Talk:Defender of Ascalon/Archive 1

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It appears that all of the copyright violations were added by just one user. If we remove those contributions, and revert to the version before all of his edits, we should be fine with the copyright thing. --User:AlbinobirdAlbinobird 01:04, 29 March 2007 (EDT)

Done. :) --Rainith 01:07, 29 March 2007 (EDT)
Alright, I wasn't sure what to do, since the copyright violation thing says not to edit the page. --User:AlbinobirdAlbinobird 01:15, 29 March 2007 (EDT)
In a situation like that you can contact one of the admins and tell them that a previous edit was okay and they can do what I just did. If you want just leave a note on my talk page and I'll take care of it when I see it. :) --Rainith 01:56, 29 March 2007 (EDT)
Rainith, I think you might be having a wee bit too much fun deleting stuff. That surely can't be healthy. :P --Dirigible 02:02, 29 March 2007 (EDT)

Naming the page

Isn't this LEGENDARY Defender of Ascalon? 09:24, 30 March 2007 (EDT)

yes it is. i can post a screenshot of the title progress bar if you need it.Dread Pirate Fargus 12:18, 3 April 2007 (EDT)
The trek name is Defender of Ascalon. The title name is Legendary Defender of Ascalon. Go look for a page titled Cartographer, and then try to find one titled "Elonian Grandmaster Cartographer". Armond 01:54, 17 April 2007 (EDT)
I would agree, accept this title only has one level. As soon as you get it, its maxed. I think it should be refered to as the Ledgendary Defender of Ascalon. LeFick 20:13, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
Roll your mouse over the description in your hero window first. What about protector/defender/vanquisher titles? Armond 09:43, 17 October 2007 (UTC)


Hey, guess what? You can get both titles. Just level up to level 16 then do all the quests (EVERY SINGLE ONE). The expierience in the quests will be enough to level you for those last 5 levels. IT IS POSSIBLE TO GET DEFENDER OF ASCALON WIHTOUT DEATH LEVELING!! ArenaNet wouldn't make it so that we couldn't get both titles, that would be unfair to players. 16:59, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

Doing every single quest, including all the secondaries, would amount for between 10.000 and 14.000 exp (give or take), which may be barely enough for some primary classes to go from level 19 to level 20. The experience for all the quests at level 16 would leave you at 17 plus 10% maybe, so in no way is enough for getting the title without death leveling, no matter how much caps you put into it.--Fighterdoken 17:30, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
So I guess it is unfair to players - at least by your definition of fairness. It's fair though that players who don't go for LDoA, for example if they make a char in Factions or NF or if they choose to exit pre-searing, have a different title they can try for, which is mutually exclusive. What would be unfair would be the ability to get both. Alaris 18:31, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

No, you can't gain survivor just by gaining the experience without dying. 1, it'd be a lot easier that way. 2, it specifically states by reaching level 20 without dying, not by gaining so much experience. Armond 18:06, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

Would it be possible to get both this and survivor by having an accomplice death level a monster? Or do monsters not level unless a party is wiped? 11:46, 20 April 2007 (EDT)
You can't have a party member death level monsters because there's no hard res skill in pre. HeWhoIsPale 11:57, 20 April 2007 (EDT)
What about ressurecting a pet repeatedly? --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).
Can't. Pet only gives exp the first time it dies.--Fighterdoken 02:49, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
  • 1. Getting Legendary Survivor employs reach a certain amount of experience without death
  • reaching lvl 20 without death is equivalent to the first portion of the title "Survivor"
  • reaching lvl 20 is the certain xp for survivor, not legendary survivor
  • This is not flaming, simply truth

(Mortix 18:43, 6 May 2007 (EDT))

i CAN DO IT it just takes like years --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: .

Actually, there is a way to do this. It is possible however the method is so unorthodox and haphazard that it might as well be impossible. This method being, having a 'death leveling partner' who will death level the monsters for you. However that alone is not the trick. The trick to it being that the character you want to reach Defender and NOT die be lagged considerably. Limiting the bandwidth of the computer and connection that you use to get on that character with, once the two of you party and zone out your friend will have a good amount of time (depending on your connection, limitation of bandwidth, etc) to death level. Since you will not have fully loaded (since you are intentionally lagging yourself), he will resurrect whenever he dies. Once the monsters are leveled, he can leave (or stay) and allow you to kill them for the boosted exp. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: .
As I said, this method is highly haphazard, and would take an ungodly amount of time for two people to accomplish. Though, you could just simply use two computers and two seperate accounts. As I said, possible, HIGHLY unlikely, might as well be impossible. You'd really have to know what you're doing to accomplish it and most players probably wouldn't. -- Anonymous
Let's stick to the humanly possible, without hacks or abuses please. Alaris 05:03, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
It IS humanly possible and there is no mention of hacking or abusing. There are numberous ways to intentionally lag yourself. Its just so tedious that no ones likely to do it. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: .
Umm... it is abuse. This is what is usually termed as an exploit. -- sig 09:09, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Whats the exploit? You load slower so the person you party with will resurrect. There is no tampering with the game or its system, or any relating files. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: .
You're tampering with connection speed, which interferes with the normal functioning of the game. So ya, it is an exploit. Alaris 14:30, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
This whole title is an exploit, so if Anet encourage me to use them, why i should't? -- 02:18, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
The thing is, you could lag for max 15 mins maybe before your session is killed by the server and you are forced to go back to the city. In those 15 minutes, the other player would have hardly gotten more than 2 groups of charrs to the shrine, and would have been unable to level even a shaman. You would need to "lag" at least 3 hours before being able to gain any experience, which is unlikely to happend without being kicked by the server first. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: .
An abuse or exploit does not require any hacking or tampering or editing. An exploit is basically taking advantage of how something works in a way in which it was neither intended for nor designed for. Taking advantage of the lag and reconnect is exploiting. Bear in mind that I'm not judging whether this is right or wrong, I'm just defining it. -- sig 01:27, 20 September 2007 (UTC)
I know it's late..but couldnt you (survivor/LDoA attempting) be a character with a reusable rez, and have a partner that gets to be the chew toy and death level by being killed, rezzed by you, killed, rezzed by you, killed, rezzed by you, so that you don't die, but your faithful companion does for you? And eventually you, deathless, kill Charr for experience. Maybe I totally missed something, but it seems possible. Calor - talk 23:38, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
Oi, just checked, no hard rez in pre. I thought resurrect came in pre, guess it doesn't. Oh well, forget it then. Calor - talk 23:41, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
By using something in a way it isn't meant to be used: you mean just like the scarab on Dunes of Despair? People in factions owning that place that lets you get behind gaurds? What if somebody's connection is normally crap, he would have to lag like that (though I doubt anybody's connection would be that severe.) There are many things in the game that could be considered exploits but aren't, and connection lag, in my opinion, is one of them. Freke 01:25, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
On how to sign, take a look at GWW:SIGN or the "Please note:" part that's below every "Save page" button. -- sig 01:16, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
Give it up people! I really don't see how connection lag can reliably reset your character so others can be ressurected, all the while not getting you killed during the lag or getting ANet to ban you. But if you actually did it, you'd have to actually do something really fishy to your network to make it happen, and THAT is an exploit. Alaris 15:19, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Im sorry if this is crap but it might work. You know how if you get dc'd by guild wars some how(like ur internet shuts down or something), if this does happen to you, Guild Wars gives you the opertunity to rejoin ur game. What if you were to go out with a friend and let him do the death lvling thing. Once they are the required lvl, you rejoin Guild Wars and kill the monsters. Would that work?

