% damage.

The midline assisting on the spike would be a bunch of eles with one skill each. — Raine Valen 19:18, 26 Mar 2012 (UTC)

Diversion, PD, general rupts, Arcane Thievery = gg on ur 1 skill eles.--DIVA 14:15, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

March 31 flux?

i logged on into jq and the flux icon is there but all it says is "... ..." i know this months flux should be "the meek shall inherit, but whats up with the icon?

The April Flux has already started, the March flux is over. Apparently, they have got to do some fixing. InfestedHydralisk 01:19, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

From what I've heard in-game, if you're In The Area of an ally, you have 5% reduction for your skills' recharge time per ally. OutlawJoe 01:21, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

April fools flux? Roland Of Ka Tet 03:42, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

From Live Team QA member John Foreman: "it reduces skill recharge by 5% for each other ally in the area." --Silver Edge 04:22, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

May Flux?

Something seems to be in effect already. My stats in JQ are differing. Chaos Storm is hitting for different amounts than the normal 26 damage. Sometimes hitting for 25, 27 and other times 23. Darwin Iznang 00:32, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Noticed this too, with wastrels. WW hits for either 100 or 104, when it should be considering what it says, 95. --94.193.44.129 00:38, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

It's currently not working as intended Manifold 01:06, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Currently, it seems to be +5% damage for each other (flux affected) ally within earshot and −5% damage for each (flux affected) enemy. Percentages are calculated additively. -- 01:13, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

I guess we can assume from this that Fluxes are not repeating, or at least not yet. Darwin Iznang 01:44, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Was hoping May would have "Beastly Brothers in Arms: for every pet skill equiped you and your pet do +5% damage." --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 98.161.5.111 (talk).

May 2012 "..." Flux

As far as i discovered this flux is not a bug, but a secret gift. One gets doubled gladiator and balthazar points. Can someone confirm that? I added a wiki page for it .... --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 46.5.100.29 (talk) at 20:46, 1 May 2012 (UTC).

The double gladiator and balthazar is due to the 7th year anniversary celebration. Anything without a name loaded into the game appears as "..." - your page will be moved to the correct location when they reveal the new name. File:User Chieftain Alex Chieftain Signature.jpg Chieftain Alex 19:49, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

This just proves that they don't test their shit. OP eles anyone? Stabby 21:12, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

I think the flux is on hold till after birthday celebration so it doesn't interfere with dragon arena and beetle racing, happened at Christmas I believe. Spark-TBa.31.100.252.152 06:41, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

They do test, sometimes mishaps are unavoidable be patient and enjoy a bit of no flux until it's fixed, also Ele's (like everyone in PvP) are balanced towards GvG/HA (where they are fine atm, in my experience... ) and NOT RA, cuz lets be honest who cares about ra (except those soupur srs types, of whom make me giggle!) -RaGeZorz99 10:57, 2 May 2012 (UTC) P.s. for your reference [1]<- Isaiah's explaination for imbalances (he is referencing GW2, but his explainations relate directly to his experiences learned from gw1)

Are we certain Lone Wolf is not in effect? Any way to test the 10%? Roland Of Ka Tet 19:53, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

Of course you can test it, but it is not in effect. See my comment in the section above. -- 22:12, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

Repeated Flux

They repeated Minion Apocalypse, perhaps a start towards not wanting to work on new and unique PvP bonuses each month? --67.6.37.143 20:01, 28 October 2012 (PDT)

Might also just be a Halloween thing. Maybe. — Raine Valen 23:49, 31 Oct 2012 (UTC)

As it can be concluded from the table, the fluxes are rotated in annual cycle since July 2012. But this is not mentioned anywhere in the article, even as an assumption. --95.165.198.226 14:09, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

I've noted it in the article. The Flux was probably put in a 12-month rotation in the May 16, 2013 update, where everything became automated and the time of the Flux change was altered. --Silver Edge 05:23, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

Tables redundance

Why do we have two lists now? Yoshida Keiji (talk) 15:12, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Dunno, but I agree - the icons are entirely redundant and having two tables in a row is pretty poor. We could perhaps move the descriptions to be in the same row as the flux name on the top table?

Or alternatively, make the second table collapsible. --Chieftain Alex 18:35, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Merge both by replacing the "Icon" column for "Month in effect"? With the exception of Minion Apocalypse which could have a bottom note. Yoshida Keiji (talk) 09:36, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Revisited

Ok, do we need the DPL table at all? It currently displays 2 fluxes - the current one and Minion Apocalypse. I think it would be alright to add the descriptions manually to the first table and delete the second. thoughts? -Chieftain Alex 23:25, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

I'm okay with or without the descriptions. --Silver Edge 04:46, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

PvXwiki

The "evaluation of the impact" of Flux on the meta at PvXwiki's page is outdated; stupid edit lockout. ^_^ --Falconeye 07:07, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

might as well remove the link to it, the days of PvX offering insight on flux are long gone. -Chieftain Alex 11:37, 13 April 2013 (UTC)