That's hacking, i.e. deliberately messing with your internet connection to exploit the game. As I said in the comment above yours BTW. -- Alaris_sig Alaris 15:11, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Ok, maybe someone mentioned this idea allready, but isn't it possible to have a partner who has before deathleveled a pet up to lvl 20, then charmed it. The partner has either vampiric weapon(if that's possible in pre sear) or is N/R or R/N so that he can kill himself, and let me, the survivor, kill his lvl 20 pet. shouldn't that work? and should be pretty fast too. Prince Godrik 18:39, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Nope. There is just a single one-access-only pvp zone in Pre, and it's a 4v4 limited map, which wouldn't allow you to get enough exp for leveling. And no, you can't DC'trick it, because losing the connection sends you to the stage two of that mission (PvE) instead to a new pvp match.--Fighterdoken 19:10, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Ah, I just noticed that it's only minions, which leave no xp, and not pets who can turn hostile. but another idea was to death level an animal through my own animal. The easiest way should be to lock the 2 animals inside the Gate of the great nothern wall, and stand outside ressurecting your pet to 10% health each time it dies, to quickly level up the other animal inside. This might be a bit more complicated, if it works, but shouldn't go so much slower than regular Death leveling. However, I haven't tested it yet. Prince Godrik 18:09, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

Can't. Pets only give experience once.--Fighterdoken 17:40, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

Here's an idea I came up with recently, and I was curious to see if you peeps had any thoughts on the matter (and could poke any holes in the theory). Yes, use one character to do the death leveling while a second character stays out of aggro range. The important bit is, Resurrection Shrines, quote: "Resurrects the player and party when all characters capable of resurrecting other members have died". If neither character takes the Resurrection Signet with them, the dying person is automatically respawned at the res shrine. As far as cross-campaign fairness, my understanding of the title was that it was intended only for Prophecies characters. Non-flaming discuss, please? Jhaelle 20:09, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Can't. The "capable of resurrecting other members" phrase refers to heroes and henchmen only, not human players. You can't deathlevel NPCs while another person in the zone is waiting for the exp, because you will not respawn as long as that person is alive or still in the zone.--Fighterdoken 22:49, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
I see. Thank you for the clarification. Jhaelle 11:17, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Ok, I have 2 additional questions, Ressurection signet, does it recharge from boss kills in pre? I guess not. and, Pets give no xp when ressurected with comfort animal, Do they gain xp if ressurected in other way? Prince godrik 13:06, 13 June 2008 (UTC) Prince Godrik 14:05, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

To the first question, yes, it is recharged. But you must note that the zone with the highest amount of bosses is north of the wall, which means you would be able to use the signet 5 times. 5 times is not enough to level a single charr up to 15 (the minimum required for gathering exp for survivor or LDoA).
To the second question, i am not really sure. But in any case, the only "other" way of rezzing a pet in Pre is if everyone in your party dies (so you are rezzed at the shrine), and in that case you (or your partner) would be unable to go for survivor anymore.--Fighterdoken 18:19, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
Right, I just figured resing a dead guy does not res his pet, and can't make it give xp no more, what i was thinking was ofc to res a lvl 20 guy and his pet 5 times, to give 12 kills, although what is needed is like 34 kills for lvling from 10 to 11, and 10-13. I feel like giving up now that I now most ways are feeling, but before I leave this discussion, Great thanks to Fighterdoken for keeping good traack of this messy discussion, and helping everybody, (everyone asking the same questions over and over are the messy ones, not the replys by you:P) and second, I'd like to help the ones continuing this with a summary of all ways i found of gaining xp. A) the regular leveling up to lvl 16. a good tip is that before you leave level 15 make sure to gain as much xp over needed with the last kill, ie, try to land upon 92,998 xp (of 93,000) before your last kill. It's not a big deal, but at least something. And ofcourse ytour last kill shall not be with a teammate close to you stealing half of your 16 xp. All quests shall probably not be done until gaining as much xp as possible.
Some of the tricks I though about is leveling a lvl 10 charr up to lvl 11, The only ways to give him xp is to bring a friend at lvl 16 or more (who doesn't care for survivor) who dies 5 times, and his pet and my own pet dies by the same charr, which makes a total of like 10 kills, although 34 are needed for lvling the char to lvl 11. Another trick was the "one plaayer loading trick" mentioned by others, that can maybe give the charr 25 kills before the survivor enters, (maybe more kills if shrineressed pets give xp, although these are harder to force get killed).
Another trick none mentioned before, I think, is to ask many friends, or other accounts, with a lvl 20 character to enter the battle for leaving pre, and, be lucky to land in their group, so, alone you kill these friends over and over again during those like 3 minutes, to gain a max of like 10k xp. using fire storm and cyclone axe or something, and maybe the others use frenzy and healing signet(-40 armor) but aborting the signet all the time too, for no healing. This could gain the last 10k xp needed, requireing very much luck, that all goes well and to land in the same group, if even getting into a fight( else: sigh) nearly impossible yes, but anyway. Another idea that failed, maybe someone has an idea of developing it into something useful, is to go to the area where master ranger nente and tamer is, and charm a pet and let a high lvl monster kill it, guess there are no lvl 10s in that area, and then go to tamer and give away pet to charm a new one to get killed by that lvl 10 monster. I checked if the melandrus stalker quest could make new melandrus spawn, but it was not possible, there were only max 2-3 even though asking him for the quest when they were all killed, he still promised they'd be there with a green light on map. Well, and that's about it, I can't find ano´ther way, therefore giving up, but ppl keep trying to find out, if you enjoy it even though you'll fail hehe. --Prince godrik 19:45, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

I had a thought, that if you were to bring a friend along, and slowly let him die and lvl the enemy up, then it is possible, over a course of what, 3 years? LOL. Anyway another method could be cap an animal, let it die, get another pet, let that die, and keep doing this until the enemy is higher than you or within the +/-5 lvl range --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

When making suggestions, is usually a good idea to read the previous suggestions first. Both ideas you suggest have already come up before, and reasons are available as to why they don't work.--Fighterdoken 18:13, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

If utilizing an ingrained function of the game for uses other than the originally intended purposes is the by-the-book definition of an 'exploit' then there are quite a bit of exploits out there which are constantly taken advantage of. I shouldn't think that the exploits of forcing your own 'super-lag' or dis-connect are really considered exploits; people (other than me) dis-connect all the time, and they pray to their gods that they can re-connect after. I once used a 'super-lag' to get my buddy to run me to the Bone Palace from the Gate of Desolation when I couldn't use a wurm. What about Wintersday 2007? There was the (technically speaking) exploit of getting inside the small cange in Kamadan and standing in there; is that an exploit? I think the term exploit needs to be defined by a member of ArenaNet for all of us Guild Wars players to see and understand clearly. The term needs codification, and bad. I must say that I disagree with Alaris on some of the points above. I myself can't get LDoA, but when somebody manages to use one of the exploits defined here, I think they deserve to be comended, not scolded for their ingenuity. Making the game work for you in what gaming is all about, and we should be encouraged, if anything, to use as many exploits as we can. If any exploits trully (without exhageration) begin to ruin the game-play of Guild Wars, ArenaNet can remove them, and leave in the fun exploits. I don't know, maybe I'm too liberal, but I like it when I can turn the game to my advantage without Big Brother (ArenaNet) knowing exactly how, why, when, for whom, etc. Using 'super-lag' and forced dis-connect is ingenious, not horrid. - Ara The ElegantAra 02:06, 12 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm unsure if this works in proph.... but in factions, I was having some lag with a quest that rewards faction. I completed the quest and went to get the reward, but lagged out. When I logged back in, I had 2000 faction from a 200 faction quest. Perhaps this is doable in Pre with experience quests.

Page Updates

I have recently fixed a few mess ups, like the statement, "it is possible to death level using a pet" among others. Additionally, I have added a "Strategy" portion to the page, to help players who do not know how to do this. A similar guide can be found on, but is not plagiarized. (Mortix 18:47, 6 May 2007 (EDT))

I had to reverse the logic behind being 5 levels away from the creature. As it was originally written, if the creature was 5 levels lower than you, it would not level up. Also, I removed and redid a note about two people working together. If two people are in the map, Both have to die before either one will rez. Even killing charr bosses only recharges a res sig 4 times, and you have to die dozens of times to effectivly level a creature. I have multiple ideas on additional improvments to this page... LeFick 19:58, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
The recent revert of my example of the limit to XP gain was misunderstood. The example is to show that there is a limit to the monster gaining XP from repeatedly killing the player. NOT the other way around. IF the player is level 10, then the monster will STOP gaining XP once it gets to level 16.LeFick 22:30, 29 September 2007 (UTC)
Understood now. -- sig 05:05, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
Thanks, The edit as it is now, is better that I originally had it. Good Collaberation! I like this wiki stuff....LeFick 21:44, 30 September 2007 (UTC)
Are we sure it's right to leave it as it's written now? From what i originaly understood, the "5 levels limit" commentary was added as a note pointing to "why" one would have to deathlevel to gain the title (since there are no 11+ level mobs in pre). The way it is now, indicating that mobs wouldn't earn experience from a player at x level, should be noted on the "Death Leveling" article and not here in my opinion.
I think rewriting the whole first paragraph just to point why is needed, and adding the level-restricion information to the death leveling article could improve both.--Fighterdoken 19:07, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Is that better? LeFick 19:33, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Looks better. No way to get confused now, and all the information is clear.--Fighterdoken 21:49, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Death Levelling with a Pet

I'm having trouble with the page saying it is not possible to Death Level with a Pet, as it is possible to Death Level with a Pet. Indeed, the Pet gives experience for it's first death and that's it, but just because it no longer gives XP to the Monsters, does not mean you can not have a successful Death Level session with your Pet with you. In fact, it's one of the ways to level your Pet to 20 at the same time. The other being to Death Level a Moa and then Tame it rather than kill it when it's level 20. How a Pet can help: The Charr Ashen Claws use Mark of Pain, which will only trigger if there is an adjacent ally. Additionally, while killing a level 20 Charr, which often takes 3 more deaths or so, during that 10 seconds waiting for a Resurrection, Monsters experience the Natural health regeneration when not in comabt, if they are busy dealing with your Pet they won't start to regenerate as fast. Now previous to the Pet Controls, your Pet may have killed the Charr while you were Dead, but since the controls were implemented, you can set your Pet to Heel, which ensures you won't lose any valuable XP. So, although having a Pet with you does little to improve your Death Level expereince, it in no way prevents you from doing it, making this statement: "It is not possible to Death level foes with a pet, the xp counts on the first death of the pet only", only half true. Dragon 15:07, 9 May 2007 (EDT)

It should be changed. The original reason for this addition was to note that you can't give XP to monsters using your pet exclusively, so death levelling requires that you get yourself killed. The controversy arose as to whether there was a way to achieve both the Survivor and Defender titles, or if they were indeed mutually exclusive. Alaris 15:39, 9 May 2007 (EDT)
Also keep in mind if you bring a pet into DL with you, luring groups will be harder to lure as the pets reagro the groups when they break of you. So setting up a DL is also considered. --Mithos Agar 16:14, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
You could get a different pet everytime so that it does the death levelling, couldn't you? The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talk • contribs) at 16:04, 18 April 2008 (UTC).
You'd need a Pet Tamer to change your pet, the only one in pre being Jarrel the Tamer. Also, sign please. --Chaiyo Kaldor talk contribs 22:12, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Wiki Link

It may be just me, but linking to the 'other' wiki seems a bit lame to me. it is just like copying all the information. I am going to remove the link. If you prefer the other wiki, fine, but don't try to steal people away here. Nicky Silverstar 09:54, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

I too thought that was a bit weird. But then again, the official wiki with its web integration has a special status, which is much more likely to steal people from other sites than the other way around. Nevertheless, we should make the pages that are missing rather than link to other sites. Alaris 13:59, 1 June 2007 (UTC)


I just hit level 9 doing the tedious job of getting Rurik and his men to kill the Charr at the gates again and again. Now I'm wondering what are the numbers for a little reference and comparison? How long (generally) would death leveling exclusively on Charr take? And how long (again, generally) would it take to use striders or spiders to death level. It's certainly looks to be much less troublesome to death level on something other than Charr (I haven't tried yet, waiting for a friend to catch up to my level). -- sig 10:49, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

I shouldn't think it would be less troublesome to death level creatures other than Charr. Certainly, it would be easier to kill a level 20 Strider than a level 20 Charr, but in terms of time taken, a group of five level 8 Charr will yield more experience than three level 1 Striders. --Mme. Donelle 00:54, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
My guildie just got this title and he used a single strider for an "easy" setup to leave to DL overnight, and used 2-3 groups of Charr for a "hard" setup. I think he said that it took around 30 min or so to properly pull and setup the Charr that are needed to do the DL. I think the strider by itself didnt take more than 8 or 9 hours to level up to 18 or 19( I dont know for sure though), and the charr took at least a day to do so. I haven't done any of this so all I know is what he told me. Charr, of course, will give you more exp but take longer (because there are more of them and one may kill you more than another) to level up to a proper level. he was able to pull, I think, 6 Charr at a time (dont quote me on that number i dont know for sure)It took him at least a month if not more to get to the title using these to setups and he started at lvl 16. Bartelby 04:34, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

What if...

What if you set up 2 computers and have 2 accounts? You take one character in that has 0 deaths, and can no longer gain xp. The other char is level 16, but you don't care about the deaths on it. You leave the one with 0 deaths the gate. With the other character, you clear an area for it to sit safely, away from patrols and away from the regular "Death Leveling Rez Shrine". Now, once you have leveled up the Charr just fine, bring your Survivor in and kill them all. (It is very important not to bring a rez on your Survivor. Otherwise your other guy will not rez on his own.)Ranger-icon-small.pngBlackie ewilson92 18:44, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

The other guy wont rez even if you don't have one, but yeah this is possible due to tomes leaked into pre. -FireFox File:Firefoxav.png 18:56, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
Of course he would rez. I very, very sure of that.Ranger-icon-small.pngBlackie ewilson92 19:38, 31 July 2007 (UTC)
How could tomes leak into pre? And how could one person rez in a team without the team being wiped? These two comments go against what I know of GW !!! Pls explain, and try it out to make sure... Alaris 14:45, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
I think you can get the drops by getting a character to level 20 in pre then doing Hard Mode. Risus
Impossible. There is no hard mode in pre. It was a hack, and players involved were banned. Alaris 19:22, 9 October 2007 (UTC)
I'm not sure when it happened, but if your teammate doesn't have res, you res to the shrine.Ranger-icon-small.pngBlackie ewilson92 16:03, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
Are you certain? I have never experienced that myself. I never take any form of res with me when I take people on runs, yet I have never seen those people automatically resurrect upon getting themselves wiped. --Mme. Donelle 16:19, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
Oh, nvm, that only works if you heroes or henchies don't have rez... My bad!Ranger-icon-small.pngBlackie ewilson92 16:39, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
it certainly was possible before i had to wait many times on the other player to res on his own. dit not attempt his, and had a res sig.

could use it the 1st time and later on he resurected on his own. This might be the trick: take sig with you, let him die at first foe, res him. And from then on he could res on his own. If you realy want to try this, it is worth the shot, doen't it ?

(indent reset) Wow! Maybe i really WAS on to something...Ranger-icon-small.pngBlackie ewilson92 00:42, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Doesn't Alesia have restore life? i.e. hard rez? take a weak henchie, let charr kill him, use alesia to rez, pull her back to safety? --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

No hechmen in Pre.--Fighterdoken 00:10, 28 April 2010 (UTC)
To be honest I kind of doubt it. No offense. Armond 14:04, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
Oh, none taken! I'm just brain-storming. =DRanger-icon-small.pngBlackie ewilson92 14:28, 13 August 2007 (UTC)
Is it possible to go back to pre after completing proph? If it is, get a guildie etc. to bring a tome for a monk and learn ressurect.The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talk • contribs) at 16:04, 18 April 2008 (UTC).
Following you with the unsigned. Also, don't you think you would find any way to go back on the various pages dedicated to Pre? Such as Pre-searing Ascalon? --Chaiyo Kaldor talk contribs 22:12, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
learn to read itclearly says that pre searing is a TIME and not a place i don't know about u guys but i cant time travel u cant visit ur guild hall anymore so u cant have anything transferred and there are no xunlai agentsu cant get back when u go to past searing --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

Case Studies

Does anyone think a case studies section would be helpfull to some people? A section for case studies like on the Survivor page. I have one example of the Title taking 15,567 hours and 179,000 Deaths.--Affian 20:45, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Numbers aren't much help as you wouldn't actually be at the computer most of the time. Backsword 20:47, 4 August 2007 (UTC)
Still might give people an idea of what they are getting themselves into XD --Affian 21:08, 4 August 2007 (UTC)


The article claims that minions "cannot level enemies high enough" -- why? Is the amount of experience they offer limited in some respect, or is lack of corpses an issue? If the former, I feel the article should be updated to reflect this; if the latter, I don't understand why this is a problem, as a pet can easily supply corpses. --Mme. Donelle 00:36, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Ah, nevermind, I found a discussion of this topic in Talk:Survivor. It seems that minions don't give experience, so I'll update the article to reflect that. --Mme. Donelle 00:43, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Not mutually exclusive.

This title can be obtained by having another player death level the monster while you stand away, once that monster is lvl "x" the other player maps out of the zone and you kill the monster. While this is extremely inconvinient, I don't think this title is convinient anyways. --Lou-SaydusUser Lou-Saydus Hail Storm.jpg 22:28, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

and how do they res, exactly? we're gone over this many times. The preceding awesome-sauce comment was added by Skakid9090. 22:30, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
Wouldn't they use the Ressurectio Shrine? They are everywhere in Pre_Searing. 17:01, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
For Pre-Searing, Resurrection Shrines only activate once everyone in the party is dead, so it doesn't matter how far away you are, or if you disconnected for a bit, or lagged while zoning; you would still be "online" as per game mechanics, and thus your partner would be unable to be resurrected. And NO, not having a resurrection signet, or having it used would NOT enable your party to be resurrected as it happends with henchmen in post-searing. (by the way, i guess we are aware at this point that people need to die/resurrect multiple times in order to level up monsters) --Fighterdoken 17:17, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
While it may not be allowed, there are people who have gotten tomes into pre-searing. --Lou-SaydusUser Lou-Saydus Hail Storm.jpg 22:32, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
And that was due to the previous glitches that were exploited in pre-searing which can no longer be done. I'm reverting. -- sig 01:39, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Last Quest Before Leveling

It says not to accept the reward for any quest after War Preparationshowever you need complete the primary class test to get your first skills. With out completing and accepting the reward for that quest (which is two skills) the other skill trainers won't even speak to you. At least that is the deal for necromancers, I didn't start a pre-searing character for each class to double check it 5 times over. I just felt I should point this out with out changing the page just make sure I'm not a complete idiot. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Simulated Scholor .

Do you get the first two skills when you accept the quest or when you accept the reward? I don't remember. If it's the latter, then you're right, that part of the article needs to be reworded. You need to get 2 skills from your primary profession before avoiding all quest rewards. -- sig 01:59, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
You get the first two skills only after accepting the reward. After that, you can take a quest to get skills, then abandon the quest and you will retain the skills.TikiTantrum 17:10, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
It's different for each profession. Some get skills before completing the quest, some don't. Though this should be noted in the article, I guess. - anja talk 17:11, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
In my opinion, "XP" is "XP". If you do the quests up front you have to do more Death Leveling later at the end. If you save the quests untill the end, you have to spend hour after hour killing Charr Bosses for a mear 16xp each, after you kill all the Charr around them for no xp at all! To me, getting from lvl 19 to lvl 20 by Death Leveling is sooo much better AFK than it is killing the bosses over and over. LeFick 20:08, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
It's probably not different for each profession, I checked the articles for each of those quests, none mention getting skills before completing the quests and all reward dialogues mention the character getting skills. Etienne 10:40, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Section Move

I would like to recommend we move the section about "General Steps" over to the article on Death Leveling, as this article is an introduction to the LDoA title, and there is a seperare article on death leveling that lacks a "how to" section. LeFick 01:04, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

can they make this easier?

i have absolutley no time for death leveling and i would like this title. i wish they could update this so there was at least 1 level 19-20 boss so this title was easier to obtain, even if it was mega hard that you need two people to defeat it.what is your opinion on this? i just want it easier to obtain. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Robot .

You might want to read more about death-leveling first. Compared to a few other titles, this requires relatively little play time. It just needs a lot of afk time. This title was created because someone was smart enough to figure out how to get to level 20 and this was a kind of recognition. As such, calling for making this easier is kinda insulting for the pioneers and those who actually spent the effort to get it. And like I said, the actual playing time needed for this is relatively short. -- sig 14:54, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
As of this writting, I have a perma pre character that is 18th level, and 79% of the way to 19th. I have been working on it for months, as I do not do the charr level method. However, Just as says, I have put no efforet into it except to start a spawn in the morning, and kill a 20th level critter when I get home from work. Except for the time, this is the easiest title to earn. Lucky - Unlucky are also about this easy, as AFK tittles, but those cost a ton of money, and this one is basically free.
Besides, adding a boss would allow you to get both LDoA and Survivor titles, which would be a problem for a lot of players. Alaris 17:35, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
Not to mention ANet's said no character will ever get both survivor and ldoa. Armond 09:39, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

death leveling

I still don't understand how you can kill your enemies once they hit a high enough level if they keep on killing you. Sorry if I sound noobish asking this, but any information would help right now. Thanks. 05:14, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Here's a short summary: Lure mobs of enemies all the way to a resurrection shrine. Go to bed or AFK for a long time. Wake up the morning, and all some of those enemies attacking you have leveled up enough for you to get XP. Start killing them. It doesn't matter if you died halfway - you'll just get resurrected. And you continue attacking until they're all dead. Then repeat. -- sig 12:09, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
A longer short summary: (1) lure mobs to a ressurection shrine, (2) let them kill you, (3) you ressurect, hopefully before they leave, so they attack you again, (3) let them kill you again, (4) repeat steps 2-4 until they mobs get enough experience, (5) kill them to gain XP, and (6) repeat steps 1-5 until you are level 20. Because steps 2-5 does not require you to do anything, but takes a long time, usually people set it up while they are AFK, e.g. sleeping or at work/school. Alaris 17:32, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
How are you supposed to lure a group of charr all the way from their spawn points to the gate without dying? Or is there another resurrection shrine that is closer? --Mezon 23:31, 22 April 2009 (UTC)
You could find a longer explanation on the forums or a video or two on youtube. To make it short, you aggro a group, pull them for a bit until they stop chasing you and start walking back, reaggro again, and keep repeating until you reach the hills right in front of the first ruined building. You then die there, and the charrs (thanks to the pathing AI) will be stuck in that place. You then repeat this same process for as many groups as you want, and then finnaly you pull all the groups at the same time to respawn.--Fighterdoken 23:43, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

I'm not sure if the OP was talking about how it's done exactly, but how you can kill a bunch of level 17-20 charr once you're ready to kill them. My theory is run away as you ressurect then pikc them off later as they return to their route. VanguardUser-VanguardAvatar.PNG 17:43, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Another way is to pick them off one by one with whatever skills you have - you should bring skills that work well at high DP preferably. Even if you die, they won't be able to heal themselves while you ressurect, so you will eventually kill them. Of course, this is best done on mobs that don't have means of self-healing. Alaris 17:49, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Well DP won't be a problem as you don't get DP in pre-searing :P--Spider osiris 19:43, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Maybe this will help. If you are a level 15 character, and you have to Kill several level 20 monsters, (probably charr, as striders and spiders only level 1 at a time) just do your best to hurt the creature. You will probably die, but in the 10 seconds you take to resurrect, the monster will not really heal much, so you just keep comming back to life, attack some more, untill it finally dies. Then do the same to the next monster.LeFick 21:48, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Yeah, that is pretty much how it is done. As long as you don't have shamans into the group you death-leveled, you just pick one target, do as much damage as you can in the 5 seconds of immunity after rezzing, die, rez back, and engage again. Natural regen from the creatures won't heal enough damage to cover what you did on those 5-7 seconds, so they eventually die. Just be sure to time their deaths with yours right, so you don't end killing them 1 second after your death (that is NOT funny).--Fighterdoken 21:53, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
What, you don't get XP then? Ow, that would be bad... Alaris 22:38, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
If you are dead when they die? Nope, that is why it's advisable to not use degeneration skills/spells, rain spells, or an attacking pet (a pet "on hold" is fine). --Fighterdoken 22:42, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Wow thanks for the replies. Okay, I understand now. Just damage them before you die, then repeat. Thanks guys. 14:18, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

Umm... not exactly. It's more like kill them while you're not dead, not just damage them :) -- sig 01:03, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
HMM,they nerfs death-leveling with char sry if im late,but i think it realy not fair...

how many people get their titles defender of ascalon with death-leveling with this char ???? 1000 maybe mores... For what me ,i need to death leveling with low foes,more times etc.It realy not a good nerf and it realy not fair...if they stay like that why not remove then the titles already give with char death-leveling ???they need to reput char death leveling on. Talk fair maybe for now it realy not.Warzy 13:45, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Another thing that I dont think was mentioned about the killing of the higher level monsters was that when you are being killed you have all of your armor off, so once you are ready to kill them put your armor back on and go at it. Of course it would help if you had a max dmg weapons too, like the ones you get from the pre-order of EotN. Bartelby 04:42, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
Also, choose your skills wisely. Some skills are less affected by DP than others, e.g. spells that cost less energy, that cast faster... Alaris 04:53, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
DP? (pre) Sure you don't mean "skills that cast/recharge faster so you can spam them while you are immune"?--Fighterdoken 04:57, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
What he said. Hahah, I keep forgetting the rules of pre. It shows I've only been through that once in my GW career. Alaris 15:11, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

"<player name> has achieved the title Legendary Defender of Ascalon"

When someone hits level 20 in pre searing, does anyone know where will message like this be broadcast to?

The following image is myself accepting a quest award in Ascalon city to hit level 20. Does anyone know that if someone hits level 20 from a death leveled monsters, will anyone else get this message?


I know it counts as a maxed title, so it will be broadcasted on every place other maxed titles are (Temple of the Ages, Lion's Arch, etc...), but shouldn't in Pre-Searing Ascalon outpost, by example.--Fighterdoken 06:04, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
I'm 19th level and about 26% right now. I'm only DLing on moss piders and Striders. I'll let you know in a few weeks.LeFick 15:36, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
If you accept a quest reward that grants you level 20 in pre in an outpost, the message will be broadcast to that outpost and all other places where maxed titles are broadcast to. If you kill a monster and that gives you the XP for level 20, then the message is broadcast to your instance, and to the other places where maxed titles are broadcast to. 03:57, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
Just to note, this isn't anything special about the LDoA title. Any time that you max out a title, it gets broadcast to the world. -- Hong 10:02, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
That note is referring to "<player name> is now level 20!" or "<player name> has gained a skill point!" which are broadcasted in the outpost you are C4K3 User C4K3 Signature.jpg Talk 11:18, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
The message "<player name> has achieved the title Legendary Defender of Ascalon" is also broadcasted in the outpost you are in, if you cash in a quest in that outpost. It is however not broadcasted in the other outposts or districts in Pre, just the main cities. 21:40, 10 May 2010 (UTC)

So, i can use Exploit?

This title is achiveable only using an exploit (and don't say it isn't, anet tried to address it in a past update before stepping back). How is that possibile? It's freaking ridicoulus. I don't care about tiles, but i think that putting in the game a title like that is a great error from a game company. -- 02:21, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

No, this is achievable without an exploit. Just with months of AFKing. It's possible to achieve both titles that are supposed to be mutually exclusive, this and Survivor with the exploit. Calor - talk 02:28, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
By definition, an exploit is the method you use for abusing of a bug. While it may have been an "exploit" on its earlier phases, the momment Anet created a title for reaching level 20 in pre-searing this bug became a feature, and so using the bug could no longer be called "exploiting". If i am not wrong, Anet stepped back on this because the update fixing the death-leveling method came after the title track was created, so it was just fixing some discordination from their part. Plus, giving away a reward to players for "being clever" (without being game-breaking creative as in the last dupe explits) is pretty good for PR (there are worse titles, if you want to nitpick). --Fighterdoken 02:39, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
I still think it's a very silly title that encourage a "bad" way of playing mmorpgs. -- 21:09, 18 November 2007 (UTC)
The same has been said about drunkard, wisdom, or would you believe it, survivor. But these are opinions, and personally I think LDoA is pretty cool, even though I would never try to reach it myself. Alaris 04:44, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

Exp math

Ok, just so we can have this settled at once...

Total for general quests = 8150xp
Total for pre-secondary quests = 1500xp
Total for quests restricted for primary class only = 750xp
Total for primary/secondary restricted quests = between 500xp(Elementalist+Mesmer) and 1250xp (Necromancer+ Warrior or Monk or Ranger)
Total general exp = 10400xp
Range of final exp: Between 10900xp (any combination of Elementalist and Mesmer) and 11650xp (any combination of Necromancer with Warrior or Monk or Ranger)
Required for reaching level 20 (from level 16) = 47600xp
Required for reaching level 20 (from level 19) = 12800xp
Final conclusion. Nope, still not going to happend. Not even if you were somehow able to do EVERY quest (even those restricted by classes, whose grand total is of 7250xp) would you be able to do it without death-leveling.--Fighterdoken 19:30, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
I just did about the same thing on my talk page as a work in progress. Looks cool!LeFick 23:32, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

Is this even worth it?

According to the article on getting the Defender title track it is estimated to take about three months to do this. But it does not specifically say how many hours each day it would take for those three months. Is this even worth the trouble?--The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

For me, it took a little over 3 months, with like 30 minutes of playing and 10-12 hours of deathleveling per day (just one session, 2-3 groups of 3-4), and with 1-2 days lost per week due to disconnections. Is it worth the trouble? If you want the title and don't mind stopping playing while you get it, then yes; if you feel that playing the game you bought is more important than a title, then it's not worth. You win nothing from it, and you will not get phat lewtz or be more uber because you have it. But is still a nice sounding title to have.--Fighterdoken 06:45, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

I can't believe it...

I am realy realy realy pissed now,I was death leveling for about 7 hours,later I've seen that a new Guild Wars build is available,how can I quit death leveling now? I waited a bit longer for charr to level up so I can kill them and get a new build,but my PC was stuck (happens sometimes) and I have restarted PC in hope that I will be able to reconnect back to the Northlands.When I launched GW it downloaded new build...but...there wasn't a window for reconnect -.-. So I've shown up in Ascalon city with no level up. Wasted my whole day for nothing.Title is very hard and it's even harder when u sacrifice your whole time for nothing!

Hehe, it happends. I remember a week where whe had like 4 small updates (fixing the fix of the fix), and i just lost the whole week between that and my isp. Or the other couple of weeks where reconnect was disabled and got several pc crashes... The best thing to do when "a new version of GW blahblah" appears on screen is to just kill everything regardless of the level, exit, update, make the setup again, and pray for not having another update the same day. 9 out of 10 times you decide to "wait a little more", something will happend and you will end with nothing.--Fighterdoken 21:14, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Yeah lol,get's on nerves,well I know what to do now when new build comes lol.Thanks :).

You don't have to download new builds right away, when I death levelled I would wait until the last minute to do it. The message eventually tells you you have 1 hour, 10 minutes, 5, etc. The message will stay there for hours before you have to restart.Captain Doughnut 01:47, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

Indeed, you don't. But as the Murphy's law dictates, the chances of the game crashing before you have the chance to quit are quite high, and if it does, you will be unable to come back because of the update.--Fighterdoken 23:04, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
If you can't afford to pay your electric bill or repair your computer should it overheat and fry up, then no this is not worth it. 14:48, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
It's definitely worth it for me. First of all, having read about GW2, I'm not interested in playing it. I don't like the dumbing down of the profession system, the addition of guns, or the story. Second of all, I work from home and GW is, shall we say, a bit of a distraction. Since I don't need the computer, I can keep myself off it by death levelling one of my characters. I shouldn't be playing during that time, I really shouldn't, so it's great that there is a way for my character to earn a bit of experience when I'm off doing something else. It's a win-win situation for me, but I can see how it would be a problem for others. --La Visiteuse 22:03, 18 November 2010 (UTC)


moved from User Talk:Gaile Gray

Hello there all :),I am doing Legendary Defender of Ascalon and it's realy hard title to get,but it's harder if you fail 3 times a week,I mean you don't even have reconnect there.My PC froze and I had to restart it,but when I came back there was no reconnect.That happend when new build came out and that happend 2 more times(no new build).I restarted PC and in hope that it will get me back to the northlands I loged in and seen that I'm back in Ascalon City :(.Same thing happend to my m8.Pc was frozen maybe for a minute,he restarted it and it didn't want to get him back.If you could just a bit make this easier,at least to have reconnect. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

LDoA is supossed to be extremely hard to get, I mean the title only came around cuz somebody figured it out and Anet was like: holy crap somebody actualy got to 20 in pre-sear, better give him/her a reward or something... Although I admit it does suck to do death leveling--The Forsaken One 15:51, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
Yeah,it does...but it would be fair to put reconnect there lol,it's very slow and very hard -.- -- Kristina2-d --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).
Hi. I'd like to hear what others have to say, so will move this to the page about this particular title. Thanks. -- Gaile User gaile 2.png 00:00, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Are you sure you tried to reconnect before the 10 minute limit was reached? (after 10 minuttes, you leave the party. You can only reconnect within 10 minutes after disconnecting) Since you are death-leveling (a process that, after setting it up, usually means going afk) I can imagine that you might come back to your computer to see you disconnected at some point, with the 10 minute limit already being reached, thus you being unable to reconnect. I'm not sure if this is what happened to you, as you didn't say whether you were at your computer the moment you disconnected. If you were, then I have no idea ;) Zophar 09:11, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
Point is, the title is hard enough without glitches and reconnection problems. If a fix can be implemented here, it would seem fair to LDoA collectors. -- Alaris_sig Alaris 14:15, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Yeah,agreed,I have tried to reconnect within 3 mins and it didn't want to reconnect,it just left me back in Ascalon,same happend to my bf. -- Kristina2-d --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

This is a problem with reconnects even outside of the LDA death-leveling. I have had instances where my computer has frozen, my GW has crashed, or my internet has randomly died, I restart GW and/or my computer to fix the problem, and I can't rejoin the party. I know that it is within the 10 minute timespan. I'd love to see this fixed.--Ang 18:27, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

It seems like LDoA is a joke title put in and then people found out a way to acheive it to me... also, ive heard someone say that you lose the displaying ability is you go into post-searing. Is that true? Tearh 03:32, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

LDoA was a title put in to reward the original players who were ingenious enough to figure out a way to level up to 20 in pre-Searing. And no, you will not lose the ability to display this title. -- User Sig.png 03:50, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
LDoA is imo the most respectable title to get:p it requires geekness, loads of waiting time, and just so much guts to do it.. i wouln't even dare thinking what i would do if i would DC when i would have deathleveled some charr/nything :s XD , big up for everyone lvl 18+ in pre :p Close Impact 19:04, 3 May 2008 (UTC)
I had the same problem with disconnecting during DL sessions (1/5 still do:P), but it makes the title seem so much better (lvl 18+95% woo!) - Byakko User Page 12:19, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

Accept quest rewards at level 16 not 19.

It makes more sense, afterall you'll be a higher level and give the charr more experience per kill faster, and you'll have access to the rest of the profession quests from your secondary and other follow-up quests. You'll then be level 17, and death level from there to 20. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

Nnnnnot exactly. Yes, you will give charrs more exp sooner (at level 17), but also you will need to level them up one aditional level (up to 12 minimum instead of 11). Also, a common user is a lot more willing to "deathlevel" at 16 than at 19. By level 19, you will be so tired and sick of it that the only thing you would want is to finish soon, so things are actually better on a psicological level if you think that "as soon as i reach 19 i just need to deathlevel 3 times" instead of "as soon as i reach 19, i still need one month for 20".
Also, remember that you don't need to "take" a secondary class for using their skills in Pre. You are given a temporary secondary and a couple of skills at the begining of the selection quest, so as long as you don't finish it, you can still gather the exp later while still having access to the skills you want.--Fighterdoken 01:57, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
To the first response, you'll still be leveling up the same amount of times. Exp from quests is static, and when you get absolutely no experience from killing things, it doesn't matter if you take the quest at 16, 17, 18, 19, or even 20, it will always displace the experience you need to level up. But if you do it earlier on, you'll be giving the charr more experience because you'll be a higher level, meaning it will get the charr leveled up faster. There is no additional level, I don't really understand what you mean by it. With my suggestion, you would be death leveling charr at 17, 18, and 19 instead of 16, 17, 18, and part of 19, and giving more experience per death. If you need the psychological idea of, once you get to 19 you get 20 soon then you can still do it that way, but in reality it would be faster to get the reward as soon as you get no exp from killing the charr bosses. As for the second response, it's really just a side reward so you'll have access to the attributes and more skills of your secondary profession. 02:19, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
The "extra level" means that, if you just quest up to 17 (instead of staying at 16), you will need to deathlevel the chars up to 12 (instead of 11) if you want them to give you any experience.
Also, remember that is a common practice to deathlevel up to "yourlevel +1" because it appears to be the most efficiente way in the "time wasted v/s experience gained" comparison. As such, the practical advantage of leaving the quests for later is that you trade "deathlevel charrs from 8 to 20" at level 19, for "deathlevel charrs from 8 to 17" at level 16, which requires less time. Remember that there is a cap for how much experience is gained, and thus the theorical advantage of "questing up to 17" is not such, since for the optimal experience gain at that point you will need to "deathlevel charrs from 8 to 18" now.
All of this, of course, is assuming that you have a limited amount of time assigned to the deathleveling process (6-10 hours). If you just gather 5 groups and leave them leveling for 23 hours, it would be irrelevant. But remember that your average user can't maintain an unattended connection that long :P.--Fighterdoken 03:02, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

One more idea...

I have an alternate idea for getting the Defender of Ascalon title.

  • First, get to Level 16 from fighting Charr bosses.
  • Then, have a friend do the same.
  • After that, both of you go to a secluded server somewhere in Asia and sync-enter the mission.
  • Your friend allows you to kill him in the PvP battle. A kill in PvP gives experience.*
  • After that, zone out instead of completing the mission and leaving Pre-Searing.
  • Theoretically, a character could get Defender of Ascalon and Survivor too.

(If you end up on the same team or with other people, zone back and try again.)

I know there has to be something, but what's wrong with this theory? --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

Can't. The duration of the PvP match is not enough for going from 16 to 17 (much less from 16 to 20). Also, you can't "zone out" of the PvP part of the mission, only log out, but if you do you are automatically sent to the PvE part as soon as you log in again (and you can't "zone out" of the PvE mission either).--Fighterdoken 02:39, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Igneous Summoning Stone

It would take years, but it's possible to get Survivor and LDoA with the Igneous Summoning Stone. Do the usual to get to level 16, use the Stone, aggro, get imp somehow killed, run away. Wait an hour, repeat. It should be possible, unless the imp can't be killed or something. calor (talk) 16:00, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

Can't. The server kicks you out after 24 hours of continued connection as far as i remember. 24 kills is not enough for leveling a single char within the exp range needed for reaching level 20.--Fighterdoken 16:48, 1 November 2008 (UTC)
Ah, I forgot about that. Damn. Thanks for saving me endless months in pre. calor (talk) 16:53, 1 November 2008 (UTC)
One other small problem, at higher levels the imp is actually quite capable of killing a couple of the charr before it dies. Do that to often and there will not be any charr left to give you any XP, even if the imp gave the charr XP (which I doubt) 04:04, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
Well, a level 8 creature needs 6200 XP to reach next level. Killing a level 19 monster (you can't summon the Fire Imp after you've reached level 20), it would get 280 XP (11 levels ahead). Doing the maths, 23 kills needed (1 summon per hour = 23 hours).
At level 9, such creature would need 6800 XP and would get 264 XP per kill. Yet another 26 hours until level 10. Time required to get to next level would increase as more XP are needed and less XP are awarded per kill (a level 19 character would need to let a level 19 mob to kill it 128 times so such mob would get to level 20).
In summary, a level 8 creature needs to kill level 19 creature ~700 times to reach level 20.
If you were to summon 1 Fire Imp per hour, that would be ~29 days (one month).
Killing ONE level 20 creature would net you amazing 120 XP. So, you'd get 120 XP per month or 1440 XP per year.
From level 19 to level 20, you'd need 127800 XP. So, after 8 or 9 years you'd get leveled up from level 19 to level 20. :D
This assuming:
  • Your connection wouldn't be lost during the 1 month "death level" session.
  • Your level 19 summoned ally would not wipe the entire level 8 mob.
  • You did manage to get to level 19 with 0 deaths.
Well, getting from level 16 to level 17 and from level 17 to level 18 should take "a little less time" then getting from level 19 to level 20. But getting from level 16 to level 19 would take much more time then getting from level 19 to level 20, so you'd need a few decades to get Survivor Legendary Defender of Ascalon. O_O
Off-topic note: it seems to be possible to bypass the 24-hour disconnection issue (just check The Aurios Mines's high scores (3240XP per hour and monthly top scores above 100k). But hoping to have a session active for over a month (with no game updates and no random connection problems and clicking on an item once per hour, 24-7) seems... improbably. --NIN37 09:08, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

Why Quest Acceptance At The Last Second?

Apparently, to get this title you have to put off accepting all quest rewards until level 19. However, I'm pretty sure that the current level you have doesn't have any effect on the amount of experience you get. Is it just for some sort of twisted sense of satisfaction that you get the title without any hard work (at the end)? Or is it just because if you finish in a town it brags the fact to everyone else? 21:12, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

It's suggested (not have) to do this because the last about of experience is the hardest/longest through death leveling. You can get the quest rewards sooner, but it'll be easier and quicker to get them later. It's ease not bragging. You can brag as a level twenty in town. -- 21:15, 20 April 2009 (UTC)
A few topics above you can find arguments in that regard. Basically it depends on how you deathlevel, but for most people (that i have known at least) is easier to deathlevel the lower levels than the higher ones.--Fighterdoken 21:53, 20 April 2009 (UTC)
Oh! Duh. That makes sense. Cause it takes more experience at the end to get to level 20 and if you just have to kill Charr that whole time...I get it. 22:16, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Dial Up

Will the fact that I have dial-up(5kbs) majorly effect my death leveling sessions?(I'm not there yet, so I want to make sure it will actually be possible for me)--Mezon 14:27, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

Depends on you connection really. If you are currently able to stay logged for 10+ hours withouth DC'ing, then you should have no problem deathleveling. If your isp throws your connection out every once in a while, then you will have problems.--Fighterdoken 17:52, 25 April 2009 (UTC)
Darn, it kicks me off randomly(ranging from a few minutes to a few hours) Perhaps if I am not really AFK, but just do stuff in the background and check on it?--Mezon 12:55, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

2 Charrs DLing

Hey would it be possible if I happen to have 2 accounts. I have a program on computer that allows running two GW clints at the same time. Charrecter from account 1 is trying to get LDoA and the charrecter from account 2 is just made up for this purpose, level them both up to 16 then go DL with the both of them at the same time, enemys would get double xp and when they are ready to be killed the charrecter from account 2 would leave from there, leaving charrecter from account 1 get all the xp from killing them. -AramisFI

Yes, it is possible. At lower levels it will take a lot more time for the charrs to kill you, so you will have to go for at least a 3-groups setup (ideally 5), but by level 15 or so the time should start compensating. Only thing you need to make sure is that your computer can manage two instances of gw running on first plane (otherwise, you risk the gw account running on background going linkdead).--Fighterdoken 17:48, 9 May 2009 (UTC)


Is the only reason to do quests at level 19 so that you have to kill less level 14 Charrs? Also, would you not still have to get the Charrs to the same level? The experience alone does not get you to level 20. 18:59, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

In part, is taking in account the 5 levels difference you need to have with the creatures you are fighting. Since it takes more time to level up creatures from 8 to 14 than from 8 to 11 (if you were to do the quests at level 16), you will end saving time if something happends (as in "no even leveling", "emergency patch", "mom telling you to turn off the pc XD"). You being higher level doesn't provide enough experience to counter the fact that the charrs will need to level up more.
Also, at lower levels, if you get a long DL session you will be able to level up charrs past the "optimal point" (your level +1), so you still win a bit of exp if DL'in more than intended; this, however, won't happend if you DL at level 19, where no matter how long you leave the charrs alive, they won't go beyond level 20.
Finally, you have the psychological effect (at level 19 you won't want more war, trust me), and the "bragging rights" effect of being able to reach 20 while in the city :).
It is true that the experience of the quests is not enough, but it will reduce by a huge amount the need of DL'in at 19. I think it took me 5 DL sessions to match up for the difference.--Fighterdoken 18:05, 4 June 2009 (UTC)
But isn't the majority of the time spent DLing afk leveling up the charrs? You will still need to get the charrs to the same level. You are making it sound like your character can gain experience from DLing and while AFK. How does it work? 02:40, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
Erh, no, i am not implying that, and i have no clue how you came to that conclusion.
You DON'T need to get the charrs to the same level. What is more, most of the time the charrs won't level to the same level anyways due to the way pancake stacking works (or how it fails when it does, actually).
When you have a big setup of charrs (3+ groups), chances are tha they will level up unevenly. It's not uncommon to come 12 hours later and find that one group is level 20, the other level 15, and the last one level 12 or less. This means that the level 20 group reached the max level earlier, but kept on sucking experience from the other groups, which you in the end just lost.
If something like that happends, you can still get exp from the low level group if you are 16 (or can level them up quickly if needed), but you won't if you are 19 (or you will need to level them up longer, thus wasting time). This could be solved if you were monitoring the dl process every once in a while, but if you are level 19 we are talking about monitoring the process for 18+ hours, which frankly is not what the average user can do.
Now, if by "leveling them to the same level" you are implying that they have to always level up to 20, that is false too. Let me explain with a small table:
Charr lvl Exp gain at lvl 16 Exp gain at lvl 19
11 16 0
12 32 0
13 48 0
14 60 16
15 80 32
16 100 48
17 120 60
18 136 80
19 152 100
20 168 120
Now you get that:
  1. You gain the same experience from leveling a charr up to level 17 at 16 than up to level 20 at 19.
  2. It takes less time to level a charr up to 17 from 16 than up to level 20 from 19 (experience cap for the lower level charrs).
  3. If you are level 16, you can stop leveling the charrs at 17, and use the time you would have wasted going from 17 to 20 to level a new group of charrs from 8 to 15.
  4. If you leave your afk deathleveling session unatended, coming back later if you are level 16 will yield aditional experience up to 48xp points per charr. If you come back later while being level 19, the experience gain will be zero.
As you say, the majority of the time is spent afk and not gaining experience, but based on how you afk, you could find a lot more convenient to DL at lower levels. The only reason i could find to quest at 16 is if you are checking your DL setup every 30 minutes for 15+ straight hours.--Fighterdoken 18:29, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
So then does DLing only level them once in that instance and then after I kill them in that instance, when I respawn them they will be back at level 8 and I will have to DL them again? 12:43, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
All creatures spawn only once per stance (well, at least on pre-searing). So yes, if you pull 5 groups of charrs, level them up, and then kill them as they level up to where you want to kill them, they will be no longer on the map so you will need to exit, come back again, and deathlevel them up from scratch.--Fighterdoken 18:09, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
Oh, I had no idea, I thought it was permanent. I can't believe the guides failed at explaining that. Thank you anyway. 19:35, 8 June 2009 (UTC)
Huh? If you've played GW before... you didn't notice that things always go back to the way they were every time you leave and re-enter an area? -- User Sig.png 00:15, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

how many?

just a question I've had. How many people have actually achieved this title? I figure it's probably the least known title in the game, or at least has the least amount of people who have it under their hero pane...Ζεφ 21:06, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Last time i checked on the forums, i think the numbers registered there were around 100-200 (but it was too much work to get your name added to the list XD), so i would think the numbers should be around 1-2k. Maybe Regina can provide this information?.--Fighterdoken 22:32, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
This link] should give you an idea. —Faalagorn/ 19:05, 6 June 2009 (UTC).
Ty. I still say it is the hardest to get(next to GWAMM).Ζεφ 01:06, 18 June 2009 (UTC)
It's not a hard title to get, it's time consuming. There's a big difference. -Drakora 01:10, 18 June 2009 (UTC)
K, I'll give you that... still with all the DC's I've gotten... its much more challenging than LS... Its a test of my patience...Ζεφ 20:01, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
Seconded. I'm way proud of my Legendary Defender character - and I regard it as evidence that I am immune to boredom. User Auntmousie 19x19Jrat.jpg(AUNTMOUSIE) 01:38, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
You can argue that Drunkard is harder to get, especially at the Incorrigible Ale Hound level. Not only do you need to get enough alcohol to be able to be drunk for 1,000 minutes (Drunkard) or 10,000 minutes (Incorrigible Ale Hound), but you also have to be able to spend that much time drinking. Sure, you can short-cut this using the zoning trick (drink, zone, zone back, see drunk time advanced), but it still takes a great deal of active connect time. Cynique 20:31, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
People can just bot drunkard. They can't bot LDoA. And in PvE, time-consumption is proportional to difficulty. Hell, it's all easy if you have enough time. -- 09:58, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
So what you are saying is that if people cheat by using bots, then drunkard is an easy title. I just want to clarify that. If, however, you play fairly by not using bots - the way the game is meant to be played - then drunkard is a hard title to get. Harder than LDoA? I don't know, but possibly. --La Visiteuse 15:16, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

It IS actually possible to get both survivor and LDoA!

The main idea is to either have a friend with his own acc. or having 2 accs. Then you go out as pair and let you 2nd character death level for your main. Done, survivor+LDoA! 19:47, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

There is no hard rez in pre. So that does NOT work. -- 19:53, 25 August 2009 (UTC)
And in case you are thinking about just "rezzing" with shrines, won't work either since your whole party needs to be defeated before they activate. Just killing one of you (and being "far away", lagging, LD, etc) won't activate the shrine rez.
This idea has been sugested already over and over, and the answer is always the same: No.--Fighterdoken 19:57, 25 August 2009 (UTC)
During a few specific points in the game's history, there was an exploit that you could travel to the Guild Hall and bring to pre-searing post searing items. This occured during the point after that tomes were introduced into the game. One could bring a monk tome and learn a hard rez skill and have the Charr death level via that way. As far as I know any such action was ban-able or ANet asked the players personally to A) delete the character B) move the character to post-searing. Regardless, it is not possible under any circumstances. Gladiator Motoko 09:50, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
That too gets brought time and again most every time someone forgets the resurrection bit :) -- User Sig.png 15:19, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
Not to mention it was done during an ingame bug where on a quest you could get xp as a reward and an item but you could reclaim the reward if you inventory was full. It was one the catacombs quests if i recall correctly. I don't believe the person was banned though all other evidence was deleted shhhh lol -- 15:35, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
Just wondering, does the Igneous Summoning Stone give XP to the Charr? (you can see where I'm going with this) – josəph 07:47, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
Even if it does. At level 16 he will kill everything, but even if will die You can make one imp every 60 minutes. The imp will die 24 times and you will be kicked for being online for more than 24 hours. --SharkinuUser Sparky Sharkinu sig.jpgtalk 07:52, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
Has anyone tried having a preferably level 20 friend do the death leveling while the other person is disconnected? Would the resurrection shrine work under those circumstances? And further, after trying to reconnect, would they be able to re-enter the explorable area instance already in progress? Yes, I feel dirty suggesting it, but game testing often involves ridiculous methods. Seryu 00:42, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
And that would accomplish what? I doubt your gonna get exp if your disconnected. personn5User Personn5 sig.jpg 00:46, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
It would have the same problem Fighterdoken mentioned: the resurrection shrine wouldn't work. When we are in the disconnect window (after a disconnect, but within the time frame in which we can still reconnect), our characters are still there - they still take damage, they can still die, they still get experience and they still prevent ressurection shrines from working. Erasculio 00:49, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
Ah, alrighty. Good to know that a possible exploit's already been accounted for. Seryu 00:52, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

Only Chuck Norris can be Survivor AND Legendary Defender of Ascalon. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talk).

It has been done, i have a friend who's character name was Yliah Atreides and he got LDoA and Survivor, mostly because he used an exploit that allowed him to get skill tomes into pre-searing, and he unlocked hard rez. He got banned tough months later. But he did it. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

Yes, we know it was possible through the use of that feature exploit in particular, but since all the users who did it had their characters removed or were banned, and since the exploit in particular was fixed, is not a viable option.--Fighterdoken 20:38, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Hall of Monuments

Do you have to take your character forward in order to put this in the Monument of "Honor"? I mean, I would assume so, but it would be so much more convenient if it could be displayed in the account-wide Hall without leaving Pre-Searing. --RoyHarmon 02:01, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Took me a month to test just to be sure. Answer was no (even if the HoM is set to account mode, you still need to have the char who earned the title to add it to the monument).--Fighterdoken 02:06, 16 November 2009 (UTC)


Is this title actually a spoiler? I mean, either the person knows that the Searing is, or they don't. --JonTheMon 13:56, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

It isn't referring to the title, but the title description when you hover over the title. That is clearly spoiler info. 02:44, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

ll vs. l

Because the page titled death leveling uses only one "l," it seems reasonable to maintain consistency. One "l" is correct as well as "ll," they're just British vs. American spellings. -- 06:28, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

That was a remnant from a prior change that was also reverted after some discussion. Thanks for fixing it.--Fighterdoken 06:49, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

Worth noting about the times when people got LDoA and Legendary Survivor?

I'm talking about the notorious bug that allowed someone to go to their guild hall from pre. I know of a couple people who got LDoA and Legendary Survivor. Lolwho 19:18, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

Such information may be more confusing than helpful for random users, even from a documenting point of view. After all, such bug was treated as an exploit by Anet as far as i know, and people whou got both titles had their chars removed.--Fighterdoken 20:21, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

It is possible to gain levels without doing the <Your Profession> Test

I'm doing this at the moment with my ranger. I have not done the Ranger Test. I have started no quests that give skills at the beginning. Indeed, I have no skills at all. Despite all this, I will soon achieve level 7 - and without dying once. The only quests I have done are: Message from a Friend and Gwen's Flute. I did the Message from a Friend quest because I hadn't planned to go up levels without any skills; it's something that I decided to do afterwards. I did the Gwen's Flute quest so that I can, if I wish, go out with others of my guild who have already done that quest. At the moment, however, I haven't gone out with anyone. I've achieved my levels without help from other characters. It's not that hard, really. It just takes careful choice of foes and intelligent use of the Fire Imp.

Why am I doing this? Just to see whether it can be done, that's all, but I thought it would be handy for others to know this so that they could save the experience points for later on, when it's hard to gain it. --La Visiteuse 22:04, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Environmentalists cry at this title.

The sheer amount of hours that computing resources are wasted on the server end and at the computer end make this the most environmentally unfriendly title possible. --Life Infusion «T» 03:09, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

Oh good, another reason why I should go for this title. I had been wondering whether I wanted to spend the time, but you've helped me to make my decision. Thank you very much. --La Visiteuse 12:09, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
Me too, although if the title had been "Electricity bills cry at this title" that might be different. :) Cynique 10:24, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
Ah, stuff it. I'm going for it... Cynique 22:36, 12 November 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, it's pretty bad that it uses electricity, but honestly, you could probably give the environment a net benefit if you simply just don't drive to school or to hang out with friends while you get this title. In seriousness, you've probably wasted more energy just making wrong turns while driving. L2Drive noob. -- 09:34, 30 December 2010 (UTC)


If you had a friend who is level 20 from death leveling would it be possible that you both go to north of the wall, then you shut down your computer by holding down your power button which will disconnect you but allow you to reconnect when you sign back in, so your friend can death level them, you reconnect and they leave so there is no xp split? --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:Killa slayer (talk).

No. Deathleveling a single foe takes longer than what the server will keep your connection "alive". And even if it took less, your "friend" wouldn't be able to re-spawn as long as you were still linked to the zone.--Fighterdoken 00:12, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Transfer to GW2?

Now that the HoM info is out... is there really a point in obtaining this title unless it will carry over like GWAMM. Sure one extra statue can help for those aiming for a 50/50. And bragging rights until GW2 is out. The cost in time/annoyance/electricity may be better spent on other titles (such as obtaining GWAMM as it will nearly complete that section anyway). Has anyone seen info about this from ANet? Aro User Aro Signature Logo.gif 19:16, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

I haven't been keeping up much on info related to GW2 but don't all your titles transfer?
As i said I'm not sure but i haven't seen anything that would say that only certain titles transfer. Duke Falcus 14:02, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
Only GWAMM transfers as far as i know. The rest of the titles (LDoA included) are just for filling up the count.--Fighterdoken 18:01, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

GW2 is gay, Blizzard is helping make it, making it nearly as horrible as WoW. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by User: (talk).

Clearly you never bothered with titles and mad that you have to work for all the cool loot. So you resort to trolling. Well guess what? Mike O'Brian, the founder of ArenaNet, is from Blizzard, and so are many other developers. --Floreum 06:41, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
Furst i was liek "i wonder if "the son will beat the father"",then i saw the WoW-cata. trailer, then decided to roll worgen. --NeilUser Neil2250 sig icon6.png 22:42, 12 November 2010 (UTC)
Clearly you never bothered with titles and mad that you have to work for all the cool loot. -- Clearly he doesn't have to get the hardest title in the entire game, even if he wants all the loot. I got this title, and I'm mad. I'm 50/50 with almost double the required minipets, every elite armor, all but 3 honor statues, and blah blah. I'm mad that even noobs get everything that is offered. Yes, even GWAMM is easy compared to LDoA. -- 09:38, 30 December 2010 (UTC)


After just spending a couple of hours reading this whole discussion thread, I'd just like to pay some respect to FigterDokens' contribution to the whole topic. Thanks mate! -- Sirion Shadowblade

Who did this first?

Does anybody know who got this first, and who first discovered death levelling? Cynique 22:19, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

The first person I recall and the first screen shot of someone with the title was a person named (God Antichrist) No idea if that's accurate though ;) Just what I recall from general forum reading... 22:32, 30 November 2010 (UTC)